Republic of Alberta
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- ,location, location
TSX are a specialty bullet, not suited to every situation. Don't get carried away with everything you read on here from the product pushers.
.308 Bullet Weights?
- Thread starter Crazy.kayaker
- Start date
Actually, I'd consider a TSX or TTSX in a medium weight (for caliber) bulelt to be as fine an all around bullet as anything out there. They are accurate, expand easily and penetrate deeply.
I'd use a .308 loaded with 150gr TSX bullets to hunt deer/moose/elk, and never have any doubts.
- Location
- British Canuckistan
I'd say read Gatehouses threads on the TSX and TTSX and see just how true his comment about using it to shoot anything without worry.
- Location
- Edmonton, Alberta
I'd say read Gatehouses threads on the TSX and TTSX and see just how true his comment about using it to shoot anything without worry.
and yet you don't provide a link to it. Well I didn't do to bad at 25 yards with 180s till after my exploding bullet I did pretty good at 100 yards and didn't notice that my M88 had a problem with the 180 grain bullets but I still lack the shooting experience so at this point I see nothing wrong with using 180's as for teh TSX and TTSX how much do they cost?
TSX and TTSX bullets are expensive compared to simple cup and core bullets. No way around that...
Still, after an initial load work up and zeroing your rifle, how many rounds does a person shoot at game oin a year, anyway? Most people shoot les than 10 rounds per year at game, and that's abotu the price of a case of beer...
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
There is no way around it, the mid-weight TSX is a great game bullet, and Gate puts the cost into perspective if you only use the premium bullet as a game bullet. I was going to write a long explanation of why you should practice with the same bullet you hunt with, but half way through I saw that my argument didn't hold up, so I'll proceed in another direction. A practice bullet of the same weight and profile will print very close to the TSX when loaded to the same velocity. What I suggest though is that you sight in with the TSX, and occasionally shoot them to check your zero, rather than zeroing with the cheap bullet then hoping for the best with the TSX's. Sometimes hunting opportunities occur on the spur of the moment, with no time to get to the range to re-zero the rifle that is zeroed for practice rounds.
Your shooting looks pretty good to me. The M-88 I had the opportunity to use had a difficult trigger, and I never did get really good groups with it. That's going back to the early '70's, and I had lots to learn.
Keep up your shooting! The cost will pay off in the long run. Now that you have a good idea of what the rifle is capable of, shoot 3 shot groups or even timed pairs. This practice will teach you more than shooting 5 shot groups will, because you can fire more groups with the same number of rounds.
Practice with some goals in mind. Shoot against the clock. A fast pair of off hand shots starting with the rifle in the slung position at 100 yards. Snap shooting single rounds at 10 and 25 yards and pairs at 50 yards, allowing only 1.5 seconds from the signal to fire. It is beneficial to have a buddy with a stop watch and a whistle. Take your time between drills to prevent the rifle from heating up, and mix slow fire drills with rapid fire drills. Never do the same drills in the same order. Work on position shooting out as far as you intend to take game, and continue to increase the range until you can't recognize the bullet impacts as a group any more. In this way you'll know what your limits are from each position, and what you can and cannot do on demand. Practice shooting in full and half value winds, and see what effect the strength of the wind and the wind direction has on the drift of the bullet.
When you get bored with that, you can start shooting at targets set out at unknown ranges (engaging a target too far away would cost you points), try shooting moving targets, and obscured targets. A steel plate that falls down when hit gives you instant gratification, and you don't have to wait until you can check the target to see if you hit it. You can set up some pretty interesting courses of fire, and provided you have the room, your imagination is the only limiting factor.
Your shooting looks pretty good to me. The M-88 I had the opportunity to use had a difficult trigger, and I never did get really good groups with it. That's going back to the early '70's, and I had lots to learn.
Keep up your shooting! The cost will pay off in the long run. Now that you have a good idea of what the rifle is capable of, shoot 3 shot groups or even timed pairs. This practice will teach you more than shooting 5 shot groups will, because you can fire more groups with the same number of rounds.
Practice with some goals in mind. Shoot against the clock. A fast pair of off hand shots starting with the rifle in the slung position at 100 yards. Snap shooting single rounds at 10 and 25 yards and pairs at 50 yards, allowing only 1.5 seconds from the signal to fire. It is beneficial to have a buddy with a stop watch and a whistle. Take your time between drills to prevent the rifle from heating up, and mix slow fire drills with rapid fire drills. Never do the same drills in the same order. Work on position shooting out as far as you intend to take game, and continue to increase the range until you can't recognize the bullet impacts as a group any more. In this way you'll know what your limits are from each position, and what you can and cannot do on demand. Practice shooting in full and half value winds, and see what effect the strength of the wind and the wind direction has on the drift of the bullet.
When you get bored with that, you can start shooting at targets set out at unknown ranges (engaging a target too far away would cost you points), try shooting moving targets, and obscured targets. A steel plate that falls down when hit gives you instant gratification, and you don't have to wait until you can check the target to see if you hit it. You can set up some pretty interesting courses of fire, and provided you have the room, your imagination is the only limiting factor.
Republic of Alberta
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- ,location, location
I'd say read Gatehouses threads on the TSX and TTSX and see just how true his comment about using it to shoot anything without worry.
Thanx but I have used it on game and seen them used by another on game and they are not a miracle bullet. They provide deep penetration but do so with huge sacrifice in wound diameter. Wound channels (where no bone other than ribs are hit) are similar to what you get with very low velocity impacts like those form long distance shots or form a 30-30, even a 2 blade broad head. There is also much less visual and audible indication of a "hit".
They kill game by putting a hole right through them and out the other side so YA they are "good". But there are other bullets that will do the same thing and the hole will be 4x bigger, and the explosive force can quite often be enough to be seen and heard.
Your shooting an expanding solid, you have to remember that. Once the short petals blow back (which happens immediately, and that's the problem) all you have is a flat nosed solid for the rest of the length of the wound.
Only the biggest idiots on the board will try to convince someone that a flat nosed solid will have a greater wound diameter than a bullet that is expanding ( both at the same velocity).
Well, I guess everyone will have to find out for themselves. I've never used anything but cup n' core in the past on game. I'm going to try the TSX to see if there is a difference, but mainly will use them because I can go to a lighter bullet weight and have the same effect. (maybe.)
)As you have recognized,bullet placement is everything.Having done that, the choice between a 150 and 165 gr bullet for deer is largely a rhetorical discussion.If shooting at longer range a 165gr will hold up better in the wind.I like to hunt deer, rather than shoot at them,so most of my shot opportunities come at less than 100 yds-even out on the lone prairie.And you don't need a premium bullet for deer.I've shot them with all of conventional Sierra,Nosler,and Hornady 150/165gr bullets.These bullets are accurate and effective.It's just a matter of developing the right load for your rifle and then being able to place your shot under hunting conditions.
- Location
- Edmonton, Alberta
WOW never would have thought of that, good advice and thank you.
My M88 has no slack in the trigger and you don't have to pull it all the way back for it to fire.
I'm actually making a target stand so I can shoot at different distances. I will have to try the different positions and quick shooting from a stand and just after I stopped walking with it slung so I learn to control my breathing and such. I have lots to learn and try out still and hope I'm up to the challenge. But I am limited in room to do stuff like this so I guess I'll have to find some decommissioned FSR I can set up on. Anyone in Kamloops that knows of a place you can set up a target obstacle to try this out at?
I have every intention of doing lots of shooting as I want to go hunting this year but only if I'm sure I'll hit my target with a killing shot so far I know I'll hit it just not if I'll make a killing shot. I also shoot groups of 5 as my magazine holds 4 (5 but I can't fit the magazine back in properly) and one in the pipe. So I will start doing the 3 round groupings next time out. I just now need to find some work to pay the cost of ammunition (sick 3+ years with no idea whats wrong with me).
