Being in the stand before first light

Status
Not open for further replies.
Well lets agree to disagree !

Sure thing. We can debate and still shake hands (virtually).

Did you notice this little nugget in that Act. What other acts contain a section like this?

These are the common law defences to a strict liability offence, spelled out in plain and obvious terms. Not something you see in every piece of legislation that contains regulatory offences, but sometimes present.
 
You are wrong. Read the entire definition of hunting. I say it again, you are wrong. 100 percent, completely wrong. Do not pass go, do not collect $200 wrong.



Its not a matter of my opinion. That's how the law reads. How it is being applied by individual COs may be a different story, and thankfully so, but that doesn't change the black letter of the law. Don't kill the messenger.

Edit: Let me draw an analogy for you. If the speed limit in a given area is 100 kph, you are perhaps very unlikely to get stopped and ticketed for speeding if you were going 105 kph. Depending on the police officer who stops you, his/her mood and your own response to being stopped, you might not even get ticketed for 110 kph (or even more). But, at the end of day, the speed limit remains 100 kph.
 
hunting” includes,

(a) lying in wait for, searching for, being on the trail of, pursuing, chasing or shooting at wildlife, whether or not the wildlife is killed, injured, captured or harassed, or

(b) capturing or harassing wildlife,

except that “hunting” does not include,

(c) trapping, or

(d) lying in wait for, searching for, being on the trail of or pursuing wildlife for a purpose other than attempting to kill, injure, capture or harass it, unless the wildlife is killed, injured, captured or harassed as a result,

and “hunt” and “hunter” have corresponding meanings; (“chasse”, “chasser”, “chasseur”)

Section d covers being in the woods with an encased gun. While gun is encased you do not have the intent to kill, harass, etc the wildlife. At legal shooting time, take your gun out of the case and no you are hunting.
 
Now let's take it a little further and look at "night hunting"...

20 (1) A person shall not, during the period from half an hour after sunset to half an hour before sunrise,

(a) hunt wildlife;

(b) have a firearm in the person’s possession in an area usually inhabited by wildlife, unless the firearm is unloaded and encased; or

(c) shine a light for the purpose of hunting wildlife.
 
Now let's take it a little further and look at "night hunting"...

20 (1) A person shall not, during the period from half an hour after sunset to half an hour before sunrise,

(a) hunt wildlife;

(b) have a firearm in the person’s possession in an area usually inhabited by wildlife, unless the firearm is unloaded and encased; or

(c) shines a light for the purpose of hunting wildlife.

By CV32's stance, you could be charged for C if you walk in with a flashlight:D
 
Has it occurred to you gentleman that maybe CV32 likes to advocate the opposing view just to rile folks up, because he can, and it's fun, at least for him anyways.

I do enjoy a good debate, particularly if folks can stay rational and not get too emotional or butt-hurt about the whole thing. As I said much earlier in the thread (post #34), my intent is not to aggravate or scare anyone, but rather to point out the frailties of the wording of the legislation, the risks we as hunters take, and just how much rests with the personal interpretations and prejudices of any given conservation officer.

You are wrong. Read the entire definition of hunting. I say it again, you are wrong. 100 percent, completely wrong. Do not pass go, do not collect $200 wrong.

I don't agree with you, if that wasn't obvious by now.

hunting” includes,
(a) lying in wait for, searching for, being on the trail of, pursuing, chasing or shooting at wildlife, whether or not the wildlife is killed, injured, captured or harassed, or
(b) capturing or harassing wildlife,
except that “hunting” does not include,
(c) trapping, or
(d) lying in wait for, searching for, being on the trail of or pursuing wildlife for a purpose other than attempting to kill, injure, capture or harass it, unless the wildlife is killed, injured, captured or harassed as a result, and “hunt” and “hunter” have corresponding meanings; (“chasse”, “chasser”, “chasseur”)

Section d covers being in the woods with an encased gun. While gun is encased you do not have the intent to kill, harass, etc the wildlife. At legal shooting time, take your gun out of the case and no you are hunting.

Now let's take it a little further and look at "night hunting"...

20 (1) A person shall not, during the period from half an hour after sunset to half an hour before sunrise,
(a) hunt wildlife;
(b) have a firearm in the person’s possession in an area usually inhabited by wildlife, unless the firearm is unloaded and encased; or
(c) shine a light for the purpose of hunting wildlife.

You separated this reply into three different posts, but I will combine them here for the sake of clarity.

Section 1(1)(d) above, in the interpretation section, is intended to apply to folks who are in the woods and looking for wildlife for a purpose other than taking it, e.g. naturalists, photographers, researchers, etc. If you are a hunter, sitting in your tree stand or ground blind with your license and hunting gear, your purpose for being there is to attempt to kill wildlife and section 1(1)(d) does not apply to you.

Section 20(1) has three component parts, any one of which is sufficient to ground the offence. You can be "hunting" under 20(1)(a) (in which case we can return to the definition outlined in 1(1)(d) above); OR, you can have an loaded, uncased firearm in your possession under 20(1)(b); OR or you can be 'spotlighting' under 20(1)(c).

Section 20(1)(b) is the clearest of the three. I think we all probably agree on that.

Section 20(1)(c) is a little more interesting and M16LR.50 raised it below:

By CV32's stance, you could be charged for C if you walk in with a flashlight:D

More on that in a bit. But, moving on to Section 20(1)(a), this is the most challenging of the three possibilities, and the subject matter of the most debate.

So, here's an illustration:

Sunrise is at 6:30 AM. Legal light is at 6:00 AM. While enroute to your tree stand at 5:30 AM, you come across the tracks of what you think is the big buck that's been dodging you all season. Its still pretty dark, so you pull out the flashlight (gun still encased) and try to get an idea of where the tracks are headed. You follow them with the light for a bit, and slowly realize that you know where he is bedding down. It will take roughly half an hour to get there, and hopefully at 6:01 AM you will be in a position to pop him in his bed. You start off in that direction, following the tracks, using the flashlight as necessary to keep on the trail.

Have you been hunting under the definition found in 1(1)(d)? Before legal light, have you committed an offence under section 20(1)?
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom