338 Win Mag vs 338 Lapua Mag
- Thread starter AlexF
- Start date
They should be believe me, what I said, happened. The batch of ammo I used chroney'ed slow. I bought it from Italian Sporting Goods (I think) in Vancouver quite a while ago (at least 10 years). The chroney gives me good info on every other caliber I try it on, and I periodically run 22 LR match ammo across it to check it. Now, I'm glad that the ammo you're bringing in matches what Lapua claims. As I said, either I got a slow batch, or it's my rifle, or Lapua changed something in the interim. That doesn't change what I observed. Your milage may vary. - dan
Lapua is probably the best brass available and many competitive shooters won't use a caliber were cases cannot be created from Lapua brass but propellant can be very sensitive to environmental conditions!
Ball propellant can be terrible and even IMR-4064 is not used in the latest 7.62NATO long range ammo since it's temperature sensitive.
It can really make a huge difference:
http://www.hodgdon.com/smokeless/extreme/page2.php#top
Add up all the variations and you end up with a huge velocity spread,
Alex
Ball propellant can be terrible and even IMR-4064 is not used in the latest 7.62NATO long range ammo since it's temperature sensitive.
It can really make a huge difference:
http://www.hodgdon.com/smokeless/extreme/page2.php#top
Add up all the variations and you end up with a huge velocity spread,
Alex
Dan, no .338LM ammo imported into Canada ever produced such low velocity regardless of what your chronograph advises on that day. None ever teted by Lapua or in the world was even close to those low specs. This is fact and now we are beating dead horse.
Well, that's not exactly so. 338 Lapua 250 grain ammunition (hunting ammunition) I shot in 1992 or 93 did just under 2800. This was out of what may have been the first 338 Lapua in Canada (I was told it was the first). I was unimpressed. I have not shot any recently produced ammo and will likely never do so but I'm just saying... Regards, Bill
So there's at least two of us that had "slow" 250 gr Lapua ammo. Good to know. - dan
LongBomber
CGN Regular
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I think you guys should armwrestle over 150fps.. that will tell who is actually right!! 
I am not/will not get sucked in to ballistic gack conversation about what round performs better, or argue about a box of 10 year ammo, and a 10 year old memory, with regards to performance of a certain round. Everything we know, all of us, about shooting at distance dictates that the heavier bullet, at similar speed, will outperform the smaller bullet. Why are we even trying to compare 250 grain bullets to 180 grain bullets? I know the performance range is slight, and the rest is just gack. The basic questions remains the same. If I launch a 180 grain LD bullet at 3000 fps, and a 250 LD grain bullet at 3000
fps, which one will perform better at distance? Why, the 250 grain bullet of course. No argument.
The fact is, that Lapua brass far outlasts any other brand of brass availible, in any given calibre. The facts are, that if you want to launch 250 and 300 grain bullets fast, the .338Lapua is the only clear choice. If you want to talk custom rounds, then AI the Lapua brass, it is still the clear choice.
If you want economics and cheapness to enter the conversation, have at it, and bicker about what costs less, and why. There is a reason you don't see Yugo cars compete in Formula One.
R.
fps, which one will perform better at distance? Why, the 250 grain bullet of course. No argument.
The fact is, that Lapua brass far outlasts any other brand of brass availible, in any given calibre. The facts are, that if you want to launch 250 and 300 grain bullets fast, the .338Lapua is the only clear choice. If you want to talk custom rounds, then AI the Lapua brass, it is still the clear choice.
If you want economics and cheapness to enter the conversation, have at it, and bicker about what costs less, and why. There is a reason you don't see Yugo cars compete in Formula One.
R.
It's not about the velocity difference. We have threads on here every week about the "massive superiority of the 280 vs the 270" etc, etc. Hell, half the ballistic data we talk about is of the "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin" genre. I related my experience and data that I observed, and was told that what I saw couldn't possibly happen. I take that as a slightly nicer version of calling me a liar. Hence the follow up posts. FWIW - dan
Truth be known, there is much marketing hype and pure bs in this world. It is all designed to part a man from his money. It is very important to investigate and discover with one's own eyes. I have never used Lapua ammunition and thus, cannot comment about it.
I've started this mad thread by posting a pretty simple question: Can 338 Win Mag shoot accurately at long range?
The other point is that 338 Win Mag will drive a 250 SMK at aroud 2750 (26-27inch barrel) while the 338 Lapua Mag will reach at around 3000fps.
This means 68" of wind drift (10 mph wind) and 1250 ft-pounds for 338 Win Mag versus 59" of wind drift and 1573 ft-pounds.
The only catch with the 338 calibers is hefty recoil (mostly square of bullet weight
) and higher bullet price (proportional to bullet weight).
