Am I a total noob?

Steve, I have a Wingmaster. Circa 1980. It’s a workhorse and dead simple.

I’ve had more than a few M12s, most in 16. Nearly bought another 16 ga last week but short barrels and solid rib. I like the plain barrels. A late 1940s gun.

I don’t know anyone who owns a M37 or M31 that doesn’t love it, especially in 16.
 
I went and got one of mine out of the box to look and to get the shell lifter below the forearm you had to bend it a lot as it hinges back of the bottom slot. So you have many problems there. I have a few of them but since I won them I have never had a desire to fire them. I own lots of American made shot guns that are proven to work properly.
 
Ok, so I just tired to recreate what I saw in that picture from the OP and by stepping forcefully ... or stomping on some spent 12ga shells ... several times. And all I am getting after several tries is this (see picture) .... and this is nothing comparable to the OPs picture.

Stomped_Shells.jpg


Link

So, it seems to me the OPs gun is firing out of battery .... and that is the only way I could explain that sort of shell separation.

And a gun firing out of battery is ..... uhhhhhhhh .... very bad news! Even dangerous .... !!!!!

To me, that gun would be a write off .... and I would be looking for something a bit more "reliable".

Now, I have no experience with a Model 12 or a Model 37 or Model 31 .... However, I have owned several Remington 870 Police and Wingmasters. I can't say they were all perfect .... but they did not need much to get them to be "perfect". Some needed the chamber to be polished .... others the trigger was sluggish and needed a trigger fix .... etc ... nothing mayor. And all these "fixes" I could do by myself ....

But non of my 870s would ever fire out of battery!!!
 
That gun has been altered Those should be pins holding the trigger group not buggered screws. The lifter is cut into and under the fore end. To fire out of battery the lifter would have had to be up to lift the shell into the chamber.
 
I'm guessing that the lug that locks the bolt in battery is damaged. This would allow the gun to fire in battery, but the bolt recedes during firing until it seizes on something. The net result is a hull separation, and gas release. Using a hammer to get the action open might have caused or contributed to the failure. Wonder if there is some residual material in the barrel?
Cant comment on the lifter issue, but the gun is obviously hooped. Did you buy it allegedly "new"?
 
Last edited:
Yeah, those pins came with the gun. Local gunshop told me they sold about 40 and haven't heard of a single issue. I'll contact warranty tomorrow for a new bolt, the top part of it won't come down smoothly as it should when it moves back and that's what jams the bolt.
 
bdft said:
You'll need more than a new bolt. ...
Click to expand...

I would agree .... from the picture it seems that the gun fired out of battery .... the bolt was accelerated .... shot back with full force ... and hit whatever it had to hit inside the receiver .... and bounced back forward .... and crushed the hull. Now I don't know if those Churchill shotguns have aluminum receivers or steel ones .... but my guess is that it is not only the bolt that is out of spec now .... receiver, action bars, trigger group .... who knows .....

p.s.: and if the bolt was still engaging the action bars while being accelerated backwards .... that would explain how the forend got slammed under the shell lifter ....
 
Last edited:
canvasback said:
Pump guns to look for.....

Winchester Model 12
Ithaca Model 37
Remington Model 31
Remington Wingmaster

Look in the Equipment exchange here. (check the trader ratings)
Look at ####### (no trader rating...buyer beware)

Any gunstore that has an on line presence. Or any gunstore you walk into. There is a hole in the wall gun shop near me.....every time I walk in, there are at least 2 of those 4 guns. When they are that available I really don't understand the desire to waste money on new budget Turkish guns.
Click to expand...

100%!!
 
Gabuz said:
Yeah, those pins came with the gun. Local gunshop told me they sold about 40 and haven't heard of a single issue. I'll contact warranty tomorrow for a new bolt, the top part of it won't come down smoothly as it should when it moves back and that's what jams the bolt.
Click to expand...

Rubbermaid makes a nice round green gun case with removable lid just for Turkish guns. Buy one and throw that gun in it and set it out at the end of the driveway. A truck will come by and pick it up and not even take the case on you. Then you can go get one of the guns Canvasback suggested and you can repurpose the case for household items in need of disposal.
 
You would not see me shooting that gun again, its main use might be taking it back to the dealer and if he didn't offer a refund with credit, beating him with it like a club.
 
No chance that firearm was purchased new. It looks to have been modified and clearly made unsafe. I doubt there will be any warranty on it. Likely cheaper to buy another than to try and fix that gun.
 
Wow.

Can you get us close pictures of the bolt locking cams, and the inside of the barrel on the chamber side where the cams lock in?
 
Why are there two different colour hulls in there? The red one looks intentionally crumpled and jammed into the tube with the white one cut up behind it.
The hull beside the shotgun on the ground, what is that? What happened to its head? Looks to be cut clean off.
Is this a joke? Clown photo?
 
easy said:
Why are there two different colour hulls in there? The red one looks intentionally crumpled and jammed into the tube with the white one cut up behind it.
The hull beside the shotgun on the ground, what is that? What happened to its head? Looks to be cut clean off.
Is this a joke? Clown photo?
Click to expand...

I thought the white plastic was the shot cup, but I don't claim to have a theory on what happened.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom