Can't understand 1911

Conscript said:
You really can't compare the SA mechanism to the DA/SA of the Hi-Power. They're two different guns completely imo. Both great guns that influenced almost all of the weapon designs you see today, thats for sure.
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Yup! Both great guns that have written history but the HP is a definite improvement. No grip safety, fixed barrel linkage and it's still a SA. Only bad thing is the mag disconnect feature. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't the HP the inspiration for the CZ75 family?
 
Still alive said:
Yup! Both great guns that have written history but the HP is a definite improvement. No grip safety, fixed barrel linkage and it's still a SA. Only bad thing is the mag disconnect feature. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't the HP the inspiration for the CZ75 family?
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Yes, and the CZ-75 gave light to a whole new industry of pistols, modeled after it's design.

Both of John Browning's designs have had their lineage and blood line show up in almost every gun we see today.
 
Conscript said:
I pointed that out too as well.

I'm saying, you can't compare the two guns because they're almost entirely different under the hood. The trigger mechanism of the 1911 is completely different (Some say superior, others not) than to the Hi-Power.

It isn't fair comparing single action only guns to ones that have double action, in my opinion.
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The BHP and the 1911 are the 2 guns we are comparing, neither gun is double action?
What am I missing here?
 
Hitzy said:
The BHP and the 1911 are the 2 guns we are comparing, neither gun is double action?
What am I missing here?
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Man, are you always this retarded?

Go back and actually read what I post. Why am I always in an argument with you? Do I speak a foreign language?

Both gun's have completely different mechanical triggers, that's all I am inferring here.
 
Conscript said:
You really can't compare the SA mechanism to the DA/SA of the Hi-Power.
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Conscript said:
I pointed that out too as well.

I'm saying, you can't compare the two guns because they're almost entirely different under the hood. The trigger mechanism of the 1911 is completely different (Some say superior, others not) than to the Hi-Power.

It isn't fair comparing single action only guns to ones that have double action, in my opinion.
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Conscript said:
Man, are you always this retarded?

Go back and actually read what I post. Why am I always in an argument with you? Do I speak a foreign language?

Both gun's have completely different mechanical triggers, that's all I am inferring here.
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Uhhh again, WTF am I missing?
BHP is a single action pistol like the 1911, it's not DA ever! It does not #### the hammer when you pull the trigger....so yes you may as well be speaking another language because I can't make any sense out of these posts.
You had many outs to admit you were mistaken or don't have a clue about high powers, but here you are slinging #### and calling names like a winner.
 
Hitzy said:
Uhhh again, WTF am I missing?
BHP is a single action pistol like the 1911, it's not DA ever! It does not #### the hammer when you pull the trigger....so yes you may as well be speaking another language because I can't make any sense out of these posts.
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I'm talking about the mechanism of the trigger ffs. How many times do I have to say this in my posts?

Anyone with any knowledge of how the two guns operate and are designed, will state that yes, they are two completely different trigger mechanisms. With that understood, you can't compare them to each other.

I'm not talking about the action of the guns, I'm talking about the damn trigger mechanism FFS!
 
Interesting reading that many of the differences in the P35 design, that weren't in the specification, were the result of Browning having to avoid patent infringement on the 1911. They weren't all necessarily improvements, just necessary differences.
 
Conscript,
Browning did make a double action Hi Power in the 1980s to compete in the US service pistol trials which went to the Beretta 92F(S). It was called the HP-DA. Is this what you were referring to?
We were discussing the original Hi Power which is a single action pistol. I guess to clarify things, what is your definition of DA? I think this is what the confusion is about. We generally accept SA to mean the hammer has to be manually cocked or the slide manually cycled to #### the hammer before the gun can fire and DA to mean that the hammer is cocked and fired by simply pulling the trigger. Thank you.
 
Conscript said:
I'm talking about the mechanism of the trigger ffs. How many times do I have to say this in my posts?

Anyone with any knowledge of how the two guns operate and are designed, will state that yes, they are two completely different trigger mechanisms. With that understood, you can't compare them to each other.

I'm not talking about the action of the guns, I'm talking about the damn trigger mechanism FFS!
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Just can't admit you were wrong....calling the BHP double action....
It takes a real man to admit when he is wrong. Guess we all know where you sit to pee.
I own several BHP and 1911's btw...OH and did you know Para (and a few others) actually made double action 1911's....
Really, it's true. Messed up eh?
PO0404paraOrd-6-2.jpg
 
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Still alive said:
So did Colt! Called the Double Eagle!
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Yes, that was a huge flop....probably because it was so damn ugly lol
It's funny how Colt has such a huge aura of quality, but man the 90's were tough times....the All American 2000 was another total flop they put out around the same time...it only lasted 2 years in production.
 
Conscript said:
Yes, and the CZ-75 gave light to a whole new industry of pistols, modeled after it's design.

Both of John Browning's designs have had their lineage and blood line show up in almost every gun we see today.
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The folks at CZ seem to have got their version right..
 
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Hitzy said:
Yes, that was a huge flop....probably because it was so damn ugly lol
It's funny how Colt has such a huge aura of quality, but man the 90's were tough times....the All American 2000 was another total flop they put out around the same time...it only lasted 2 years in production.[/QUOTE]
Now you've done it! Now that ugly thing will show up on the EE as rare, NIB and worth $2000!
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Because lots of people are buying them. There are 1911 fanboys everywhere, it's the MURICAN design of a lifetime, beating Glocks and HK at absolutely everything.

Rational reasoning? None that I found.

Some buy them because they are pretty. I don't see any reason to own one, so I don't
 
r34skyline said:
Because lots of people are buying them. There are 1911 fanboys everywhere, it's the MURICAN design of a lifetime, beating Glocks and HK at absolutely everything.

Rational reasoning? None that I found.

Some buy them because they are pretty. I don't see any reason to own one, so I don't
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I'd say they make for a good target or IPSC gun if that's what you are after. Usually the target and double stack versions are a long way away from the original design as well....
For me they are functional works of art...very simple in design, can be stripped down to individual components with minimal tools, nice to shoot and feel "right" in your hand.
 
r34skyline said:
There are 1911 fanboys everywhere, it's the MURICAN design of a lifetime, beating Glocks and HK at absolutely everything.

Rational reasoning? None that I found.
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I suspect that because they were used by the US armed forces for so long that vets wanted something that they had trained on and were familiar with. Plus all the wanna-be's wanted whatever the GI's were using. I suspect that if the US forces had adopted the Hi Power in 1935, the 1911 would be a footnote in pistol history and the Hi Power seen as JMB's crowning glory.
 
Hitzy said:
I'd say they make for a good target or IPSC gun if that's what you are after. Usually the target and double stack versions are a long way away from the original design as well....
For me they are functional works of art...very simple in design, can be stripped down to individual components with minimal tools, nice to shoot and feel "right" in your hand.
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Actually I have held multiple 1911, double stack and single, I don't see what's so great about this "feel". Same goes for the CZ. While we are on the topics of the ergos, I have yet to hold anything that fits in my mitts as nice as the P30L, followed by a PPQ(Not that I trust a walther product)

I haven't found me requiring excessive tools to do a detail strip on my P30L or my friends Glock 17. And the amount of service required on it by comparison to a p226, usp, or a glock.

Sorry from any objective front the 1911 is outdated. It's a fact. You can argue it, but let's be honest, you know where that will go.

Very pretty pistol though(except a norc lol, those look like a$$). A good gi gun with ww2 history, if I have the money I'm totally down to get one.

If you want a gamer gun the actual competition guns are not really a 1911, they are tweaked and fettled to the last degree. same for the cz. The czechmate for example. not really a cz, and that's not the most extreme example, the base may have been, but the end product is very different.


Catman Do said:
I suspect that because they were used by the US armed forces for so long that vets wanted something that they had trained on and were familiar with. Plus all the wanna-be's wanted whatever the GI's were using. I suspect that if the US forces had adopted the Hi Power in 1935, the 1911 would be a footnote in pistol history and the Hi Power seen as JMB's crowning glory.
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Absolutely correct. It's a nostalogia/poser thing.
 
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