I completely agree that 338 Lapua Mag is better than 338 Win Mag for long range shooting but my point is that if 338 Win Mag is accurate at long range, the anyone can get a superb long range rifle at a reasonable price.
Most shooters have to be reasonable with their money and it think that 5$ to 7$ match rifle round is expensive,
Alex
The other point is that 338 Win Mag will drive a 250 SMK at aroud 2750 (26-27inch barrel) while the 338 Lapua Mag will reach at around 3000fps.
This means 68" of wind drift (10 mph wind) and 1250 ft-pounds for 338 Win Mag versus 59" of wind drift and 1573 ft-pounds.
The only catch with the 338 calibers is hefty recoil (mostly square of bullet weight
) and higher bullet price (proportional to bullet weight).I completely agree that 338 Lapua Mag is better than 338 Win Mag for long range shooting but my point is that if 338 Win Mag is accurate at long range, the anyone can get a superb long range rifle at a reasonable price.
Most shooters have to be reasonable with their money and it think that 5$ to 7$ match rifle round is expensive,
Alex
Heavy Edit on this Post.
Alex, the .338WM is a very capable long range round. I have a burned out barrel on a sporter rifle to prove it. Why? Because it was all I had at the time. I have moved on to, what I consider, better things, as most will, in time.
Truth be told, almost any round, and rifle configuration, can be capable at long distance, and this has been proven over and over again. The 375 H&H comes to mind, as do many of the others mentioned on this thread. Mount a turret adjustable scope on most anything decent, and you can shoot and kill at distances well over 500 yards. The most specialized equipment for doing this, is between your ears.
Another truth is looking at and quoting energy numbers. They don't mean anything, so stop looking at them and quoting them. Look at the velocity numbers instead, they mean way more.
Recoil can be mitigated in two ways, one can add weight, or twist on a brake. This helps you shoot more, flinch less, and become more accurate. When done correctly, big boomers kick no more, or less, than little boomers. If one is concerned about costs, and looks, and noise, and all of the other bad things that come with a brake, then add weight. It is also cheaper for the shooter with money on his mind, which seems happen here quite a bit.
As far as purchasing ammo is concerned, most serious long range shooters would just not do this, as it is not fiscally responsible, or possible. It takes a lot of rounds to become consistently accurate at distance (again, over 500 yards) and, as I personally found out last year, there are no shortcuts, and no substitutes for practice.
Bottom line, invest your shooting dollars with a mind to the future, and become proficient with what you have, no matter what it is. Buy the most LR scope you can afford, and slap it on the rifle you have. Go out and shoot, and shoot some more. It isn't rocket science voodoo witchcraft, but it is an expensive hobby. It is a lot like racing cars, if you wanna go fast, you gotta spend money. If you wanna shoot more and more accurately, and constantly improve, you gotta spend money. Get to reloading, as it costs less that buying ammo, and the more you do it, the cheaper it gets.
And God knows, on these forums, it always seems to be about cheap.
R.
Alex, the .338WM is a very capable long range round. I have a burned out barrel on a sporter rifle to prove it. Why? Because it was all I had at the time. I have moved on to, what I consider, better things, as most will, in time.
Truth be told, almost any round, and rifle configuration, can be capable at long distance, and this has been proven over and over again. The 375 H&H comes to mind, as do many of the others mentioned on this thread. Mount a turret adjustable scope on most anything decent, and you can shoot and kill at distances well over 500 yards. The most specialized equipment for doing this, is between your ears.
Another truth is looking at and quoting energy numbers. They don't mean anything, so stop looking at them and quoting them. Look at the velocity numbers instead, they mean way more.
Recoil can be mitigated in two ways, one can add weight, or twist on a brake. This helps you shoot more, flinch less, and become more accurate. When done correctly, big boomers kick no more, or less, than little boomers. If one is concerned about costs, and looks, and noise, and all of the other bad things that come with a brake, then add weight. It is also cheaper for the shooter with money on his mind, which seems happen here quite a bit.
As far as purchasing ammo is concerned, most serious long range shooters would just not do this, as it is not fiscally responsible, or possible. It takes a lot of rounds to become consistently accurate at distance (again, over 500 yards) and, as I personally found out last year, there are no shortcuts, and no substitutes for practice.
Bottom line, invest your shooting dollars with a mind to the future, and become proficient with what you have, no matter what it is. Buy the most LR scope you can afford, and slap it on the rifle you have. Go out and shoot, and shoot some more. It isn't rocket science voodoo witchcraft, but it is an expensive hobby. It is a lot like racing cars, if you wanna go fast, you gotta spend money. If you wanna shoot more and more accurately, and constantly improve, you gotta spend money. Get to reloading, as it costs less that buying ammo, and the more you do it, the cheaper it gets.
And God knows, on these forums, it always seems to be about cheap.
R.
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