Tavor ammo review
- Thread starter mikethebike
- Start date
Aren't all jacketed bullets bimetallic projectiles though?
Sorry, incorrect.
Bi-metal jacketing is a copper-steel alloy for bullet jacketing itself, Bi-metal jacketed bullets will cut your barrel life down to approx 1/3 to 1/4 of it's expected life.
Not all cheap ammo is bi-metal and don't be confused with metal cased ammo, this is the bullet itself that ruins the barrel.
There is a really good article in one of the Norinco ammo b!tch threads from a while back that I linked to which explains it really well.
- Location
- Aaaaaadmontin AB
Typical, as far as I am concerned. I really don't clean my shooters...I clean them once a month whether they need it or not and pretty much as a formality only. I have never seen barrel fouling in my chrome lined barrels and my piston guns have always been squeaky clean for the most part. My AR15, on the other hand...? After a month of shooting I would get carbon build up on the damn bolt components that nothing short of a wire brush and road rage would take off.
With any semi auto one of the important tasks I do at some point is run it until it starts to jam and count the rounds. It isn't exact but it is a good indicator of what your cleaning intervals should be. I haven't done this yet with my Tavor but my HK45 USP pistol will start to jam after 500 rounds - and I think that is because I burn W231 in it and that is one filthy mother&*^$# dirty powder to work with. I need to do something about that too one of these days...
I like Unique for 45auto loads, have you tried it before?
Im sorry but i read enough threads about the norinco ammo that i will never fire that in my 3000 dollar rifle, that would be profoundly stupid of me!
- Location
- Southern ontario
Pretty sure mfs has a steel core inside and is copper coated. For us with neutered mags it would take atleast 10 000 rds to notice accuracy loss
Steel in the jacket material? Never read about, or heard about such a fail. I guess it's time for me to read up on it.
ETA: looks like I will be steering clear of the dark "budget ammo" in my rifles, as a quick search netted me this:
So it's steel jacketed, with copper only thick enough to make it the color of copper.
(Yes, not all norinco is steel jacketed)
And I'm not looking for budget anyway, I'm looking for accuracy. Only accurate guns and ammo is interesting to me.
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Copper jacket over steel core is safe for your barrel and only makes holes through thicker steel that lead core.
Bi-metal jacket will take a barrel that the manufacturer claims should be good for 30000 rounds and wear it out before you get to 10000.
I'll try to find the article again and post a link.
Long story short they took 4 identical rifles and fired 10000 rounds of ammo through each one using a different ammo for each. The rifle using American Eagle went the full 10000 with no noticeable wear and only needed a couple drops of oil once in a while and the rifle running dirty ammo with bi-metal jacketing had the barrel rifling worn off to almost smooth before 7000 rounds.
Running bi-metal in an AR where the barrel can be replaced for $200 isn't a big deal but if you are running a Noveske or other high dollar rifle with a $500 barrel you may want to make sure you're not taking life out of your barrel just to save a couple dollars on ammo. This cost multiplies when running rifles like the Swiss Arms or other $3000 zone rifles where the barrels are not as easy to come by or as cheap and also require a gunsmith to install. Your few dollars saved on ammo may end up costing you $1000 if you shoot regularly.
I won't run Norinco or MFS in any of my rifles and I won't buy a used rifle from anyone that will admit to shooting it either.
I have 3 semi auto .223's and they are all worth over $2000 each so for me I'll stick to known quality ammo and get the most out of my rifles in terms of both accuracy and lifespan.
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- Location
- Southern ontario
Ok what .223 projectiles are bimetal that we have access to? I know norinco isnt
Here it is. Don't let this completely scare you away from all cheap ammo as most of the stuff we have available is not going to hurt your rifle other than you're not going to get the accuracy your rifle is capable of getting with higher quality ammo.
It's a long read but is worth it.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/brass-vs-steel-cased-ammo/
They talk about barss and steel cased ammo as well as copper and bi-metal jacketing.
It's a long read but is worth it.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/brass-vs-steel-cased-ammo/
They talk about barss and steel cased ammo as well as copper and bi-metal jacketing.
Some batches of Norinco have been reported to stick to a magnet but most do not. That is the problem with Norinco, you never know what you are getting until you open the case and look at it. Some batches have undersized projectiles and others have crap primers that puncture or fall out into your trigger group and jam it up.
I thumb through news papers every day and I can tell you that I don't believe everything I read. You should try things first hand before making a potential miss guided conclusion on something. I could tell you about how this ammo runs in a few of my high end guns but you should find it out for yourself. I'm happy with it.
And when you find out the hard way will anyone listen to you?
The whole point of sites like this is for people to share their experiences so others can learn from them.
It's great that it has gone bang for you but how many rounds of Norinco have you actually run through your "high end guns". And by run fine what do you mean? Are you getting comparable accuracy to other brands of more expensive ammo? no pierced primers, no primers falling out into your receiver, no keyholing. There have been quite a few people with quite a few different problems.
The problem most will find is that not that many people run 5000-10000 rounds a year through their rifles and those that do probably aren't running Norinco. By the time most find that their barrel life has been compromised they will have also run a few other types of ammo through which would make it hard to pinpoint the cause.
If you're running a regular AR and can replace the barrel for $200 then it really isn't much of an issue but when your high end gun needs a barrel you'll probably rethink your decision to run the cheapest ammo you can find.
How dose Norinco ammo wear out a barrel faster then a US brand? I still don't see how this can happen? The copper jacket over lead is still a copper jacket over lead... There isn't anything other then copper in the jackets, I know this because i have tested it to prove it to myself.
Your batch tested fine but not all of them have.
Like I said, you never know what your getting when you open a crate of Norinco. One guy reported getting a batch of 308AP rounds (lucky bastard). It's the inconsistency that is the problem.
- Location
- Beaverlodge, Alberta
Over the course if 10 000 rounds or more, the ammo savings on norinco over a premium brand would be enough to pay for a barrel. Norinco has it's place. If I'm doing a training course, I'm not running premium ammo.
I am very interested in this thread to see what the accuracy potential is with various types of ammo. If I am going out hunting yotes, I have to make sure my shots are accurate to ensure an ethical kill. So better quality ammo may be a better choice. But more money doesn't mean better. It'll be cool to see what this test comes up with.
But the tavor was meant to be a battle rifle. Not a bench rest baby. So for me, affordable ammo that keeps me shooting and having fun is the right kind if ammo.
I am very interested in this thread to see what the accuracy potential is with various types of ammo. If I am going out hunting yotes, I have to make sure my shots are accurate to ensure an ethical kill. So better quality ammo may be a better choice. But more money doesn't mean better. It'll be cool to see what this test comes up with.
But the tavor was meant to be a battle rifle. Not a bench rest baby. So for me, affordable ammo that keeps me shooting and having fun is the right kind if ammo.
So I'm off to the PoCo range tomorrow morning, anyone interested in trying out the ammo come and say hi, I'll be the bearded tall dude with the tuque (probably) and the elcan tavor, you can shoot the little isreali super model as well, I'll be there pretty early (before opening time) as I have a pretty busy day at the range planned tomorrow, I have to head out around 2pm though, coquitlam traffic and date night with the wife.
