9mm big enough?

Indeed, the right 7.62 is clearly the winner in the 9mm vs. everything else debate. Not very holsterable, though.

Mark clearly you have not done your research.

I use this in a small of the back holster. It is nearly impervious to lint and 7.62 x 39 is cheap enough that I just fire it off daily to avoid contact with my body deactivating the primers.

phillipsrogers762x39mmcompace.jpg


Shawn
 
+1. John Lott has indicated that ~98% of defensive gun uses in the US involve no shots fired at all, simply presenting a firearm was enough to send the bad guy running. For the other 2%, you have to be committed to using whatever gun you have or you are in serious trouble.

This is why CIT robberies in Canada are so rare compared to, say, Britain:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-world-armed-robbery-says-security-boss.html

And a shotgun (or a non-restricted CZ 858, which--to a home-invader--looks unnervingly like an AK-47) beats a handgun in the sphincter-relaxing quotient anytime...and can be legally stored with one less lock.
 
Please go on about how your ambient body temperature negatively effects the primer.

No--the moisture from evaporating perspiration. After shoveling snow recently, I took off my (urethane-lined) jacket and was amazed at how much sweat had condensed on the back of my jacket. This can't be good for primers. I store ammo in a box with silica gel, in a room that's always about 22 degrees, but being against a body all day would eventually kill the primers. Cops' and CIT guards' holsters sit outside their clothing, away from the body. Rotating in new ammo frequently would also be a good idea.
 
What about all the undercover/detective guns that live in armpits and butt-cracks!:yingyang:

Do they use special primers??

How about military ammo??

Must be that Special Agent 666 "Toxic Sweat Weapon".:cool:


No--the moisture from evaporating perspiration. After shoveling snow recently, I took off my (urethane-lined) jacket and was amazed at how much sweat had condensed on the back of my jacket. This can't be good for primers. I store ammo in a box with silica gel, in a room that's always about 22 degrees, but being against a body all day would eventually kill the primers. Cops' and CIT guards' holsters sit outside their clothing, away from the body. Rotating in new ammo frequently would also be a good idea.
 
ATC with a D eagle? If the first round didn't take him out, he for sure would get you as you attempt to clear the ensuing malfunction....

I didn't say it was a good idea, I just asked if anyone has floated the idea with the CFO, since they seem to use caliber restrictions to eliminate semi-auto handguns from consideration.


Mark clearly you have not done your research.

I use this in a small of the back holster. It is nearly impervious to lint and 7.62 x 39 is cheap enough that I just fire it off daily to avoid contact with my body deactivating the primers.

phillipsrogers762x39mmcompace.jpg


Shawn

Laugh2

I stand corrected. Must be an impressive fireball from that thing, considering what my 11.8" vz-58 puts out.


This is why CIT robberies in Canada are so rare compared to, say, Britain:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-world-armed-robbery-says-security-boss.html

Armoured car guards are not armed in England?f:P: Might as well just paint targets on their uniforms. Once again, the stupidity emanating from that island leaves me speechless.


And a shotgun (or a non-restricted CZ 858, which--to a home-invader--looks unnervingly like an AK-47) beats a handgun in the sphincter-relaxing quotient anytime...and can be legally stored with one less lock.

I agree with that, the sound of a pump action shotgun being racked has to rank as one of the more terrifying sounds a thief could hear. Not sure how you figure on the lock, restricteds can be stored in a safe with no trigger lock required. One lock to deal with, either way.


Mark
 
read an article in a gun digest that said the 38 special loaded with 200 gr. pills was best for home deffense as bullet weight was to heavy to stabalize and paper testing indicated a 98% tumble factor which caused massive wound channel and almost no pass throughs - all energy in the bad guy and no collateral dmg. but 38 spec. is an old cal. surely it can'y be any good :D
 
read an article in a gun digest that said the 38 special loaded with 200 gr. pills was best for home deffense as bullet weight was to heavy to stabalize and paper testing indicated a 98% tumble factor which caused massive wound channel and almost no pass throughs - all energy in the bad guy and no collateral dmg. but 38 spec. is an old cal. surely it can'y be any good :D

This idea is fine as long as your target is not more than 5 meters away, or you might completely miss him. My experience with keyholing bullets is accuracy is well, non-existent. Non-existent accuracy that is.

To the OP, I'm just old school. Big diameter and heavy bullet will do the job. My personal defense load is the ordinary hardball. .45 acp does not need to expand. Hardball gives 100% functional reliability in my pistols.
 
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read an article in a gun digest that said the 38 special loaded with 200 gr. pills was best for home deffense as bullet weight was to heavy to stabalize and paper testing indicated a 98% tumble factor which caused massive wound channel and almost no pass throughs - all energy in the bad guy and no collateral dmg. but 38 spec. is an old cal. surely it can'y be any good :D

The best thing about this is that they are specifically advocating shooting an inaccurate round that is extremely heavy and therefore if you miss you will serious problems with interior wall penetration. And their selection is based on shooting paper.

Way to go, gun mags, you never disappoint.
 
The first handgun I bought was a .45, if the gov't wants to limit me to 10 shots they might as well be big holes! Yep, i'se a redneck.

In other news, that Paul Gomez video is great, thanks for the post.
 
Guns and Ammo Handguns Magazine has an article saying a 9mm with the new hi-tech ammo is now the best self defense round.

http://www.handgunsmag.com/2012/10/23/size-doesnt-matter-using-9mm-for-personal-defense/

After years of hearing the 9mm was inferior from everyone from Col. Jeff Cooper to all the gun magazine writers, what do you think?

Are you trading in your .45 for a wonder 9?

Facts:
Choosing defense ammo: http://ammo.ar15.com/project/Self_Defense_Ammo_FAQ/index.htm

Expert Opinion: http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19887

FBI report: http://www.firearmstactical.com/hwfe.htm

Video presentation on gunshot wounds:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tku8YI68-JA&feature=em-share_video_user

I have updated the original post with links to available information on the subject.
 
article was very clear about accuracey - the load grouped well at 25 and 50 yards not many people around that can shoot a handgun well past that and certainly dosn't apply in a home deffense . the article is from a large gun digest from 72 titled big bullets from little guns. interesting read as they actualy did testing .



This idea is fine as long as your target is not more than 5 meters away, or you might completely miss him. My experience with keyholing bullets is accuracy is well, non-existent. Non-existent accuracy that is.

To the OP, I'm just old school. Big diameter and heavy bullet will do the job. My personal defense load is the ordinary hardball. .45 acp does not need to expand. Hardball gives 100% functional reliability in my pistols.
 
This idea is fine as long as your target is not more than 5 meters away, or you might completely miss him. My experience with keyholing bullets is accuracy is well, non-existent. Non-existent accuracy that is.

.

My experience is quite different. I have seen targets hit by bullets tunbling out to 25 yards and still hit a man size target. Out to 25 yards I doubt tumbling has much effect on combat accuracy within the relatively short defensive range of a handgun.

Getting hit by a tumbling bullet would likely cut a hole the length of the bullet through you. Isn't this one of the attributes of the .223 bullet when it hits flesh ie it tumbles?

Take Care

Bob
 
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