Black Aces Tactical - Final Review.

BlackAcesTactical said:
Tarek, works just fine for me, and for my many, many other customers. But then again they also didn't completely destroy their shotgun and then have the nerve complain about it. Oh by the way, I got your email and I won't be extorted.



Really.. maybe if you had approached me with any concern you may have instead of demanding money in exchange for a favorable opion. Good day, sir.

Click to expand...


Might as well put the whole thing up so people don't think I'm extorting you for a springbok refund...

Hi guys,

I finally took receipt of my Shotgun.
Receiver and Bolt carrier group look to be well made.

Springbok not so much; I was disappointed to see uneven lines of a
dremel in the magtube (not milled) and I honestly don't feel it's
worth the $296 you guys are charging.

The 10rnd mags are also unreliable if loaded to max capacity; often
many shells will stagger/jump overtop the rim of the shell below it
causing a catastrophic failure (the bolt will remain locked open.) The
problem only occurs when loading 8-10rnds - 7 or less seems fine.

The 5rnd mags work well.

I want to like this gun, I think you guys have a great idea... but the
springbok should be discontinued.

The 10-rnd magazines should also come with a disclaimer that they only
function reliably with 7 or less shells inserted.

So. What do you say? Springbok refund? It'd be most appreciated and go
a long way in my opinion.

I've since removed it and am now shopping around for a factory replacement tube.



On a side note, will Black Aces Tactical be getting any sourced out
custom magazines made?
I believe that the magazine issue is the only thing keeping your
product from being a huge success.

A great gunsmith (Jo at DLASK) once told me "A firearm is only as good
as the magazines that feed it."

Again, I am not looking for a full-refund, but, I definitely feel a
refund on the springbok option would be fair.

I do think you have a decent product, a diamond in the rough at this
stage. But I am willing to ride this out to completion.

Looking forward to a reply,
Thanks again,
 
If I wasn't in CGN time out I would change my Para avatar to a new one . I hate timeouts....

On a serious note, That email is seriously nice, I would of used more colorful words.... lol...
 
Unfortunately everyone hops on the first review up and clings to it like gospel. Nothing against G37, as everyone is entitled to their own views.

I've been talking to Eric from BAT, as well as Jason from IRG staying updated on the process as it was my first time importing a firearm from the US. Every time I contacted either of them, whether it was via email, phone or facebook, I always had a reply within a day. Customer service has been outstanding on both sides, and have gone out of their way to make sure I was satisfied. After making changes to my order, there was miscommunication on how many magazines were to be included. To make things right, Eric is sending out another on his dime through IRG to settle up my order. Not the end of the world as I have more than enough magazines for a suitable range review.

As for IRG, due to my special requirements for shipping, they bumped up my delivery to a more expensive method for the same base rate.

At the end of the day, both companies went above and beyond to make sure I was satisfied. Both will have my business again, especially when the semi auto version and stackable magazines are released.

Range video coming soon :)
 
Totally fair.

Looking forward to the review.

I'm already feeling better about it with the 10-rnd mags feeding properly now.
I've also ordered a new magtube from Brownells so as far as I am concerned I'm good.

And I wasn't speculating on the mags, but I am aware that perhaps mine were a problematic batch. (the 5rnds were good though! ;))
IMG_20141101_194604_zps56ca5e66.jpg
 
BlackAcesTactical said:
Works just fine for me, and for my many, many other customers. But then again they also didn't completely destroy their shotgun and then have the nerve complain about it. Oh by the way, I got your email and I won't be extorted.



Really.. maybe if you had approached me with any concern you may have instead of demanding money in exchange for a favorable opion. Good day, sir.

Click to expand...

Did you make those horrible cuts in the bottom tube?. If I did work that bad I would be fired and or beaten with a vice handle.
 
I have been on the fence between ordering one of these, or the other mag-fed shotgun from Adaptive Tactical.

This thread has certainly pushed me towards the latter.
 
"Made in the USA" should mean better quality than "Made in Turkey".

The SAP-6 from Tactical Imports looks like a much better choice, especially once they get the longer threaded barrels and bigger mags.
 
BlackAcesTactical said:
Works just fine for me, and for my many, many other customers. But then again they also didn't completely destroy their shotgun and then have the nerve complain about it. Oh by the way, I got your email and I won't be extorted.



Really.. maybe if you had approached me with any concern you may have instead of demanding money in exchange for a favorable opion. Good day, sir.

Click to expand...

FAIL.

We represent current and prospective customers. If you can't be professional enough to consider our feedback and suggestions for improvements to your product than your business is doomed. I really liked the look of your shotguns and was waiting to hear a review before plunking down the CC. Your response however, has provided us with considerable insights as to what dealing with you would be like. I'll now give my money to a more reputable company who stands behind their polished product.
 
Huntactical said:
FAIL.

We represent current and prospective customers. If you can't be professional enough to consider our feedback and suggestions for improvements to your product than your business is doomed. I really liked the look of your shotguns and was waiting to hear a review before plunking down the CC. Your response however, has provided us with considerable insights as to what dealing with you would be like. I'll now give my money to a more reputable company who stands behind their polished product.
Click to expand...

^what he said^
 
I don't have a dog in this fight but to see the poor level of workmanship and the way it's been handled by BAT is disappointing. I can understand if no refund is given but there should have been some means available to replace the components to ones manufactured properly.

I guess it sucks being a BETA tester for the Canadian market.
 
Will take video today after work for final review; I'll also add the final review to front of thread (will keep original below it) so as to give a more "friendly" view on it.

I've also got an opinion on the design of the feed lips which are necessary for the gun to function in its current design which will no doubt cause BAT to blow a gasket; there is a reason why the feed lips on every magazine in existence are roughly 1/4~1/5 the length of the OAL of a cartridge (or shotgun shell.)

Transporting loaded magazines in a range-bag and the feed lips are only 5mm in length (Saiga Mags have 15mm feed lips), well, I'll let you guys guess what happens after a 40minute drive in the car :S

***Magazines are loosely tossed into a large bag*** (perhaps mag pouches would be a none issue - to be fair.)

There is a reason why they are this short though, it's because the BOLT SLIDE would not be able to strip the shell on a non-modified Saiga mag (it'd ride too low and skip overtop). As I said, there are some quirks but in the end, it does work.

My opinions only and my experiences. Not here to taint the experience for anyone else.
I'm leaning heavily to range toy, you'd not go hiking and use this for bear defense (or zombie apocalypse ;) although you would look cool as hell if you did :D.)

Cheers~
 
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Question for you G37:
With a fully loaded mag (out of the gun) what happens when you drop it or flick your wrist while holding onto it?
Does it:
A) spit all the contents out,
B) The top shell stands up, or
C) Nothing, you can get aggressive with the handling and the shells stay put.

Thanks :)
 
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Hey all, I'm back.

As promised I just came back from a trip to the range (video to come).
I'll try to keep this short and sweet and give some good constructive criticism.



Disclaimer: These are only my experiences and opinions. I did take it apart and put it back together, so please keep this in mind.



THE GOOD:

Shotgun works!



Yes, I was able to put approximately 80-shells (Trap#7's and 00-Buckshot) into the target/burm with little effort.

IMG_20141103_135131_zps7da75a7f.jpg


The 5-rnd magazines worked well, the 10-rnd magazines were very stiff stripping off the top 3 shells, but from then on the ease at which the action worked was comparable to that of the 5-rnd Magazines.

That's really it.
It works and that is good at the end of the day.



THE BAD:

I've probably spent at least 6-8hours looking over this shotgun and trying to decide what to do with it. As I said several time, it's beautiful. The receiver looks very well made as does the bolt and bolt slide.

I never doubted that it wouldn't work. My gripe was with the build quality of certain parts (i.e. Springbok and magazine-modifications.)

The magazine modifications: My only beef with the mags really boils down to the "machining" used to modify each mag.
The magazines also do not lend themselves well to rough treatment when loaded (if you drop one the right way, shells will spew.)

The mags cannot be carried loaded and loosely, shells will pop making need for Saiga-magpouches mandatory (if one ever had a need to carry loaded mags.)

I've already mentioned that I feel the springbok is not worth the price it commands.
The manufacturing of the springbok was outright terrible to the point that my mag tube wasn't even indexed properly when the cuts were made. Perhaps BAT might have replaced this had I sought a replacement first, we'll never know at this stage of the game.

BTW, I challenge anyone here to find a photo of the Springbok system on the BAT website. If found, please post link here. Why would BAT not display/explain this feature on their site?
That's all I'll say about that. Make your own call on that option when placing your order.





CONCLUSION:

The gun as it is, is a great range toy.
The shooter will not experience any problems sitting at a bench (or standing) and blasting away. If this is all you do, then you will enjoy this gun.
Oh, and it does look Fantastic! That is the reason I bought it afterall. ### appeal does indeed sell.

I have some ideas for improvements, but there is no point in my mentioning them here, or ever.
If you want a shotgun for protection of any kind, it is my non-professional opinion that a traditional tube fed shotgun be used instead.

Feel free to disagree with me, but I paid the big money so I get to give my opinion on the product that I bought.
As I said in my earlier post I was willing to see this thing to the end... but it's clear this is it.

Cheers~
 
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