Modern VARMINTER .... ?
- Thread starter wagnerb
- Start date
Neither the past or the future are what matters. If you have been a past customer of ATRS (as have I), then those transactions are over. As far as the future, nobody, especially ATRS, can know what will happen. There is no guarantee that those asking for alternate calibers will actually end up ordering one if ATRS does decide to make them available. What matters most is the present, and that means the current customers that have put down thousands of dollars in deposits for guns that they expect to be made without undue delay. What you are asking for is incredibly selfish: Basically, that ATRS should essentially ignore those who have already fronted a significant amount of money in order to devote resources into something that you may or may not order in the future.
- Location
- Edmonton, AB
My understanding is that once a particular cartridge gets a SAAMI specification, there's no real "rights" per se about that cartridge. It becomes fair game and anyone can ream a chamber in their guns. This is why for so long, you could only get the 6.5 Grendel or currently only the .50 Beowulf from Alexander Arms. AA recently released the Grendel specs to SAAMI, and it has a few people south of the border pretty happy. So from what I've learned (I actually spent tonight's shift at the bar looking it up on my smartphone) that once the creator releases the rights of a cartridge to SAAMI, it's fair game to everyone, and no longer proprietary. If the .450 Bushmaster hasn't had the rights released, then you're SOL. Ditto with the .30 Remington AR. As far as I know, 6.8 is SAAMI listed, so it's fair game, hence why you see enough guns chambered in it now.
I agree that we should be offered stripped uppers, or even DIY upper parts kits to build uppers suitable for our wants/needs as individual shooters; I'll reference the plethora of options for the AR15... if the barrels are compatible, it's easy to source whatever you want, ditto with the bolts. If the barrel extension is different which I'm led to believe it is, then sell us a kit with the stripped upper, bolt carrier and barrel extension. Let us figure out/source the rest on our own.
Rick has already flat out said no .300BLK, because he's concerned about the risk of a KB and the potential liability due to subsonic ammo from an 18.5" or longer barrel. I can agree with his reasoning for subsonic ammo, but supersonic should be fine. There are other alternatives too, like 6.8. The bolt face for 6.8 is only 43 thousands bigger in diameter, still smaller than a 7.62x39 bolt face. I know he's mentioned his concerns about bolt failures when running a larger face, but even .223 bolts have failed. I see the bolt that Stoner designed as being consumable, given the teeny little lugs. Three larger, meatier lugs would be stronger, or increasing the web for the locking lugs (similar to what KAC did with their SR15 Enhanced bolts) and would only need the corresponding change to the barrel extension. There is also the option of using a different material, but that can drive the costs of machining and tooling up even more.
Exactly what I've been saying all along. I don't want another .223. I DO want a versatile, multi-caliber gun that I can take from shooting .223 at gophers or 3-gun to a whitetail hunt by swapping uppers. Hell, I'd gladly sell the rest of my guns, even my beloved AR15 to own that gun. I had high hopes for the SIG MCX as being that gun, until the FRT came out as restricted as an AR variant.
I don't want 300 black I was just using it as an example. I'm fine with 223. Go back in the thread and see how many posts the same person has made about the same calibre. It takes one post to say what other calibre your interested in...
I wonder how the "I want this and I want it now in this caliber crowd" would have made out back in the 80's when I bought my first Black rifles? The choices were way more limited and nobody cried like a baby for something that wasn't on the limited menu.
Moe
Moe
450 has been SAMMI spec for a long time, It would appear that 30AR is as well
http://www.saami.org/pubresources/cc_drawings/Rifle/30%20Remington%20AR.pdf
Would be nice, hopefully ATRS will let us know if it can be ordered in such a manner.
BrassBandit
New member
- Location
- Bonnyville AB
They already said they are only offering complete rifles. Same goes for the modern hunter but they will sell completed uppers to people who already own a MH. Why would they want to sell you a unfinished upper so that you can then possibly #### up the non restricted status that is the sole reason for this gun existing. If I had one loudmouth customer crying about how I wouldn't get their money if I don't do x y and z with a year long back log already I would laugh in their face and tell them not to let the door hit then in the ass on the way out. And I own my own business. Not a chance would I invest any effort in satisfying the 5% that #####es the most and will most likely never be happy when I can focus my resources on the 95% that are handing me fistfulls of cash.
Great explanation. Only marginal businesses go after the 5% of customers that are almost impossible to please. ATRS is selling everything they can build right now; why seize defeat from the jaws of victory.
- Location
- Edmonton, AB
That makes life easier, then.
