Brnos.........?

257Roberts said:
This is a great deal of info.
I have just acquired a BRNO Model 1 with a 5 digit serial # and 57 by the proof mark both on the bbl and receiver.
Did a full disassembly and cleaning all the grease left there. It has hardly been used at all.
The trigger is similar to the old Model 70, unlike some of the ones I have seen on the interweb.
It has a Bakelite but pad with a swirled circle and a Z in the middle, the same cymbal in on the bbl beside the
BRMO MOD 1.
With all the BRNO fans out there I hope that someone could tell be more about this rifle.
Any one know where to pick up a set of 1" scope rings for this Model. It has a wide dovetail.

It's no 257Roberts but a great older rifle.

David
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My 452 drove me bawnkers trying to find the prawper mounts for the receiver grewves.
Lost count on the rings I purchased.
Some worked, but dint appear right.

Rimfire Central has a chart on what is witch.
 
On male dovetails, Europeans will tend to measure the top widest edge to edge and name it that - so like 11mm, 16mm, 17mm, etc. - use a caliper and measure for yourself. North American tend to measure down on bottom - the thinnest area - like the distance between the cutter tips - so, many "3/8" North American dovetails will measure circa 12.5 mm or so across the tops - I find it very difficult to measure down in there - need something with like a knife-edge to do so.

Is known that for a time various CZ 452 were in North America with EITHER a 3/8" OR an 11 mm dovetail. Warne does make a 1" ring that has a reversible clamp - has a mark on it - mark up or down for the width of the dovetail that it gets installed on - 3/8" or 11 mm.

Each of European and North American have different side angles on their dovetails as well - 60 and 45 degree - but I forget which went with which.

Go here - scroll down a bit - is useful discussion about rimfire dovetails - European versus North American -

https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/2210741-dovetail-scope-mount?highlight=dovetail
 
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Just to further confuse things, there are several Brnos around that came from the factory with a model 1 stamped barrel with a model 2 receiver. I’ve seen maybe a dozen or more of these. They were all date stamped 57’. I have always speculated that they are pre-model 5’s, but I really don’t know. I’ve personally owned 3 of them and have friends with a few more. I think there’s one in the exchange right now.
 
jes said:
Just to further confuse things, there are several Brnos around that came from the factory with a model 1 stamped barrel with a model 2 receiver. I’ve seen maybe a dozen or more of these. They were all date stamped 57’. I have always speculated that they are pre-model 5’s, but I really don’t know. I’ve personally owned 3 of them and have friends with a few more. I think there’s one in the exchange right now.
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It seems you have something there, the trigger I have is defiantly a later version. My receiver as a matt finish and I have read there where some refurbished rifles with matt finish receivers.
All in all I really like it and cant wait to shoot it this weekend.
Just need to find some 1" rings for that 16mm dovetail. The scope that came with the rifle is a 3/4" with Parker Hale rings, it will do for now.
 
257Roberts - somehow, I discovered that the rings made for CZ 527 rifles have 16 mm dovetails - the Warne brand that I bought uses a single cap screw screwed into the bottom of the ring as a recoil stop for the CZ 527 - remove that screw and the rings fit perfect to the 16 mm dovetail on a BRNO. I installed a 2-7x33 Leupold Freedom Rimfire scope on my BRNO No. 1 with Warne "Quick Detach" rings - I think the iron sights are not too bad and wanted to have them available - that needed the High Warne 2B1LM rings - fits and looks good with the Medium height 1B1LM rings, but the bolt handle hits the eye piece - so I used the High version to resolve that.
 
can someone explain why some BRNO's have a parkerized/matt finish on the barrel and/ or receiver- and other dont?

ive seen BRNO 4's with both - i had one BRNO 4 which had the matt finsih barrel and receiver-

where they arsenal rebuilds? do bolts have engraved serial numbers to match the receiver ( last 3 digits)
 
maxy - it would be interesting to figure that out. My BRNO No. 1 left factory apparently 1955 - so 67 or 68 years "out in the wild" - hard to say by looking at it now what was done at factory then, and what has been done by previous owners since then.

FYI - the rear face of the bolt handle on this one has "340" or maybe "540" - partially filled with bluing / blacking (?) - serial number on receiver ends in "776", so not same number - no clue if bolts were switched at some point, or if bolt numbers were meant to match serial number?
 
Great Thread, for a GREAT Rifle!! Owned my Model 4 HB for over 30 years well manufactured, Excellent, Well made, and Very accurate target rifle.
 
The models 1 and 3 have somewhat different actions compared to the 2, 5 and 4. The most obvious difference is the loading port. On the 1 and 3 its wide open, similar to the Winchester 52, on the 2, 4 and 5 it's more enclosed and oval in shape. That's why the the model 2 actions with the model 1 barrels confuse things, people assume they have a model 1 because that's what the barrel stamp says, but the action/ trigger are pure model 2. Other differences include the gas vent size and location, position of the safety lever and variations in the triggers. The model 1's came with two different trigger systems, one adjustable, the other much more simple and not adjustable. The model 2, 4 and 5 had a trigger very similar to the 452.
 
jes said:
The models 1 and 3 have somewhat different actions compared to the 2, 5 and 4. The most obvious difference is the loading port. On the 1 and 3 its wide open, similar to the Winchester 52, on the 2, 4 and 5 it's more enclosed and oval in shape. That's why the the model 2 actions with the model 1 barrels confuse things, people assume they have a model 1 because that's what the barrel stamp says, but the action/ trigger are pure model 2. Other differences include the gas vent size and location, position of the safety lever and variations in the triggers. The model 1's came with two different trigger systems, one adjustable, the other much more simple and not adjustable. The model 2, 4 and 5 had a trigger very similar to the 452.
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Great info jes, now if I can only remember those details ;)
Rob
 
This is great information. It seems that there could be some hybrids out there between 1's an 2's.
They are still great rifles even if they are a mixed up lot. The thing that confuses me is that the bbl. and receiver both have 57 by the proof marks if they are or have been arsenal rebuilds.
My bolt handle has the last 2 digits of my serial# so they seem to be a match.
I was told that I am the second owner of this rifle and the guy that originally owned it is 90 years old, and not sure when he bought it.

Thanks for the the info on the rings Potashminer I will be looking into that.
jes you seem to know your BRNOS, can you post pictures of the loading port between a 1 and 2.

David
 
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I’m not at home right now, but I’ll try to take some pictures tomorrow. If you zoom in on Diver’s pictures you can kind of get an idea. The top rifle, model 4 is much more closed in than the lower model 3. Remember, models 1 and 3 had the same action, models 2, 4 and 5 shared the same action.
 
It looks like I have a #2 action with a #1 bbl and sights. I believe I probably have a arsenal rebuild.
Is the 57 on the action and bbl the date of manufacture?
I have also read that the last 2 #s of the serial# were the date of mfg.

David
 
Yes, the 57' on barrel and receiver is the date stamp. There's a lot of confusion around the serial numbers, but they don't indicate the year of mfg. What makes you think that yours is an arsenal refurbish? This is just me speculating, but I believe that the model 2 receiver with model 1 barrel were early model 5's, perhaps transitionary rifles and I think they were produced largely for export. I have two, very similar to yours that I bought from the original owners who purchased them new here in Canada. I also have a distributor catalogue from 68' (I think, would have to check) that lists the model 5.
 
jes said:
Yes, the 57' on barrel and receiver is the date stamp. There's a lot of confusion around the serial numbers, but they don't indicate the year of mfg. What makes you think that yours is an arsenal refurbish? This is just me speculating, but I believe that the model 2 receiver with model 1 barrel were early model 5's, perhaps transitionary rifles and I think they were produced largely for export. I have two, very similar to yours that I bought from the original owners who purchased them new here in Canada. I also have a distributor catalogue from 68' (I think, would have to check) that lists the model 5.
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jes, I have read that if the receiver had a matt finish it was probably a refurbished rifle, but now I am thinking it could be an assembly of factory parts left over and as you have mentioned an early #5.
Is there any identification that you know of, on the rifles that would indicate it was a #5?
As mentioned above, my action is a #2, with an oval ejection port and the bbl is marked BRNO MOD 1.

jes, you should right a book on what you know about these rifles.
 
You flatter me, but honestly I'm just a Brno fan boy. As far as the model 5 goes, you have to realize, that's what a model 5 is, a model 2 receiver with a model 1 barrel. So I believe/speculate that they just used up model 1 marked barrels before they actually started marking them as 5's. One curious thing is that although I've seen and heard of several model2/model1 combos, I've never heard of one showing up in any other country. Australia has a lot of Brnos, but no mention of them there, that I'm aware of. Same in the U.S. although they only discovered them in the last 20, 25 years. I actually had conversations with a fellow affiliated with the Blue Book who thought it might be considered a separate model. He had me send him several pictures of mine, but nothing ever came of it. I doubt we'll ever really know, as everyone that may have the answer are probably long gone. I love mine, just because they have all the wonderful Brno attributes and are unique as well.
 
jes said:
You flatter me, but honestly I'm just a Brno fan boy. As far as the model 5 goes, you have to realize, that's what a model 5 is, a model 2 receiver with a model 1 barrel. So I believe/speculate that they just used up model 1 marked barrels before they actually started marking them as 5's. One curious thing is that although I've seen and heard of several model2/model1 combos, I've never heard of one showing up in any other country. Australia has a lot of Brnos, but no mention of them there, that I'm aware of. Same in the U.S. although they only discovered them in the last 20, 25 years. I actually had conversations with a fellow affiliated with the Blue Book who thought it might be considered a separate model. He had me send him several pictures of mine, but nothing ever came of it. I doubt we'll ever really know, as everyone that may have the answer are probably long gone. I love mine, just because they have all the wonderful Brno attributes and are unique as well.
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Thanks jes
After reading more on the interweb, I am now convinced it's a #5, year 1957 #2 receiver #1 bbl and sights.
I have owned this rifle for 4 days now and have learned so much about the BRNO 22RF's.
I love the style, and the feel, it has a walnut stock, a 22.75" bbl. Can't wait till I get to shoot it. Hopefully tomorrow.
Thanks for the info.
David
 
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