Going up to Wholesales Sports outfitters to try for work....at the gun counter or camping so wish me luck.
Now about the TSX bullet for using as a hunting round I plan on getting some to try out. I see that the 150 is recommended the most and that they will take down Deer, Elk, Moose. What about bear? Would the 150 TSX be enough to bring down Yogi if I decided to hunt one? Or need to protect myself from an irate Yogi? Though I plan on using the cheap WSX rounds till I can make a clover leaf or better every time I go shooting.
I'm open to trying out every kind of bullet recommended at least once to see how well it shoots and the damage it will cause to a pile of phone books, so please mention what you shoot so I can try it out.
I can't wait till my .22 arrives so I can practice shooting 10 times as much for a fraction of the cost. But I will still use the M88 to keep my skills current.
C.K
My M88 has no slack in the trigger and you don't have to pull it all the way back for it to fire.
I'm actually making a target stand so I can shoot at different distances. I will have to try the different positions and quick shooting from a stand and just after I stopped walking with it slung so I learn to control my breathing and such. I have lots to learn and try out still and hope I'm up to the challenge. But I am limited in room to do stuff like this so I guess I'll have to find some decommissioned FSR I can set up on. Anyone in Kamloops that knows of a place you can set up a target obstacle to try this out at?
I have every intention of doing lots of shooting as I want to go hunting this year but only if I'm sure I'll hit my target with a killing shot so far I know I'll hit it just not if I'll make a killing shot. I also shoot groups of 5 as my magazine holds 4 (5 but I can't fit the magazine back in properly) and one in the pipe. So I will start doing the 3 round groupings next time out. I just now need to find some work to pay the cost of ammunition (sick 3+ years with no idea whats wrong with me).
Going up to Wholesales Sports outfitters to try for work....at the gun counter or camping so wish me luck.
Now about the TSX bullet for using as a hunting round I plan on getting some to try out. I see that the 150 is recommended the most and that they will take down Deer, Elk, Moose. What about bear? Would the 150 TSX be enough to bring down Yogi if I decided to hunt one? Or need to protect myself from an irate Yogi? Though I plan on using the cheap WSX rounds till I can make a clover leaf or better every time I go shooting.
Is there a specific brand or just try some out till I find one my gun likes the most?
I'm open to trying out every kind of bullet recommended at least once to see how well it shoots and the damage it will cause to a pile of phone books, so please mention what you shoot so I can try it out.
I can't wait till my .22 arrives so I can practice shooting 10 times as much for a fraction of the cost. But I will still use the M88 to keep my skills current.
C.K
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- Location
- The Conservative part of Ontario
Well, now we know who to go to for bargains!
Best of luck.
The 150 TSX would be a great bear bullet, no worries.
I keep getting impressed with the TSX bullets. Do tonnes of internal damage, but keep penetrating, and drops animals fast.
Last fall my buddy and I used 3 180gr TSX bullets to kill 3 deer,all of them dropped in their tracks. A few years ago I watched my buddy drill a grizzly through both shoulders, dropping him right there. he used a 160gr X bullet from a 7RM.
Like I said, these bullets are great all around bullets....
The TSX is a great bullet, but it's long for its weight, so you have to be careful about having enough twist in your barrel. What's the twist rate of your barrel?
If it's:
1:14 - 150gr.
1:12 - 165gr
1:11 - 180gr
1:10 - you could go with the 200gr
Of course if it shoots well, then the twist rate is irrelevant, but you'd be prudent (as always) to sight it in at all the ranges you might shoot at in the field.
If it's:
1:14 - 150gr.
1:12 - 165gr
1:11 - 180gr
1:10 - you could go with the 200gr
Of course if it shoots well, then the twist rate is irrelevant, but you'd be prudent (as always) to sight it in at all the ranges you might shoot at in the field.
- Location
- Edmonton, Alberta
Look what I made to kill the time and make my shooting safer...FOR ME!
