358 win build worth it?

I did make up some loads with the 225 gr NP and Barnes TSX in my 358, and they did shoot well, 1.2" and 1.1" groups at 100 yards respectively (sorry, did not get to chrony those loads for actual velocity in my 20" barrel). The Speer was just a touch more accurate.
With their higher BC's and slightly better SD, they too would be excellent big game performers.

A friend's newer BLR in 358 was about the most accurate I have seen to date, it would put three 200 gr TSX's into 1/3" groups!

As to other BLR's performing well, a few years ago, one of the gun writers wrote an article on the BLR T/D in 300 WSM that he used to take a mountain goat at a measured 602 yards.
While that is a far poke for a rifle with a 20" barrel, and further than I would choose to shoot at an unwounded game animal, it goes to show that these rifles do not handicap a hunter in the field at longer distances, and are capaable of good accuracy.
 
hoytcanon said:
That would have been a very cool thing to do... I have done it a few times with arrows and broadheads... in 1995, I took a black bear, whitetail buck and bull moose with the same arrow and broadhead... but it would be extremely rare to do that with a bullet... makes me wonder if anyone on here has done it???
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Not myself but one of my mentors who preferred cast lead and his .35 Remington did something similar. Shot a spring bear, recovered the bullet, recast it killed his whitetail with it and added it the pot for shot that was loaded and killed ducks and ruffed grouse. Not sure if it quite qualifies particularly since a bit more lead was added each time.
Cast bullets do seem to begin working better on game in .35 caliber and larger bores, haven't played with cast much myself though.

SuperCub has a point, with modern bullets for North American game a .308 and .358 Winchester with similarly constructed bullets would be very hard to tell the difference. Of course the 7mm08 and a similar 140-160 grain bullet would probably be pretty hard to tell apart too, and have less recoil and cheaper projectiles for a handloader. Add a fast twist .22 and suitable bullets and anything smaller isn't really needed, there we go a switch barrel Savage with a 1-8 twist .22-250 barrel and a 7mm-08 could handle everything in NA other than some bison regulations so you might as well keep either the .358 Winchester or 338 Federal, look at that I just talked the medium bores into being practical again.:dancingbanana:
 
Not too sure where I read the article that addressed the 35 Whelen but most know it's a necked up 30-06 case to 35 caliber. However as I recall, in the article, it was noted that the 35 Whelen was producing it's ideal (or close to it's best) performance with a 24 inch barrel. The ballistic studies that accompanied this article demonstrated these attributes through the use of a chronograph. So without going into all of those details from the article... it's good to know what can be done with the choice of barrel length and specific load characteristics when one desires best case scenario performance.

Now if one wanted to build a rifle with the best performance in mind then barrel length plays an important role in achieving this type of ideal performance. Personally, if I was looking at the 35 Whelen I would use a 24 inch barrel. And with the exception that the 308 is the parent case for the 338 Federal and 358 Winchester, they are not too much different from the cartridges that came from the 30-06 case family of cartridges. Slightly less powerful but close enough to be used in similar circumstances. So there are also similar considerations when one is choosing an application that could provide a full potential of these cartridges from the 308 family...

For a 338 I'd probably use a 200 grain bullet. The reason being is that I don't want a bullet that is too short, nor too heavy. Otherwise I'd stick with a 308 and 180 (or less) grain bullet. And with the 358 Winchester I'd probably use a 220 or 225 grain weight bullet over the 250 grain bullet. Because I don't want a bullet that is too short or too heavy. The reason would be due to the powder charge capacity of the case. For a barrel length on a 338 Federal or 358 Winchester I wouldn't be too inclined to choose a short 20 inch barrel - because I'd rather wring out a bit more performance from a 23 inch long barrel. Sorta like a 300 WSM barrel length that is most typically found on browning rifles in the WSM cartridge family.

And, I wouldn't sneer at a 24 inch barrel for the 338 Federal or 358 Winchester either. But I doubt that I'd go longer. My most important factors to consider may be small to others but I wouldn't over look them. These are: 1. Increased velocity, 2. Reduced muzzle rise; and 3. Possibly more accuracy. These are not always a given, as I realize that a larger diameter bull ot target barrel can achieve some of these factors too.

Rather, I am thinking about a hunting rifle with a sporter contour barrel diameter. If we revisit the SAVAGE model 99 lever rifles with the 300 Savage cartridge bullet - these rifles were often found with a 24 inch barrel. And the reason noted above were the reasons the Savage 99 was built to these specifications. Overall the design of the Savage 99 had it right early on. And I'd prefer to shoot the Model 99 with a 24 inch barrel over a 20 inch barrel because a I don't worry too much about an extra 8 ounces for a longer barrel as I want to utilize the potential that that extra barrel length offers.

On another note, I always thought that the Browning BLR would benefit from a couple more inches of barrel length. But if one wants something short for the convenience of a reduction in overall weight or length - that's ok. But it's worth studying the possibilities so one knows what they will end up with after important decisions are made.
 
Yes it’s worth it I had a bolt action one built two years ago it’s my go to rifle. I also have three lever actions in this caliber
 
As far as barrel length goes, I have had .358 Win's in the M77 MKII with 22" R, 20" FS Carbine, 16.5" Frontier and currently the 18.5" International... on target, I don't think the difference amounts to a "hill of beans," I wouldn't overthink the barrel length... and personally place handling over velocity when it comes to this cartridge.
 
If I were building a bolt action in 338 Federal or 358 Win, I would choose a 22" barrel as minimum, or a 24" barrel as maximum (so the 23" length as a compromise has merit!LOL). The balance of the rifle would be the final determining factor for me, over utmost velocity.

I built my 338 Federal with a 20" barrel on the Model 88 as the gunsmith had a Krieger barrel that someone had cut too short for another customer's project, and I got it at a good price. Also, being built as a close quarters brush gun for sorting out problem bears, the shorter handier barrel was what I was looking for. And with my years of experiencee with the handy BLR, I wanted to replicate that with the Model 88. I also like the detachable magazines for quick reloading, as I always have a spare ready on my belt.
 
SuperCub said:
OTOH .... From a purely practical standpoint, I doubt that a 308 loaded with a 180 or 200 gr NP couldn't do much less than a 358Win. esp for moose hunting.
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And do it with a much better sectional density. The 338 Federal and 358 suffer from having to use bullets that are light for caliber to avoid ridiculous incursion into the body of the case.
 
BigUglyMan said:
And do it with a much better sectional density. The 338 Federal and 358 suffer from having to use bullets that are light for caliber to avoid ridiculous incursion into the body of the case.
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Never-the-less... inside of 250, there is something to be said for mass (momentum) and frontal cross section.
 
There is a magic to the 35's. I've had 2 Whelens on rem 700's , a 358 custom Rem 600, and a Ruger 77 in 350 rem mag. Every one of them shot better than I could. A good friend in BC has a Mauser on a 35 whelen improved. Bit of a bite on the shoulder end, but this thing shoots out to 500 with authority. (Hedley range, lots of witnesses) 250 Speer hot cor is the only thing he shoots, and it has put a lot of moose in the freezer. My 77 was a custom build, chop barrel to 19, some extra tweeks, and what a shooter. 200 factory loads into 7/8" at 100 all day. Was working on a Barnes 200gr tsx load when an outfitter offered me silly amouns of $$ for it. It's somewhere up in the Yukon and every now & then he sends a pic of what it whacked. a bit of recoil, but not as bad as my 300 win mag, more like a firm push as opposed to a smack.

I know the 308 will do a great job, it's my go to deer rifle, but the 35's just have a certain quality to them. Unfortunately they are more of a handloaders special, but you will have a blast if you ever drink the 35 koolaid!
 
Redneck107 said:
I fell in love with the idea of the 358 win and am looking into building one on a savage action. If there is any wisdom or real world experience with this cartirage. I am looking to hunt deer and possibly elk and if I am lucky to get my tag swap donkey.

Thanks in advance
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Are you contemplating a Savage 99 build or a bolt gun? In the 99 the .358 is a good choice, as is a .35-284 if you wanted something a little different, but in a bolt gun I'd opt for other options like the .35 Whelen or the 9.3X62 or perhaps even a .350 magnum. Of course the advantage that the .350 magnum has when chambered in a long action rifle also applies to the .358 Winchester, in that a long action allows you to seat a 225 gr or a 250 gr bullet out so as not to intrude upon the powder capacity of the cartridge, but still allows the cartridge to cycle through the magazine. If you make up a dummy cartridge with your bullet of preference, so the base of the bullet does not extend below the neck, or the boat-tail below the shoulder, the gunsmith can cut the lead accordingly.
 
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Hoyt, please elaborate on why this is your favourite cartridge. When a man that has gone through as many rifles as yourself makes a statement like that, I like to listen
 
Got a bad itch for a .358 a few years ago when I was much smitten with the model 99 Savage. Chances of finding one seemed remote, so I had a 99 in .308 rebored to .358, had the metalwork powder coated, and put it in laminated stock from gunstocksinc. Had good fun developing a few useable loads ( details escape me at the moment), and shot a small buck with it the first or second time out. Definitely fun, and definitely effective.
Seems to me one of the loads sighted at 4 inches at 100 yds made me feel OK about shooting out to about 250 ... further than I would usually shoot anyway.

I say build one on an action you like ... you will enjoy the process and end up with something you like in an effective chambering.
 
Won't do anything pappa .308 Win couldn't do better with a lot better selection of guns, ammo, components to boot.
The .358 Win is a necrocartridge ... one of the walking dead rounds.
 
So what's the scoop? Is the OP gonna rebarrel or rebore? Maybe Ron S will do a group rate, been thinking about this myself.
 
I still have the itch to build one for sure! Everything has been put on hold until things pick back up again and I’m able to put my lunch money into the gun jar! I might have to start a swear jar to speed things up
 
My brother used a BLR .358 for years as his primary rifle for elk and moose. I have never owned one, but I did own a .356 Win (rimmed version of .358) and several .35 Whelens. One bullet that works better than you'd think in all three is the 220 gr Speer flat point. It is just right for the .358 and .356. The Nosler Accubond 225 is good in the .358, as is the 225 Nosler partition. I personally don't think the .358 is at its best with 250 gr bullets, but if you limit shots to the distances where the bullets will expand reliably ( probably under 300 yards) it will do the trick on pretty much anything. It's not a popular cartridge, but it is capable and reliable.
 
BigUglyMan said:
And do it with a much better sectional density. The 338 Federal and 358 suffer from having to use bullets that are light for caliber to avoid ridiculous incursion into the body of the case.
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My 338 FEDERAL is a TIKKA T3 I put in the long cartridge stop bolt and use the 30-06 lenght mags so i can seat bullets way further out and add in more powder for 338-06 Performance in the LITTLE case ! :dancingbanana: RJ
 
My BLR prefers the Speer 220 gr Hot Cor to the 225 gr Partition. 1" vs 1.2" groups at 100 yards. Still, a respectable load.
Has been getting harder to find them, but have a few boxes, so good for awhile.
Those Speers have accounted for several elk, moose, and a grizzly.
 
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