308s worth buying?
- Thread starter Coleith
- Start date
You're a bit late to this argument. It's like finding a Guns & Ammo magazine in grandpa's closet while you're moving him to the nursing home.
A " 308" launches a bullet at a specific speed and the fact it was a "308" matters little once the projectile clears the barrel. From a hunting perspective, what matters is bullet construction, trajectory, bullet placement, and impact velocity. Talking about "is 308 as good as x" is meaningless without discussing all the rest.
I had wondered occasionally why anyone bought 308 chambered rifles when 30-06 was already there, but i don't dwell on it.
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Sitting in my barbers chair in Wainwright years ago and he tells me he shot at a deer with his 308 and hit it perfectly and it ran away alive. His fix was to use his 300 WM instead and never touch to 308 again. I had to sit there and grit my teeth . I wanted him to ask him what was next if he lost a deer with that a 20mm .
When I was in the Seven Oaks Junior Rifle Club in Winterpeg, in the mid-1960s, our Safety Instructor told us about a grizzly he'd shot. The bear was looking in his direction, and he shot it in the head - which, with a lotta bone and quite a slope, bounced off, leaving quite a furrow in the head. The bear fell back over the embankment, and when (I forget his name) went to see what happened, the bear was at the bottom of a not-too-big embankment, shaking its head and looking snarly - so he got the heck outta there... (didn't say why he didn't have another shot at the body) I believe it was a .308. But... historically, the "lowly" lever action .30-30 has probably taken more game than a lot of other cartridges.
Ain't nothing wrong with a .308 at the ranges most people will hunt. A normal load with a 150 or 155 grain bullet is still supersonic at 1000 yards when we're target shooting, so shooting a moose or a deer at, say, 200 yards (or metres) is a matter of shot placement.
Ain't nothing wrong with a .308 at the ranges most people will hunt. A normal load with a 150 or 155 grain bullet is still supersonic at 1000 yards when we're target shooting, so shooting a moose or a deer at, say, 200 yards (or metres) is a matter of shot placement.
Dont fall into " what ever is newest is better" 308 is all you need if you know your game. Turkey hunting season, I picked up a turkey call. While I was waiting I saw a new hunter eyeing the ultra expensive "turkey loads" Just saying... we extinct turkeys in my area with black powder guns and bows.
You will get your answer once you are confronted by an angry Grizzly sow with cubs.
Pointdexter
CGN Regular
- Location
- Lower Mainland
Canadian rangers are issued bolt action 308's and their issued ammunition (when they're not using store bought stuff) is a 180gr nosler accubond going at roughly 2500- 2550fps.
I think most of it though boils down to an appropriate sized bullet and its contruction, firearm skills, ability confidence, and a level head.
I think most of it though boils down to an appropriate sized bullet and its contruction, firearm skills, ability confidence, and a level head.
I'm just a target shooter at the local range. I finally picked up a Lee Enfield DCRA rifle in 7.62x51. It looks good beside my 303 rifles, both LE and Ross. I have some commercial ammo for both, but mostly I reload using the lead bullets I cast as target loads with 25 grains of D4198. Reduced loads to relieve the pressure on my tired ole shoulder bones.
I use 308 on all my muskox, no issue. I wouldn’t hesitate using it on a polar bear either which are also around where I live.
1riot1ranger
CGN Regular
- Location
- Calgary, AB
There's no cartridge in the world that doesn't require the hunter/marksman to have some skill and the ability to place the shot in a vital zone. Some cartridges offer the advantage of being "flatter" than others. Some deliver more terminal energy than others.
The chief advantages of the .308 are:
1) wide availability of platforms/rifles
2) ammunition is easy to access
3) with proper shot placement, almost nothing on 4 legs (in North America) is beyond the capability of the cartridge
4) Inexpensive access to "surplus" ammunition
I'm a huge advocate for marksmanship in hunting. You need to understand your "circular error probable". I.e. your ability to hit the vital zone of an animal at whatever range. I've met some hunters who are excellent shots (my dad, for example) and others (my dad's friend Gary) who can't hit an 8" plate at 200 yards.
The biggest advantage of the .308 over, say, Weatherby ammo, is that if you don't handload, the access to inexpensive practice ammunition is reasonable. You can, with only a small investment, develop your skills and build competencies to hit that "vital zone" at whatever range you are competent at. And build out that range and your competency.
The Tikka T3X Compact Lite is one of my favourite rifles. I think it's an exceptional platform that's affordable and very "customizable". I've got one and have been working on building it out into a new, modern "General Purpose" or "Scout" Rifle. (Note: I also have a Steyr Scout in .308. Bought it years ago, and I think the Tikka rivals it in most respects. Light, accurate, great trigger and half the price of the Steyr.)
There may be cartridges that are "superior" to the .308 in terms of lethality and "flatness", but none of them can touch the .308 in terms of affordability and accessibility. "Practice makes perfect," and that's why I love the .308. The affordability of practice.
The chief advantages of the .308 are:
1) wide availability of platforms/rifles
2) ammunition is easy to access
3) with proper shot placement, almost nothing on 4 legs (in North America) is beyond the capability of the cartridge
4) Inexpensive access to "surplus" ammunition
I'm a huge advocate for marksmanship in hunting. You need to understand your "circular error probable". I.e. your ability to hit the vital zone of an animal at whatever range. I've met some hunters who are excellent shots (my dad, for example) and others (my dad's friend Gary) who can't hit an 8" plate at 200 yards.
The biggest advantage of the .308 over, say, Weatherby ammo, is that if you don't handload, the access to inexpensive practice ammunition is reasonable. You can, with only a small investment, develop your skills and build competencies to hit that "vital zone" at whatever range you are competent at. And build out that range and your competency.
The Tikka T3X Compact Lite is one of my favourite rifles. I think it's an exceptional platform that's affordable and very "customizable". I've got one and have been working on building it out into a new, modern "General Purpose" or "Scout" Rifle. (Note: I also have a Steyr Scout in .308. Bought it years ago, and I think the Tikka rivals it in most respects. Light, accurate, great trigger and half the price of the Steyr.)
There may be cartridges that are "superior" to the .308 in terms of lethality and "flatness", but none of them can touch the .308 in terms of affordability and accessibility. "Practice makes perfect," and that's why I love the .308. The affordability of practice.
This is a perfect summary. Its excellent for hunting, and excellent in general. But the fact that there is superior hunting cartridges performance wise cant be denied.
100% Marksmanship beats paper stats in the real world.
A 7mm RUM has more capability than a .308, but I can shoot .308 accurately from field expedient positions more reliably than I can 7mm RUM.
I think firearms forums tend to get excessively caught-up in paper stats, and forget that sitting at a bench on the range is not like shooting from the standing position in the real world. Even prone with a sandbag/backpack is vastly different from a bench.
- Location
- Delta B.C.
Two posts and stirring the pot... No... it's not anymore... so much more can be accomplished with other cartridges..
Will it work? Yes.. depending as with anything on size and placement.. but it's old and outdated for hunting and is borderline as an ethical cartridge in many cases.. There's a big difference between paper and furball at 300 and you haven't said what you hunt and how far you shoot them at. The 7rem mag you mention is far more capable than the 308 so you already know the truth. There are guides that won't let you shoot several species in North America with it as well as regulations that don't allow it.. Simply not enough energy for the big stuff. The 30-06 is capable with heavy rounds but the 308win doesn't meet the regs. for Bison in BC. You may be able to handload something to produce the required energy, but factory loads won't cut mustard. Handloads are unproven energy values so even if you did manage to make it perform like superman it wouldn't be legal technically. You should come out west and see what a big critter looks like. Cheers
300PRC and it stands there wagging it's tail and taking a dump after two shots in the lungs.. sits down then gets back up before a third shot in the boiler.
Will it work? Yes.. depending as with anything on size and placement.. but it's old and outdated for hunting and is borderline as an ethical cartridge in many cases.. There's a big difference between paper and furball at 300 and you haven't said what you hunt and how far you shoot them at. The 7rem mag you mention is far more capable than the 308 so you already know the truth. There are guides that won't let you shoot several species in North America with it as well as regulations that don't allow it.. Simply not enough energy for the big stuff. The 30-06 is capable with heavy rounds but the 308win doesn't meet the regs. for Bison in BC. You may be able to handload something to produce the required energy, but factory loads won't cut mustard. Handloads are unproven energy values so even if you did manage to make it perform like superman it wouldn't be legal technically. You should come out west and see what a big critter looks like. Cheers
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The question was never about .308 being the best for exotic game... It was can it do it "efficiently"? The answer is yes. .308 rounds are cheaper, so getting closer, and getting the perfect shot is on the whole more efficient than spending more money on rounds to get good at taking marginal shots.
If a guy is on here asking about if .308 is enough, they likely aren't seriously looking at Bison, or Muskox... It's more likely they're starting out, and want a "do it all" round to save money... The poor bugger.
We all started with a "do it all", and now have a closet/cabinet full of guns for every scenario/prey.
- Location
- Delta B.C.
Cheers.. I get ya.. but he said he could do any game in North America with it.. simply no you can't.. There are tons of other choices and he mentions them..
I'm saying don't show up at a party with a six pack of Coors light...
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1riot1ranger
CGN Regular
- Location
- Calgary, AB
Not denying that - just highlighting that most of the "superior" cartridges/calibers are expensive and a detriment to practice because of price point. It's *practice* that makes one a skilled hunter and marksman. No caliber/cartridge in the world will kill an animal if you miss. Not missing the vital zone on the first round is key to ethically harvesting an animal.
Agreed, u summarized that well in your first post as well.
