308 and moose at 600m to 700m?
- Thread starter seamusm
- Start date
You might be the best shot in the world using a very powerful rifle but at 700 yds if the moose takes a step forward you have a gut shot moose. Can you hit a running moose in the vitals at 700 yds? You can at 100 yds. Lets trade our egos for some moral responsibility.
I use an old Ruger M77 All Weather MKII bolt in .300 Win Mag with the black Zytel stock.
Been using it with a RL22 and 180 grain Nosler Partition handload for elk and moose for alotta years.
I have shot 2 dozen and counting moose over 30+ years and would opt for a 7mm mag or one of the 300 mags (H&H, Win, Weatherby) at anything over 500 yds.
Just my opinion backed by a living room wall pretty well covered with bull moose racks.
" Unskilled as they are"
I would say that it surprises me to find so many hunters that are "ethically bankrupt" as they are.
Respecting the game being hunted has to come into the equation.
A little B & C for you "Hunting must involve the risk of detection and failure if there is to be any honor in having overcome the superior senses and survival instincts of the hunted. It is for this reason that sportsmen have embraced limitations so that technology does not fully overwhelm the natural capacities of the prey they pursue. This is a self-imposed trade-off that decreases the likelihood of a successful harvest, but heightens the hunting experience and shows respect for the animals being hunted."
I would say that it surprises me to find so many hunters that are "ethically bankrupt" as they are.
Respecting the game being hunted has to come into the equation.
A little B & C for you "Hunting must involve the risk of detection and failure if there is to be any honor in having overcome the superior senses and survival instincts of the hunted. It is for this reason that sportsmen have embraced limitations so that technology does not fully overwhelm the natural capacities of the prey they pursue. This is a self-imposed trade-off that decreases the likelihood of a successful harvest, but heightens the hunting experience and shows respect for the animals being hunted."
Friend of mine has a pretty snazzy bolt action in 338 Lapua (think its made by Accurate Arms) with a Schmidt & Bender scope that looks like a toilette plunger on both ends on top and I was present when he took a big bull moose on the edge of a clear cut just shy of 900 yds from a tree stand. He considers anything up to 1000 yds fair game if conditions are right. I've seen his groups at the range and pretty damn impressive and consistent. I wouldn't even think of taking a shot at that distance with that old relic of a Ruger M77 All Weather of mine (.300 Win) with the Leupold VX3 3-9x40 on top.
Like Dirty Harry said "A man's got to know his limitations" but having said that we shouldn't impose our limitations on others. There are those who can make the long shots consistently.
Like Dirty Harry said "A man's got to know his limitations" but having said that we shouldn't impose our limitations on others. There are those who can make the long shots consistently.
At a distance that renders all of the preys defensive senses and instincts useless? No honour in that, is there.
If your friend shot a big enough animal to be B & C, he would claim it I'm guessing. So the accolades from other hunters and 'The Org' that is most prominent to recognizing North American Trophies would sure be cool...probably make the trophy worth a few bucks too.
But harvesting the animal in a manner consistent with B & C's suggestions is obviously to much to ask of him?
No honour IMO. Got shoot paper or plates at that distance and I'll shake your hand...shoot an animal at that distance... nope. Expect no accolades from anyone who hunts and 'Shows respect for the animals being hunted'
I would say in defense of my friend that he uses a different skill set to fill his freezer.
Most hunters use stealth but he uses a different skill set that takes just as long if not longer to hone.
He is no stranger to leaving the AA 338 Lapua at home and grabbing his Marlin 1895 in 45-70 and tramping the bush like the rest of us.
I've seen his 405 grain Woodleigh bullets drop moose well within 100 yds.
He successfully hunts both ends of the distance spectrum.
He also bow hunts (long bow & cross bow) as do I.
And no, he doesn't leap tall building in a single bound.
Most hunters use stealth but he uses a different skill set that takes just as long if not longer to hone.
He is no stranger to leaving the AA 338 Lapua at home and grabbing his Marlin 1895 in 45-70 and tramping the bush like the rest of us.
I've seen his 405 grain Woodleigh bullets drop moose well within 100 yds.
He successfully hunts both ends of the distance spectrum.
He also bow hunts (long bow & cross bow) as do I.
And no, he doesn't leap tall building in a single bound.
I would say in defense of my friend that he uses a different skill set to fill his freezer.
Most hunters use stealth but he uses a different skill set that takes just as long if not longer to hone.
He is no stranger to leaving the AA 338 Lapua at home and grabbing his Marlin 1895 in 45-70 and tramping the bush like the rest of us.
I've seen his 405 grain Woodleigh bullets drop moose well within 100 yds.
He successfully hunts both ends of the distance spectrum.
He also bow hunts (long bow & cross bow) as do I.
And no, he doesn't leap tall building in a single bound.
So most of the time he plays fair... 'cept for Moose? Just want to get it straight.
Kinda like; "mostly I date intelligent women. but except for the times when I wheel a Gir'l from the Provincial Run Bottle Depot"
Need a different skill set for the 'Disadvantaged ones? Can throw your pick-up lines from a distance then... more of a challenge then?
Hey, mostly I go with fair chase... but if sometimes you have to take one who's senses are re-tarded...throw your pitch from a distance. All good then.
Gotcha
sillymike
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Most (not to say all) long distance shooters I've know wouldn't even try to shot.
- It's like wanting to hit a v-bull, on the first shot, with a hunting rifle... at 800 yards.
For the guys that apparently hut at these distances, do you have wind-flags all over the place?
Here is line from a song by Wheeler Walker Jr . Perfect line for this sort of a debate.
' Redneck Sh*t' " I like throwing rocks at cripples and I laugh when they get hit"
Now, to be fair, you are making a lot of assumptions here. You are assuming that he is going to try to put a big one in the Book should he kill one. And you are assuming he hunts for the same reasons as you do. Not everyone hunts for sport. Some folks legitimately hunt out of a need for meat that isn’t easily sourced elsewhere.
Perusing another forum over the weekend I was somewhat surprised to read about guys intentionally shooting animals
through the hips or wherever to set up the follow up kill shot. Some guys hunt for different reasons than others, and it is a slippery slope to try and impose your own personal ethics on others.
If someone can consistently make a 900 yard shot on a moose, and knows when conditions aren’t conducive to making the shot count, and uses a bullet appropriate to the situation then I guess that would be up to that individual to monitor themselves I guess.
Or better a 7MM Mag
Of course you are right... There's a lot of fellows that shoot 338 Lapua's ( and often enough that they can make that 1000 yards... they always say they practice lots) that can't afford to put food on the table.
Shame on me for not picking up on that.
Throwing rocks at cripples...
Shame on me for not picking up on that.
Throwing rocks at cripples...
If it's a clean, humane, legal kill and all the usable meat is harvested my standards are met.
I know a guy that makes gloves and boots out of moose hide.
He gets the skin of every one I kill.
You might have different standards that still fall within the acceptable parameters outlined above.
That's you, not me.
See now you are doing it again, making assumptions. Or you are deliberately not reading what I wrote. Personally, I would have no idea on where or how to purchase 200lbs of free range elk meat. I do know I can find it in my back field in October though. I also know that a friend of mine has a beef allergy. Elk meat doesn’t put her in the hospital, but beef will.
However, my only point was that not everyone hunts “for the chase” or “the challenge “ or to be “sportsmanlike”. And as long as that person is hunting within the law, and their capabilities then who are you to judge them
with your personal beliefs and ethics. Ethics are a highly personal thing, and not easily transferable from one person to another.
I personally think that a lot of animals are wounded at distances much less than 200 yards by guys who get hit with buck fever, or ran up a rise and fling a bullet while puffing hard and unable to steady their rifle. It isn’t necessarily a distance thing. There are a lot of factors that come into play when it comes to making shots that count.
Although I do tend to forget that everyone on cgn is a steely-eyed sharpshooter with ice in their veins, as long as the shot is under 300 metres.
