Bear defender 12 gauge

Claven2 said:
Factory american eagle 240gn JHPs. I would consider this the minimum .44 load for bear repellant, but you mileage may vary.
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He has been shooting a single shot T/C Contender carbine with a 16.5" 22LR barrel since he was 2.5 years old and the last couple of years I've moved him up to my 18" 10mm & 21" 410 barrels and I'm moving him into a 21" 223 barrel soon.

I have also had him shooting my 20" barreled Puma M92 in 454 Casull with up to my top 300gr JHP XTP 45 Colt loads only issue was the barrel was to front heavy for him to hold on target without a rest which is why I went with the 16" barreled Trapper model of course I have shortened butt stocks for him so the rifles fit him properly.

I would rather he had 7 rounds in the tube than just one otherwise I would have left him with the 10mm basically I feel this is the best compromise firearm combo that I can come up with for now when he turns 10 next year it will be his first hunting rifle and hopefully by then he will be able to handle the recoil of a shotgun I will then score him a Rem 870 in 20 gauge.

I've never been one for bear spray but I have been thinking about scoring a can for him to add to his knife belt.
 
Well if he practices with the gun and is able to use it effectively in stressful situations, then go with what works. All kids are different and some shoot higher recoil guns sooner than others.

My kids are not there yet, clearly!
 
Still in the Valley moved a little further out though I mostly work in Abbotsford.

I would definitely take you up on that offer.

Would be great experience for my guy to try them out.
 
Claven2 said:
Modern rifle rounds (like a .30-06) are ample for most bear encounters, and are routinely used on bear hunts. But the point is to have something more rugged and compact to carry about, and that has other potential uses (like firing shot). Also, some provinces don't allow rifles in the woods above .223" calibre outside of hunting season. So shotguns would be a must!
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I'm lucky to be in BC then I had no idea these kinds of rules in other provinces existed until recently.

We can carry any non-restricted firearm at anytime of year we can even shoot at night if we felt so inclined can't hunt after dusk but we can discharge firearms.

Could be because we have over 200,000 of Canada's appr 400,000 black bear population and over 20,000 grizzlies here and/or it could be that BC is mostly remote wilderness crown land.
 
conor_90 said:
In most situations where I've flown in if I radioed a pilot and told him I wanted him to buzz a bear he would laugh his ass off.
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Boomer said:
Perhaps, but while they've been laughing, those pilots have saved more than a few lives.
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Reading these and the other aircraft related posts, I can't help but think that the best all round and most ecological solution is to just shoot the darn bear, I mean if it's both necessary and legal where you are camped. All other considerations of human safety aside, black bears at least have a well known random genetic thing where they approach and even hunt humans, and eliminating that mutation from their gene pool as much as possible can only be good for the bear population nowadays, what with all the wilderness travel going on.
 
One of the things that we tell our clients when we are out walking is if we hear a chopper coming we stop and watch. We have had helos push bears onto us quite a few times ( bears hate choppers).
pounder
 
pounder said:
One of the things that we tell our clients when we are out walking is if we hear a chopper coming we stop and watch. We have had helos push bears onto us quite a few times ( bears hate choppers).
pounder
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I think they do it on purpose, just like when Resources says "Oh, you were over there??!!"

By the way, you'd love it here today, -36 with a breeze for well into the -50s, not a skeeter in sight.
 
WOW Boomer that sounds exactly like the place I've been dreaming about moving to...

NOT...

The grass is already growing here and tons of flowers are out.
 
My boy trying out his new to him Puma M92 Trapper in 44mag.

Got rained out at work so was able to get his shortened butt stock installed and get him to the range after school.

Have some feeding issues that I am trying to work out by changing the OAL and crimp on my loads have it close now but I will need to do an action job someday as well.

Claven2 you called it he definitely does not like the hotter 240gr loads but he is super happy with my lighter 180gr Rem JHP loads cool part of this combo is I can work up my loads to fit him as he gets bigger.

Puma_M92_44mag_Jaiden_s_9th_Birthday_Present_Feb_29_2016.JPG
 
BC30cal said:
Leavenworth;
Welcome to the forum from the sometimes sunny south Okanagan sir.

I'll preface this by saying that we live where yard bears are quite common, we've tented all over BC in some very high bear density areas, have hunted and killed bears and have been there when other hunters have shot more bears.

