375 Ruger Factory ammo

Gatehouse;

I give you full points for staying power that's for sure.

1....You said the 375 H&H required a longer and HEAVIER ACTION than the Ruger, my point was that my Rem ACTION was in fact lighter than the Ruger.

2....I agree somewhat, but the Magnum versions of the NA made rifles were only 1-200 bucks more, not out of reach by any means. The Alaskan is unique for sure in is abbreviated packaging.

3....My point was that in going this route it would have made the cartridge more user friendly, not necessarily a better design, but more accessable to a wider range of brass, of which all we loaders have our preferences.
As far as belted mags go I think they're still here for a while yet. I doubt the 300 WSM or the 300 RUM outsell the 300 WM and I suspect the same can be said of 7mm family and the 338 family.

4.......no issues

5..... I wouldn't recommend anybody take any wilcat or even slightly "odd cartridge" rifle to Africa these days without securing a supply in country first. OR Take mainstream calibers like 30-06, 308, 300 WM and bigger the .375 H&H, 416 Rem or Rigby, 458 WM, 458 Lott and .470 NE in a double. These are all readily available in any city in sothern Africa and most hunting camps, should your supply fail to arrive.


I think both points of view have now been fully explored, and Cleo can make up his mind having been fully informed on the virtues and pitfalls of each cartridge which you and I have expounded at length. Not trying to cut you off, of course if you wish to respond again to this post.
 
I give you full points for staying power that's for sure.

1....You said the 375 H&H required a longer and HEAVIER ACTION than the Ruger, my point was that my Rem ACTION was in fact lighter than the Ruger.
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The H&H does require a LONGER and HEAVIER Ruger action. That's one of the reasons Ruger designed the cartridge!!!! Of course the Rem action is lighter than the Ruger. It's lighter than virtually all the CRF actions. You are comparing apples to oranges! Most of the different models of rifles that were chambered in H&H were bigger and heavier than the corresponding rifle in 300WM for example. The innovators at Ruger gave us a small package that was big on performance.

2....I agree somewhat, but the Magnum versions of the NA made rifles were only 1-200 bucks more, not out of reach by any means. The Alaskan is unique for sure in is abbreviated packaging.
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They were more expensive and designed like old school Euro rifles. Long barrels, big stocks, express sights.... Some people really like that style, but the Ruger changed everything. I see Remington has jumped on the bandwagon with a 22" barrel 700 in H&H.

3....My point was that in going this route it would have made the cartridge more user friendly, not necessarily a better design, but more accessable to a wider range of brass, of which all we loaders have our preferences.
As far as belted mags go I think they're still here for a while yet. I doubt the 300 WSM or the 300 RUM outsell the 300 WM and I suspect the same can be said of 7mm family and the 338 famil
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y.

I understand your point, but it's wrong. The only people that would have benefited are those that choose to fireform brass from 338 WM cases. Even among hand loaders, those that really enjoy case forming are few. I'd rather just buy the brass. And it's not likely that if the 375 CT was put out by Hornady that Winchester/Rem/Lapua is going to start making brass for it, either, so we are back in the same boat.

The reason the 300WM is more popular than the RUM and WSM is long term availability of rifles. Points I already made in this thread. Availability of rifles= popularity. Look at other 300 belted cartridges. The 300 H&H, 308 Norma or 300 WBY aren't nearly as popular as the new WSM. People don't long for unnecessary belts on their cases. They want good quality rifles at affordable prices available for purchase. Another selling point for the Ruger.



5..... I wouldn't recommend anybody take any wilcat or even slightly "odd cartridge" rifle to Africa these days without securing a supply in country first. OR Take mainstream calibers like 30-06, 308, 300 WM and bigger the .375 H&H, 416 Rem or Rigby, 458 WM, 458 Lott and .470 NE in a double. These are all readily available in any city in sothern Africa and most hunting camps, should your supply fail to arrive.
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Finally......You admit the reality, not just the anti NEW KING mantra:

If you wish to take your NEW KING (or ANY RIFLE) to Africa and are worried about ammo supply, just do as you suggested and secure a supply in country in case your ammo doesn't make it. Like I've said soooo many times....
 
So in summary, the 375 Ruger has 6% more volume. In a Ruger rifle is is lighter than the 375 H&H in a Ruger rifle. The 375 Ruger doesn't have a belt, so it's prettier I guess as I don't know why having a belt is bad. Old I guess. The 375 Ruger is a shorter casing, so it can be used in shorter actions. Performance between the two is close enough to call the same, however the Ruger offering does offer a slight advantage here, not enough IMO to make any difference on game or paper within normal distances. Both ammunition and brass is less available for the 375 Ruger. I don't see much difference in rifle costs, as comparable rifles in either cost about the same. Maybe in Ruger, I haven't checked Rugers H&H rifle, I was comparing rifles like winchester, browning, etc...

Does the different casing reduce throat erosion? Are there any other benefits to the Ruger over the H&H? Is there another casing that can be formed to the 375 Ruger? Will factory ammunition be cheaper that H&H in the coming years? Will one or the other perform better with longer/shorter bullets? Does one give us more option concerning seating depth? (I think that has been answered, but it was rifle specific)

I am not trolling, attacking, flaming, or baiting. I am curious.
 
c-fbmi said:
I think both points of view have now been fully explored, and Cleo can make up his mind having been fully informed on the virtues and pitfalls of each cartridge which you and I have expounded at length. Not trying to cut you off, of course if you wish to respond again to this post.
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LOL, funny thing is Cleo didn't ask about the H&H and even went so far as to say that he wasn't particularily interested in the H&HLaugh2

cleo said:
Well - entertaining as always. Thanks for your opinions on both sides... I'd buy a ruger over the H+H in a bolt action anyday because of the shorter action and barrel lengths, I just am not comfortable with the few factory ammo choices not being a reloader. Personally, I don't buy into the need to find shells in some general store in Butf&*k nowhere cause I forgot to pack them... so that's not an issue for me. If I knew federal or others were planning on coming out with factory loads, I'd pick up an alaskan in a second...

Anyway, thans again for the input...

Cheers,
CLEO
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Never the less it was an entertaining 9 pages;) Cheers!
 
With respect to the 375 Ruger case, it originated from one of the European cartridges... I'm not sure if its the 8X60 mm or the 8X68S.
I will check because my Brother sent me some to re-size for my 375 Ruger and according to him it was distinctly better than the Hornady produced brass. All of the cartridges with the Ruger moniker on the back have been taken from existing brass.... 204 Ruger from 222 Rem. Mag.,6.8 Creedmoor from the old 30 Rem. etc., sort of like the 270 Win. from the 30-06..
Someone said that the 375 Ruger requires less case trimming.... not true in my case, it needs trimming just as damned much as any other cartridge. I did experience shorter case life than the H&H in the form of expanded primer pockets that would not hold a primer after the second reloading and once in a while after the first.
I attribute this to simply being a case of much better quality brass being available for the Holland, if someone else comes out with brass maybe it will be better.
For what its worth my accuracy / hunting load in the Ruger with a 300 gr. Kodiak bonded core bullet required 17 gr. more of a slow burning powder than that of a slightly faster burning powder to drive the same bullet in my H&H to about 80-90 fps faster than the H&H...
 
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Cleftwynd said:
So in summary, the 375 Ruger has 6% more volume. In a Ruger rifle is is lighter than the 375 H&H in a Ruger rifle. The 375 Ruger doesn't have a belt, so it's prettier I guess as I don't know why having a belt is bad. Old I guess.
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Belts aren't bad, they are superfluous. The Ruger has no superfluous belt.

The 375 Ruger is a shorter casing, so it can be used in shorter actions
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.

Which is a benefit to the Ruger.


Performance between the two is close enough to call the same, however the Ruger offering does offer a slight advantage here, not enough IMO to make any difference on game or paper within normal distances
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That was one of the reasons for the Ruger- Long barrel H&H velocity in a short barrel.

. Both ammunition and brass is less available for the 375 Ruger.
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Luckily, anyone with a telephone, a computer or a good relationship with their local gun store can get brass

I don't see much difference in rifle costs, as comparable rifles in either cost about the same. Maybe in Ruger, I haven't checked Rugers H&H rifle, I was comparing rifles like winchester, browning, etc...
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Cost difference in Ruger rifles is quite a bit. In other rifles there is often an extra cost for the H&H over a 300WM for example.

Does the different casing reduce throat erosion?
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Throat erosion is not controlled by case shape.

Are there any other benefits to the Ruger over the H&H?
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Been listed over and over....H&H performance- more compact rifle, less case trimming etc etc etc....Lots of threads to search this out on. You've been asking the same question over and over.

Is there another casing that can be formed to the 375 Ruger?
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Probably not. The same can be said for the H&H.

Will one or the other perform better with longer/shorter bullets? Does one give us more option concerning seating depth? (I think that has been answered, but it was rifle specific)
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I've used 220 up to 350gr bullets in the Ruger and they get good accuracy and good velocity. Some people have suggested that the Ruger won't work with heavy bullets due to the shorter case, I find this to be misleading. You may have a long throated H&H that you can seat bullets out farther, but it doesn't mean you are getting any real edge. Just means you have a deep throat.

I haven't tried 380gr bullets in either cartridge, and probably won't as I don't see much use for them. I'm not sure what the concern with seating depth is. A properly chambered rifle in any cartridge will not have seating depth issues at all. Seating depth is usually experimented with to get better accuracy. The 375 Ruger cartridge is certainly accurate enough. Some guys think that seating the bullet out a bit to get a couple more grains of powder in is an asset, but for the minimal amount of velocity gain you get, it's never been a big deal to me.


I am not trolling, attacking, flaming, or baiting. I am curious.
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For someone so "curious" I'm surprised you haven't gone and done some more research, as all this information has already been put down on CGN and everywhere else on the internet.
 
wapitiwhacker said:
LOL, funny thing is Cleo didn't ask about the H&H and even went so far as to say that he wasn't particularily interested in the H&HLaugh2

!
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Thatis pretty funny. A guy asks about the 375 Ruger and we quickly have the sheep telling him that to try something different or new is BAD.

I guess it's human nature to put up roadblocks for anyone who wants to deviate from what the rest of the herd is doing.
 
So again, belted or not makes no difference.

I have never argued at all about its length, it is shorter, and that can be a good thing if it matters to you that it will fit in a shorter action. I agree with you, no need to keep reiterating that.

Same ballistic performance, or close enough to not matter. We both agree yes?

Not everyone can get 375 Ruger without extra shipping costs, not all of us live in cities, or lloydminster, or wherever, my LGS is t going to bring in 375 Ruger ammo or brass just for me without recovering his costs, including shipping. So maybe one day the Ruger will be popular enough to be carried everywhere we can get 375 H&H without extra cost.

I can find either cartridge in most makes for similar price, except Ruger. Ok got me there, no biggie.

Many people have stated that a shorter, fatter, steep shoulder case reduces throat erosion because more powder is burnt in the casing. I can not prove or disprove this theory, hence my question.

People have stated that the Ruger needs as much trimming if not more than others, even here, conflicting info... And etc...etc.... Doesn't answer anything.

I simply asked if there was another cartridge that could be used to make 375 Ruger. I am looking for reasons why the Ruger is so superior to the H&H, and hopefully will find some factual information.

Both Kevan and Boomer have posted some relevant information based upon their experiences, as have you, thanks to all for sharing. It helps to understand why this new member of the 375 family is being regarded as "THE NEW KING" by some.

I just don't see any major difference in performance, accuracy, reliability, availability, cost, or weight and size for that matter, to determine that one is far superior to the other. I do like the fact that the rifle can be a little shorter and lighter with the same performance, but in calibers this size I actually like a little more weight.

When I pick up a 375, it will be in the first one that fits me, and catches my eye, as long as there are more makers of brass at that time.

Thanks for attempting to clarify Gatehouse, I just don't see things exactly the way you do, I could be way out in left though for that matter.
 
Not near as thick as others...


Anyway, I wonder why I can not find a Ruger #1 in 375 Ruger... Has anyone heard if they re coming out with one?
 
Why do you insist of being an insulting ass, I am surprised you are a moderator on another forum....


Pathetic.... Why bother using forums at all then, when we all could just "use a telephone". Grow up crybaby.
 
Kevan said:
With respect to the 375 Ruger case, it originated from one of the European cartridges... I'm not sure if its the 8X60 mm or the 8X68S.
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I've read both that the Ruger case is unique and developed from scratch (Wiki).
The .375 Ruger uses a unique case designed by Hornady and Ruger. The case is of a rimless design having the base and rim diameter of .532 in (13.5 mm) which is the same diameter of the belt on belted magnum cases based on the .300 H&H Magnum and .375 H&H Magnum. This allows the cartridge to have a greater case capacity than a belted magnum case given cases of equal length. As Ruger intended the cartridge to be chambered in standard length bolt action rifles[2] the case length was kept to 2.580 in (65.5 mm) which is only .04 in (1.0 mm) longer than the .270 Winchester case
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and also where it is very similar to the 30 or 35 Newton. It seems cases can be formed from 8X68S or 6.5X68, but Ruger pressures (60,000 psi) might be at the upper limit of that case, and the 8X68S rim is of smaller diameter (rebated.509" ), therefore not a good match for the standard Ruger boltface.

This stuff is all beyond me, I buy my cases, but I do find it interesting reading.
 
Everyone that comes out with a new case says its unique :)

But almost everything can be traced back to some similar design that has been slightly or greatly modified. ;)
 
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