.45 vs 9mm - The debate is over, say the Experts

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...........and 9mm won


By Larry Vickers:

Recently Bill Wilson of Wilson Combat fame sent around a survey to many notable people in the firearms industry - many M4C members will recognize instantly several on the survey such as myself, Hackathorn and Rob Leatham. The question was simple; if you had to choose one pistol caliber for self defense and range use what would it be. The results spoke volumes-9mm Para won in a landslide. Almost unanimously.

Assuming you had to buy your own pistol and ammunition (type of your choice) for combined self-defense and self-defense range training use, which caliber would you choose, 9x19mm Parabellum, .357 Sig, .38 super, .40 S&W, 10mm or .45 ACP ?

I surveyed the following and their answer:


BJ Norris 9mm

Bill Rogers 9mm

Bill Wilson 9mm

David Bahde 9mm

Ernest Langdon 9mm

Frank Proctor 9mm

Ken Hackathorn 9mm

Larry Vickers 9mm

Mike Seeklander 9mm

Paul Markel 9mm

Paul Howe 9mm

Paul Buffoni 9mm

Rob Haught .45

Rob Leatham .40

Super Dave Harrington 9mm


It was no surprise to me; I've been preaching the benefits of 9mm for quite awhile now and I'm not alone. 9mm pistols hold a lot of bullets and are easy to shoot. There are many good models to choose from. Practice Ammo is easy to get and fairly cheap. And most importantly some of the self defense loads on the market are very effective. I can't say I was surprised by this development at all.

In fact, I saw it coming years ago. One thing I had been doing for years is asking LE officers who carry 9mm what specific load they use and what performance has it provided on the job. Without exception anytime officers were carrying the Winchester Ranger 127 grain +P+ or the Speer Gold Dot they had nothing but good things to say. In fact one officer told me they had yet to have a bad guy survive who they had shot with the Ranger 127 gr +P+. To me when the FBI announced a switch back to 9mm that simply confirmed what I already knew. We live in a 9mm world and that's not changing anytime soon.

An exception to that in my opinion would be if you are stuck for whatever reason to carrying ball Ammo only. At that point all the calibers are just gonna poke a hole in the bad guy and a bigger hole is better than a smaller one so .45 ACP rules. That leaves .40 S&W out in the cold in my opinion and that trend is seen everywhere now as the .40 has quickly become the black sheep of the whole Ammo debate. The guns are harder to shoot, hold less bullets and are no more effective on the street than 9mm. In fact some have proven to be problematic for many years (Glock 22) when there 9mm counterparts are gold standards for dependability and reliability (Glock 17).

So that's the way I see it; 9mm is in, .40 is out, and .45 if needed. Be safe, keep shooting, LAV out.


Larry Vickers
Master Sergeant ( Retired )
US Army SOF Combat Veteran



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My so called go to gun has evolved from a glock 20 (10mm) to a Colt Delta Elite (10mm) to a Valtro (45acp) to my current go to which is a double stack 9mm nighthawk. The Valtro and nighthawk have been 100% reliable, the glock and Colt were pretty reliable but did have the occasional hiccup. Not saying I'd pick the nighthawk as a carry gun if that was an option but for fun and games (mostly 3 gun) that's where I've landed. And if we were actually allowed to defend ourselves up here (and fully load the gun) it would make a hell of a home defense gun with 17 rounds in there.


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In canada, I'd take a 45 since we are limited to ten rounds. But in most us states, you can get hicap with 18 to 20 rounds of 9mm in a single mag. So I'd rather have 8 rounds of 9mm than 10 rounds of 45 acp
 
Like that means anything to an average Canadian gun owner. I'm fairly familiar with all three - 9, .40 and 45. Started with 9, currently shooting mostly .40, but still like 45 the best. It takes commitment to be as good with .40 or 45 as one is with 9 mm, but that's where the fun is. Given a choice, I would not care. All of them are fine, but both .40 and 45 still maintain the advantage over 9mm. Question is - is the advantage big enough for you? Everybody will have to answer that question for himself.
 
Let's face it - the only advantage that .45ACP has to an average Canadian is how much easier it is to see the holes in the paper. I'll take cheaper ammo every time.
 
38 cal is essentially 9mm.

We talking auto or revolver or what?

M

38 Super, not 38 Special - designed for the FBI in the 1930's to penetrate car bodies and popular with IPSC shooters for years because it's a high pressure load that allows comps to function properly. 9mm is actually more like 38 Special +P for energy.
 
The great debate has nothing to do with the "average Canadian gun owner", its all about self defense whether military, law enforcement or civilian.

Ken Hackathorn on the subject:

Ken Hackathorn (Affiliation: Alias Training & Security Services; Position: Former U.S. Army Special Forces Small Arms Instructor; Gunsite Instructor (retired); NRA Police Firearms Instructor (ret.); FBI Certified Firearms Instructor (ret.); Certified Deputy Sheriff (ret.))

9mm or .45? Both.
Reason: Imagine you’re in a room with one door, five Jihadists armed with dull knives are going to come through the door one at a time every 60 seconds with the goal of cutting your head off. You have the choice of one of two identical handguns, one in 9x19mm and the other in .45 ACP. Both have only five rounds of ball ammo. Which one would you pick?
I carry a .45 ACP daily, but practice and train with 9x19mm pistols.

Now, change the scenario to include full capacity magazines (say 8 / 17 rds respectively) and 8 assailants, and that choice may change completely.

and so, the debate continues.... :p
 
Same sized projectile, but 9mm is usually double the velocity of .38 special, and don't even think of .38 S&W... Twice the velocity means far more impact.

38+p and/or 357 mag? I'm thinking any 357 mag load will out pace any 9mm. Correct me if I am wrong.

Comparing 9mm and 45 is like comparing 5.56 and 7.62. Two different animals, both have their uses.

M
 
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i may be a newbie,but i'm failing to see how this issue has any relevance whatsoever to a canadian restricted gun owner.

Hypothetical my friend, we can always dream

All I remember my hi-cap para in 38super 24+1, would be too heavy for everyday carry. Single stack, 38super would still be the choice.
 
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