Much more educational than the previous qualifiers, we've cut and wrapped over a dozen black bears for friends over the years and from doing those defacto necropsies have developed theories on what works to kill bears and what does not.

Lastly I've made a point to research what works on bears with other hunters and guides which I trust to give me the straight goods on what worked well and again what didn't.

With that out of the way then, this is what I built for our daughter to use as a tenting arm. If you are a parent and are building something upon which their life might depend - well it's a different process for sure, sobering to say the least.

http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/foru...Scattergun-Builds-and-Discussion-Thread/page7

In another thread on bear firearms I opined that within reason it doesn't matter what you use - as in pump vs. semi-auto vs. break action or pistol grip vs. traditional stock - what matters is that you are very, very used to working the controls in a life threatening situation and that your tool of choice works PERFECTLY each and every time. Everything else after that is personal choice or nothing more than fluff.

Hopefully that was useful information for you or someone out there considering the same thing. Good luck on your choices and by all means if you think I can answer any questions then I'll do my best to do so. May none of us ever need to use our bear repellent guns for anything other than practice.

Dwayne
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Based on the autopsies, what slug is best?
 
Ganderite;
Good evening to you sir, I hope the day treated you acceptably well.

I apologize if I gave the impression that any of the bears we cut up over those years were killed with shotgun slugs as emphatically that wasn't the case, they were all killed with rifles of quite a few different chamberings.

The bears we did ranged considerably in size for sure, but even more so in fat content and I'd say that this was the greatest difference in how the rifle bullets performed, so the lighter built bullets like a Sierra Match King or some of the earlier Ballistic Tips opened up earlier on in the entrance wound side than was perhaps optimum.

Then too, most of the bears were shot broadside initially and I'd have to make an educated guess that most defense shootings are going to be front on shots, where penetration of any projectile could well be critical.

Right now based on research and testing done by others, I'd say the Challenger is the leader in penetration as far as slugs one can actually buy in Canada. If I could find Brenneke slugs here then the Challenger would move to second place.

An interesting slug out of Latvia - Ddupleks - which is solid steel would be really cool to run some tests on, but so far I've only found them for sale in the US and haven't been able to find an importer.... so far.

Anyway sir, again I apologize if I misled anyone - it was not my intent. Hopefully that was clear and somewhat useful information and as always may none of us ever need our bear firearms - whatever we choose to pack.

Dwayne
 
Short barrel Mossberg or Remington Wingmaster . Hmmmmm... Okay some on another forum have mentioned instead of buying a new shotgun as a bear defense weapon I should look at finding an older Remington Wingmaster from the 60's or 70's ,better quality .Apparently you can pick up these guns for not a whole lot of money either that are in good shape . I guess they are saying that it's the action that is great on those shotguns. So if I go this route I will need to buy a short barrel for this gun that is steel shot friendly if I choose to use shot and slugs .
Leavenworth
 
Honestly any 12g that is 20” or less in barrel length will do you, 2 3/4”-3” chamber. I’d take rifle sights first and then ghost rings, I’ve used vent rib, bead, ghost rings and rifle sights. For slugs I prefer rifle sights, look at Rem 870 or Mossberg 500/590 lines. Tried and true, then use it and get comfortable with it. Sight it in and make sure you can hit what you aim at with it.
 
I'm still on this topic so I have a question, in fact I'm probably still on a lot of topics I have posted here !
Some have said that if I buy a short barrel bear defense 12 gauge shot gun I should get it in a modified choke , why is this ? I see Remington offers short barrelled 12 gauge shotguns in - Modified - Cylinder - Improved Cylinder - what is the difference between all these chokes and again why go the Modified route ?
Thank You !
Leavenworth
 
Leavenworth said:
I'm still on this topic so I have a question, in fact I'm probably still on a lot of topics I have posted here !
Some have said that if I buy a short barrel bear defense 12 gauge shot gun I should get it in a modified choke , why is this ? I see Remington offers short barrelled 12 gauge shotguns in - Modified - Cylinder - Improved Cylinder - what is the difference between all these chokes and again why go the Modified route ?
Thank You !
Leavenworth
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I like modified because the spread on buckshot, generally 0.5-1" per yard makes for good patterns at 5-15 yards plus there is no issue shooting slugs through it.

I wouldn't risk shooting flares or crack flare through it, cylinder or improved cylinder for those specialty shells.
 
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