Best budget .223 rifle?

I have a Tikka TX3 CTR 6.5 PRC.
The Local CT has a 110 with crossfire scope , on for 750,
I have 300 CT money so im leaning towards it.
I can get the Savage for 450 + taxes.
I’ll more than likely chop the barrel down to 18 inches.

They had a Rem 700 ,SS HB but not sure if it’s still there.
 
mmcintyre1220 said:
Neat little rifle, I just wish it had some form of accuracy to it. For a company to build a rifle in 2022 that claims it can shoot 1.5 MOA is an utter embarrassment.
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I had the barrel on mine changed out under warranty, as the first had some problems with consistency. I've yet to shoot it with the new barrel, but from what I've seen from BCL; is that they are standing behind their product 100%.

With respect to the accuracy guarantee of 1.5moa - It is my understanding that is with average ammunition and one should be able to glean better from them with handloading or match ammo tuned to the rifle.


conor_90 said:
Isn’t it a 3 lug 60 degree throw design?
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Yes, you are correct - 3 lug, 60 degrees mini action.

conor_90 said:
Talking to a few buddies who work at gun stores the first round of them was absolutely brutal, including one I looked at. Made the Ruger American look like a SAKO

Maybe this has changed but from what I’ve seen of friends BCL guns that are now banned I doubt it.
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Well, I've played with the Ruger American and while I think they are great for the money, I don't believe for one second people are getting sub moa consistently with them and the stocks on them are fit for the recycle bin. I think if BCL can nail down the barrel quality, they will be the better buy of the two.
 
The savage non accutrigger is lousy. I tried cutting the trigger spring down a bit but I still hate it. Have a savage with accutrigger and it is good.
 
Yes I’m sure the BCL would shoot well if it had a good barrel; just like it would be even remotely similar to a rem 700 if it had a totally different design. What a strange post

You don’t believe Ruger Americans can shoot but you are advocating for a gun that has a 1.5 moa guarantee you had to return on warranty for “inconsistency” because you believe it could do better if they hand picked each barrel?
 
one of my Savage 11 at 100m
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I have a Howa 1500 Remington 223. I bought it cause a friend said, for shooting targets but thinking longer distance someday, the 223 would be a good choice, then the LGS suggested the same caliber and handed me the Howa. I upgraded (I think) the scope to the Vortex Diamondback 4-12 from the standard "Stirling?". Since I own one,a Howa 1500, I have since been researching. I have learned a lot since buying it but still lots to learn. Here is what I have learned. The barrel has a 1:8 twist so likes heavier bullets. Heavier bullets are harder to find in a 223 remington, the 55grain being the norm, off the shelf. Others are available but at a cost. My groups are getting better as I learn about bench technique but in one shoot, the off the shelf 55 grain was beaten severely by a 60 grain hand load. That was my first reloading adventure, ever. I asked a gunsmith/barrel maker here in Canada if he thought the Howa was worth me putting a new heavy barrel on it and he said definitely. He said he like the Howa action. Which backs up that the Howa gets good reviews, in general. If I understand correctly, (I am new and still learning), it is a decent rifle, for its price. I don't have a lot to compare to but I think it is a good, center fire starter rifle. A heavier barrel would be nice.
 
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conor_90 said:
Yes I’m sure the BCL would shoot well if it had a good barrel; just like it would be even remotely similar to a rem 700 if it had a totally different design. What a strange post
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For your first point: It is my understanding that the barrels on the early guns were of questionable quality and consistency - as was my experience - which has been changed under warranty.
As to the second: I misspoke about the similarity of it being similar to a 700, and corrected that by stating such.
What part of the above do you find strange?

conor_90 said:
You don’t believe Ruger Americans can shoot...
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No, I think the Ruger Americans can shoot just fine for what they are. Do I think they are consistent sub moa (1/3 posted by one fellow in several posts) at 100m? No, not a chance. I've seen a few 5 round groups that hover around (just under to just over) 1 moa. I think once some of these groups are fired for 10 on score we are going to see the mpi and group expand to something similar to how most guns in this price point are going to really shoot.

conor_90 said:
...but you are advocating for a gun that has a 1.5 moa guarantee you had to return on warranty for “inconsistency” because you believe it could do better if they hand picked each barrel?
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I'm suggesting they might be an option for someone looking for an inexpensive .223 bolt gun, yes.
I didn't say anything about a hand picked barrel, but if someone was to purchase one and it didn't meet the expectations of the manufacturer's guarantee, my experience with BCL has been good.

Guarantees are not necessarily indicative of how a rifle will shoot, and most firearms from differing manufacturers with such a guarantee will shoot better than the minimum.
I do believe BCL are currently in the process of or have switched barrel suppliers, so it looks to me that they are addressing inconsistency with earlier products.
 
Nice groups you shot there.

Here is my 20" medium contour 119 yard outside group with my Savage .223 Hog Hunter using a bipod, 75 grain Hornady Match, dime in picture for comparison, love the trigger.


While only 48 yards (it was cold I was at an indoor range) 12.5" BCL 5.56 reloads 55 grain off bipod with a 6 power Bushnell scope with a post reticle, also love this trigger and all metal stock, no cheesy tupperware.


I like my BCL Bison, while I have handled the Rugers the tupperware stock is a no go for me, just feels cheesy. The Bison can use AR and their own magazines, so if the Turd goes after AR magazines I will have a choice unlike all other bolt actions that can only use AR mags.....
 
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beltfed said:
I had the barrel on mine changed out under warranty, as the first had some problems with consistency. I've yet to shoot it with the new barrel, but from what I've seen from BCL; is that they are standing behind their product 100%.

With respect to the accuracy guarantee of 1.5moa - It is my understanding that is with average ammunition and one should be able to glean better from them with handloading or match ammo tuned to the rifle.




Yes, you are correct - 3 lug, 60 degrees mini action.



Well, I've played with the Ruger American and while I think they are great for the money, I don't believe for one second people are getting sub moa consistently with them and the stocks on them are fit for the recycle bin. I think if BCL can nail down the barrel quality, they will be the better buy of the two.
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I 100% agree, ex NEA new BCL have outstanding customer service. I bought a 12.5 556 barrel from them years ago that had MAJOR headspace issues. It swallowed a field gauge with ease. I sent them a video of me checking the headspace and had me send in the barrel for replacement. Once it arrived at their shop they called me to confirm that the barrel is toast and they will be replacing it. Unfortunately they didn't have any 12.5's in stock but asked if I would accept one of their newly designed 14.5 barrels instead. I accepted it and it was perfect when it arrived. Around 2-3 months I had a package arrive from BCL. Inside was a brand new 12.5 barrel, gas block and gas tube with a note stating it was on them. I have no issues supporting BCL and am in no way against them. I will be buying the bison in 300BLK with a 12.5 barrel for testing.

I see that you are in Calgary so unfortunately I cant show you in person however, I would love to show you a few targets shot with my Ruger American Ranch 556. I consistently shoot sub MOA with my average grouping being around .33MOA with my Hornady 68 grain BTHP Match handloads. Even with my bulk run of the mill 55 grain plinking reloads I am usually around 1-1.1 MOA. My nosler 77 grain BTHP match handloads average 1/2 MOA all day every day also. The gun is cheap as hell and the stock feels like a piece of recycled plastic however, the performance is simply amazing. It outshoots my tikka t3x ctr all day every day.

I ordered the magpul hunter stock that uses ACIS mags. This not only takes away the crappy factory stock but allows me to load a bit longer as the ACIS mags are a bit bigger than STANAG mags.
 
My buddy had a Ruger but upgraded to a T3 very nice rifle, I find the bolt and trigger very smooth on my Savages and now BCL. Just cannot warm up to tupperware stocks, but at over $1000.00 for a metal stock I opted for the BCL as opposed to restocking my Savage. I ended up bolting on all my AR parts on it, the buttstock looks odd but I like dialing in the stock to fit me. My Bison does not like heavy ammo where my Savage prefers heavy ammo.

Prefer 5.56 rifles over my old .308 as I mostly paper punch and do varmint hunting. My kids enjoy the lack of recoil, they like my odd looking Bison.
 
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What part of the above do you find strange?
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That you are suggesting a gun that you had to return for multiple warranty issues? Based on the “what if” that it had a better barrel.

Americans already have good barrels it’s about all they have going for them, I’m no fan. I just owned one that was accurate and functioned well
 
I have a Vanguard 22" heavy barrel in a Boyd's Target Thumbhole stock, 9" twist and a Howa1500 Mini, 20" heavy barrel, 8" twist, and I really like them both. They both handle lighter bullets OK, but prefer 55gr. and up. My only issue is on the Mini, the bolt guide rib in the receiver puts a little dent on the case when you eject it because the spring is so strong, but I just grab them on the way out anyway.
 
conor_90 said:
That you are suggesting a gun that you had to return for multiple warranty issues? Based on the “what if” that it had a better barrel.

Americans already have good barrels it’s about all they have going for them, I’m no fan. I just owned one that was accurate and functioned well
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Although I've had other small issues with the MRX, I returned the rifle to BCL over only one issue - the barrel; not multiple warranty issues.
The fact they offer a guarantee at all is worth considering. No one in this price point offers such a decree that I'm aware of.


Am I going to recommend a rifle that is not 100% trouble free? I have in the past with quality firearms, so why not now with ones that are made on a budget? Especially if I get the service I have received from the manufacturer?


I've got a Sako TRG on which the trigger crapped out in the middle of a BCRA Tac match many years ago.
I have a Knight's SR25 that choked on the bolt carrier group firing pin retaining pin - locked up the gun with less than 20 rounds through it (the pin was slightly undersized and walked out of the carrier mid-firing).
Two exceptional quality firearms that had issues, but are otherwise cream of the crop. The point is that even exceptional firearms have issues and are not immune to parts breakage or issues stemming from manufacture.
 
Must be another beltfed posting this on the black and green PR forum

While the build quality appears pretty good overall, I've had some teething issues with the bolt guide shearing off, failures to feed, failures to extract and light primer strikes.
I have reached out to BCL and they have been great with warranty and some parts replacement (extractor and the bolt guide).
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Some guys on the forum have a really funny definition of quality so you are in good company at least

If you can find a used CZ527 in your price range, I'd recommend that over the other choices in your original post.
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This is some great advice imo
 
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conor_90 said:
Must be another beltfed posting this on the black and green PR forum
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What, you think I don't know what I've posted elsewhere on this forum?
If you read the post above - I've stated that I've had other minor issues - none of which required anything other than changing the bolt guide, a spring and the extractor detent (that I lost - no fault of the manufacturer).
Feeding and function with AR mags is going to be a hit or miss proposition on most guns that are designed for the STANAG pattern.
The only warranty item that required me to send the rifle back to BCL was the barrel.

conor_90 said:
Some guys on the forum have a really funny definition of quality so you are in good company at least
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Nice passive aggressive slight.
I see you have little concept of scale of costs associated with build quality. Either that or you have preconceived notions and/or an axe to grind.

Probably a bit of both. I get it.
In the past I've done home based 'gun smithing' to make NEA AR stuff fit on an otherwise in-spec AR, and I too bought into the early BCL 102.
If you have an axe to grind, so be it.

For others, they may want to keep an open mind.
 
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