Just made this took me just over two hours but a good hour was spent looking for the 1/2" drill bit. Ended up borrowing a neighbors 1/2" wood drill bit.
This it assembled
and this is dissembled
Takes 2 minutes to set up and cost me $45 bucks in parts most was the 12" pins and eye bolts at the front and the two hinges in behind. No more wondering if I'm gonna get a face full of lead YAY.
I've been looking for my M88's twist rate for 2 days now along with an owners manual but no luck I included a search using Torrent websites for downloads. Winchesters website only had trophy pictures that have an M88 in it no actual information that's usable. I only know it has a 22 inch barrel and shoots .308 bullets. If anyone knows more please PM me with what you know, I'm starting to get a little desperate. Thanks
You wish and thanks I need it spent the last few years unemployed due to health issues but need money so I sent it by email as they are closed on Sunday's here. I am going up tomorrow to drop another off in person but till then I just get to plan on building a rifle rest for my guns out of wood, and plan on shooting at targets with my target stand in a few hours.
Gonna use the rest of my 180's and my 150's WSX.
C.K
Just made this took me just over two hours but a good hour was spent looking for the 1/2" drill bit. Ended up borrowing a neighbors 1/2" wood drill bit.
This it assembled
and this is dissembled
Takes 2 minutes to set up and cost me $45 bucks in parts most was the 12" pins and eye bolts at the front and the two hinges in behind. No more wondering if I'm gonna get a face full of lead YAY.
I've been looking for my M88's twist rate for 2 days now along with an owners manual but no luck I included a search using Torrent websites for downloads. Winchesters website only had trophy pictures that have an M88 in it no actual information that's usable. I only know it has a 22 inch barrel and shoots .308 bullets. If anyone knows more please PM me with what you know, I'm starting to get a little desperate. Thanks
You wish
and thanks I need it spent the last few years unemployed due to health issues but need money so I sent it by email as they are closed on Sunday's here. I am going up tomorrow to drop another off in person but till then I just get to plan on building a rifle rest for my guns out of wood, and plan on shooting at targets with my target stand in a few hours.Gonna use the rest of my 180's and my 150's WSX.
C.K
- Location
- Saskatchewan
I used a .308 for years as my primary big game rifle. Used mostly cup and core 150's for deer, 180 gr. partitions for elk and moose. Now I use 165's for everything, cheaper cup and core bullets for practise and deer and premiums for the big stuff.
One advantage of going with the mid weight bullets for everything is that you only need to get used to one trajectory, and don't need to re-sight when you switch bullet style.
That said, last year I bought a 200 round case of Federal blue box 150's because they were very cheap - I got the case from SIR in Winnipeg, shipped to my door here in SK for $14 per box. Practised a bunch, and then I shot 6 deer with them, they worked very well. You might want to try those cheap Federal loads if they are still available.
One advantage of going with the mid weight bullets for everything is that you only need to get used to one trajectory, and don't need to re-sight when you switch bullet style.
That said, last year I bought a 200 round case of Federal blue box 150's because they were very cheap - I got the case from SIR in Winnipeg, shipped to my door here in SK for $14 per box. Practised a bunch, and then I shot 6 deer with them, they worked very well. You might want to try those cheap Federal loads if they are still available.
migrant hunter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Southern Alberta
x2, I used Federal before I started loading everything and found it to be pretty good as factory ammo goes. I shot some old stuff(Classic/blue box)off just to get the brass in the last couple of days and was quite pleased with the groups.
- Location
- Edmonton, Alberta
When I went shooting at Heffley Gun Club on Friday I got some federal 150 Game shok and some Remington 150 Core lock as I can't find 165 its always sold out. But I also brought up a box of WSX 150's and I'll be paying that extra $1.50 for the Federal as its a world of difference between the Federal, Remington and the cheap WSX I'm still looking for the 165 grain .308's and I have checked out CT but they don't carry 165 in .308 by anyone WSS has been sold out the last three times I looked gonna have to check out the other CT up the hill along with WAL-MART.
