10,000j OIC

Suther said:
I think the majority of the 416 or 375 cal stuff that has a hunting origin (as opposed to an ELR or tactical origin) are still legal? 375 Weatherby, 416 Ruger or Rem Mag or Rigby, 458 Win Mag and Lott, 470 NE, 505 Gibbs... I think all of those would still be classified as NR rifles under the current interpretation the RCMP has taken with regards to the OIC? You can find examples of all of these cartridges on the FRT for Non-restricted rifles, whereas the FRT was changed to prohibited for models in 460 Weatherby and 50 BMG.
Click to expand...

All firearm origins trace back to war. Let's not pretend one Rifle is not as suited for hunting as another because that is what this OIC is trying to do which is false.

I have hunted for years with many a rifle now prohibited by the OIC
 
aka_ryan said:
Might be a little off topic, but I'm always curious on how the term "adapted" is interpreted at court? Is there any case precedent available as reference? Seems the wording here is very broad too, because any firearm/receiver is "adapted" from something where something could simply be raw material.

Thanks
Click to expand...

To my knowledge, the word adapted has not been interpreted by a Canadian judge within the meaning of the firearms act.

So typically a judge would go to the dictionary, throw some personal bias into a blender, decide what they want to do vis a vis the accused and then backwards determine what adapted means. Or some other such process.

yes its broad. That is by design. The Kim Campbell Conservatives tried to outliberal the liberals and rewrote the definition of firearm to be overly broad, leaving it to the police to interpret the law so as to achieve the ability to screw whoever they wanted to screw. Don't worry, you can trust the police to get it right and to refrain from running amuck.

When the Liberals wrote the Firearms Act they couldn't think of a way to make an even more convoluted definition of Firearm, so they largely stuck with the Kim Campbell definition.

And if you really want to scratch your head, consider what can happen when you use a word in the definition of a word.

A Firearm is:
A (Whole) Firearm
B a Receiver of a Firearm, or
C anything that can be adapted to be a Firearm.

So in law, any time you see a defined word used in a sentence, you have to import the entire meaning of that word into the sentence.

Para C then becomes
Anything that can be adapted to be a whole firearm (A), anything that can be adapted to be a receiver of a firearm (B), or anything that can be adapted to be anything that can be adapted to be(C) anything that can be adapted to be ad infinitum. Which is obviously an absurdity but this is how legislation gets interpreted. Poorly written legislation always results in absurd possibilities, and until a judge waddles into the muck and pulls something out, we literally have no idea what the law says.
 
Last edited:
Brian46 said:
May of us with the 460wby, 50BMG, 416, 375, etc have a problem if the OIC is left standing.

What are "suitable" replacements? Certain Canadians were given an exemption until a "suitable replacement" could be found, so I am curious what others have found with the same performance to be considered "suitable"
Click to expand...

In rereading this post, I am mindful that the liberal government openly declared that if any suitable replacements pop up, then they would ban those too. Probably best not to help the RCMP write the next OIC list. The spineless drones from the CFP who troll this site don't need or deserve the help.
 
Suther said:
With that argument, the majority of centrefire rifles are prohibited then - As Rwilco points out above with things like barrel swaps and handloads made way too hot an extremely large percentage of guns could be prohibited under such a broad interpretation.

However, I see two major flaws with that logic - the FRT was changed on things like 460bee and 50bmg (but not 375 EnABLR or 500jeffrey), and that interpretation is clearly not in the spirit of the law (which as far as I'm aware is something judges consider?).

My interpretation is "capable of..." is used so you cannot download a cartridge like 50bmg to get around the limit. But I'm just a guy on the internet...
Click to expand...

FRT is only the opinion of staff at RCMP. A judge will decide. Supreme Court determined "capable of..." includes changes in configuration. RCMP can change their opinion now or 40 years from now & will just start charging people. This is why the various court challenges to the OIC are important.
 
Brian46 said:
All firearm origins trace back to war. Let's not pretend one Rifle is not as suited for hunting as another because that is what this OIC is trying to do which is false.

I have hunted for years with many a rifle now prohibited by the OIC
Click to expand...

I was not talking firearms, I was talking cartridges. And I wasn't agreeing with the OIC I was pointing out options that one could still walk into a gun store and buy if you can find something in stock. Like this one:

https://store.prophetriver.com/cz-4...-1-14twist-mfg-5504-5710-baeaabx-s-n-c346871/
 
Suther said:
I was not talking firearms, I was talking cartridges. And I wasn't agreeing with the OIC I was pointing out options that one could still walk into a gun store and buy if you can find something in stock. Like this one:

https://store.prophetriver.com/cz-4...-1-14twist-mfg-5504-5710-baeaabx-s-n-c346871/
Click to expand...

Just because you can buy it doesnt mean its legal or that the rcmp won't later change their mind and claim its always been illegal. Just ask anyone who bought an ATRS modern sporter on May 2nd.
 
just wondering ... is the cannon in Stanley Park still firing ? as it is prohibited by the same OIC

The 9 O'Clock Gun is a cannon located in Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada, that is ordinarily fired daily at 21:00 (9 p.m.) PT.
 
Cameron SS said:
To my knowledge, the word adapted has not been interpreted by a Canadian judge within the meaning of the firearms act.

So typically a judge would go to the dictionary, throw some personal bias into a blender, decide what they want to do vis a vis the accused and then backwards determine what adapted means. Or some other such process.

yes its broad. That is by design. The Kim Campbell Conservatives tried to outliberal the liberals and rewrote the definition of firearm to be overly broad, leaving it to the police to interpret the law so as to achieve the ability to screw whoever they wanted to screw. Don't worry, you can trust the police to get it right and to refrain from running amuck.

When the Liberals wrote the Firearms Act they couldn't think of a way to make an even more convoluted definition of Firearm, so they largely stuck with the Kim Campbell definition.

And if you really want to scratch your head, consider what can happen when you use a word in the definition of a word.

A Firearm is:
A (Whole) Firearm
B a Receiver of a Firearm, or
C anything that can be adapted to be a Firearm.

So in law, any time you see a defined word used in a sentence, you have to import the entire meaning of that word into the sentence.

Para C then becomes
Anything that can be adapted to be a whole firearm (A), anything that can be adapted to be a receiver of a firearm (B), or anything that can be adapted to be anything that can be adapted to be(C) anything that can be adapted to be ad infinitum. Which is obviously an absurdity but this is how legislation gets interpreted. Poorly written legislation always results in absurd possibilities, and until a judge waddles into the muck and pulls something out, we literally have no idea what the law says.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the thorough explanation! Sounds like infinite possibilities of getting screwed.
 
Bill Blair thinks ceremonial cannons from pre-1900 are grenade and rocket launchers. Not much thought went into wording let me tell you
 
It doesn't matter what replacement you choose. Remember, BillyB promised that if too many people buy it, he'll ban it.

As for precedent, the Hasselwander case may apply. The Supreme Court essentially ruled that if the RCMP say it's "capable", then it is.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom