Chuck Hawks Review on Tikka's

Well, if nothing else with the advent of guns like the edge/axis, xl7, and 4x4 maybe down the road we'll start seeing more quality in the midrange priced rifles??

'Cause methinks what's really happened here is someone with a "name" finally has pointed out that the emporer has no clothes. ;)
 
He makes a good point. I own a tikka and I like it, but it is not manufactured with the finnish older guns used to have. We are in an era of maximum profit manufacturing where fit and finnish are processes that are expensive and therefore no longer available on bread and butter firearms. If we want top quality firearms we now have to pay a premium.
 
He makes a good point. I own a tikka and I like it, but it is not manufactured with the finnish older guns used to have. We are in an era of maximum profit manufacturing where fit and finnish are processes that are expensive and therefore no longer available on bread and butter firearms. If we want top quality firearms we now have to pay a premium.

Depends what you consider top dollar..$2000-$3000 is nothing..you still need optics.
 
You are right noneck. Top dollar guns can be 2 or 3 times the price of what most of us shoot. Personally I would rather have 2 or three more guns but its an individuals choice.
 
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i have a tikka T3 SS Varmint and i think its great.I have older guns too and they are fine, but i have a few questions, and comments

Detachable Mags are great for our Canadian Laws

Has anyone had issue with the plastic clip magazine? i havent but i do have issues with the metal Savage for my AClassic 114, as it improperly feeds.

you have the choice on alot to buy either wood or synthetic. there are after market ones too. maybe all the old ones were made out of wood because it wasnt invented.

price, no one wants to may more than they have to. I have never bought something from a store and gave them more money because it felt good. I dont need to tip the guy either when i buy the gun. i have a decent paying job and with all the strains from family needs having cheaper firearms is ok to have around. think of the amount of people that would not be involved in hunting, shooting, collecting if the low end gun today cost 3000. or think about how many you would have if you were able to buy them anyways at 3k. without the guy buying the stevens 300$ rifle, the sport would die. Canadian Tire and Wallymart would replace the very limited supply with different colored basketballs, or Dora the Explorer Toys. Gunstores would be rare as this would be a "rich mans" sport.

Now i dont agree with manufactures cheaping out on Quality Control (QC), like the Rem 770, i dont think it matters that Tikka uses 3 checkering patterns on the stock. Who really cares. These cost savings ways are passed on to the consumer, hopefully. If the rifles of old are so good, why isnt someone specializing in making things exactly like the old ones. Cost, ergonomics, safety, governing laws etc is why. (im not bad mouthing the old ones, i like them too but this is the truth)

My grandfather talks about the junk that the cars these days are made of plastic. "The old '54 Meteror in the trees has more metal than anything made these days." i wont disagree. but i want to go to work with something that the heater actually works in. i like having heated seats that are actually comfortable to sit in, with a decent radio that doesnt screech. I ask him about the quality about the cars now adays, then he does change his tune and says that they are a huge improvement. Bearings last, tires last, vehicles can have 100,000 miles on it and still look and drive great. Fuel milage is a different story though of course.
He buys a new car every 5 years because he likes to. He is 87 years old and still likes to go hunting with us every year with his Savage 99F.
 
Excellent debate here.

I agree with Chuck on a lot of things. His general disdain for the 400 different centerfire cartridge variants out there when a deer or a moose at the receiving end couldn't tell the difference between any of them is bang on. Ditto his thoughts about too many hunters using far too large a cartridge for their prey and likely facing significant accuracy issues due to recoil and flinching.

However, to me, guns fall in two categories: some are art, but most are just tools. My hunting rifles are almost exclusively plastic or laminate stocks and stainless steel. They all shoot better than I do in field conditions and that's what they are for. After 10 years of hard use my A bolt Stainless Stalker looks exactly like it did when I bought it, and shoots just as well too. My brother has a Tikka T3 and I think it's a fine rifle. More than accurate enough for the hunting he does. If the airline loses one of my guns or I drop it in the river or run over it with a truck I'll be out some $$ but no tears will be shed. Yes, I was born after 1960 - but I do have a couple of pieces of "art" on my wall too, including my great grandfathers model 1873 Winchester. I also truly appreciate a well finished burled walnut stock and a precisely fit action - I just don't see why I would spend all that cash to knock it about in the rain and snow. On an inflation adjusted basis, guns have never been so inexpensive. I applaud modern production methods and the innovations that allow me to have a selection of reliable, accurate, reasonably priced firearms in my safe.

Sometimes the voice of experience offers real wisdom, and sometimes they are just misremembering the good old days.

You are "preaching to the choir". My Dad's Parker Hale stays safely indoors in inclement weather, while the Savage Edge (nice reliable POS in .308) goes with me on the wet days. Furthermore, I would neither take my father-in-law's nice Rem 673 (willed to me) nor my BLR (gift from the wife) out in the wet stuff. I believe we are on the same page here in saying a that lot of the new stuff is utilitarian at best...
 
When we consider what a Remington cost in 1970 wouldnt the real dollar figure in todays terms buy a high end gun?
He makes a good point. I own a tikka and I like it, but it is not manufactured with the finnish older guns used to have. We are in an era of maximum profit manufacturing where fit and finnish are processes that are expensive and therefore no longer available on bread and butter firearms. If we want top quality firearms we now have to pay a premium.
 
Well, if nothing else with the advent of guns like the edge/axis, xl7, and 4x4 maybe down the road we'll start seeing more quality in the midrange priced rifles??

'Cause methinks what's really happened here is someone with a "name" finally has pointed out that the Emperor has no clothes. ;)

I agree with you completely up to the point where you include the Edge/Axis and the 4x4 in with 'quality midrange priced rifles'. The aforementioned are lacking in the quality department IMO. I do own the Edge and it performs very well as cheap poorly designed modern guns go...
 
I am sure my Dad paid around $100 for that 88 I have now..they sell for more than that now.. As "gun guys" I get a chuckle though from how cheap some guys are..really. $1000 is a lot?..I was at the bar last weekend dropped $465..plus a tip..like money means nothing nowdays.
 
Has anyone had issue with the plastic clip magazine? i havent but i do have issues with the metal Savage for my AClassic 114, as it improperly feeds.

The metal magazine on my 788 remington is total crap. The mostly plastic magazine on my Ruger K77/22 is great. You can have great quality in plastic and ####ty quality in metal (and vice-versa)
 
Everyone has the right to like what they like...at the end of the day..get what you can afford..and what works for you.
 
I am sure my Dad paid around $100 for that 88 I have now..they sell for more than that now.. As "gun guys" I get a chuckle though from how cheap some guys are..really. $1000 is a lot?..I was at the bar last weekend dropped $465..plus a tip..like money means nothing nowdays.

Hope you took a cab home. How was the head?

Seriously, my dad paid $75 in the mid 60s for the Parker Hale I now own (before you were born) and now it is worth $500-$600 probably. His first car, the 1955 Plymouth Savoy, was about $2000. This was a year's wages for the old guy back then. In 2010 dollar value these would be very very expensive items indeed. Probably why he only had two guns! A $1,000 dollar gun is a real deal compared to the 1960s. My point? We can still get guns as good (or even better) than the old days for a comparatively inexpensive amount. A top quality fine rifle with top optics costing $4000 today is still 'cheaper' than the old PH in the 60s.

The end.
 
Hope you took a cab home. How was the head?

Seriously, my dad paid $75 in the mid 60s for the Parker Hale I now own (before you were born) and now it is worth $500-$600 probably. His first car, the 1955 Plymouth Savoy, was about $2000. This was a year's wages for the old guy back then. In 2010 dollar value these would be very very expensive items indeed. Probably why he only had two guns! A $1,000 dollar gun is a real deal compared to the 1960s. My point? We can still get guns as good (or even better) than the old days for a comparatively inexpensive amount. A top quality fine rifle with top optics costing $4000 today is still 'cheaper' than the old PH in the 60s.

The end.

Fts...
 
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Ok... right now the one thing I hate more than cheap rifles that pretend to be high end rifles is nonecks dam huge freaking lord of the rings van mural in his sig line.... trying to read through this tread that dam thing keeps blinding me!
 
His article is not about Tikka's. He is using t-3's as an example.

The main trust of his argument is; "......flimsy, injection molded synthetic stocks are praised as "lightweight" or "weather resistant" rather than criticized as the inferior bedding platforms that they actually are. Free floating barrels, introduced simply to minimize the labor cost of precisely bedding a barreled action in a gun stock, are now praised as an asset by those who know nothing else. A perfect example of an economy shortcut becoming the new standard".

Does anybody want to take on this argument of his? If not, give the man some credit for doing something that no gun magazine dares to do anymore, out of fear of losing advertisements. That is criticizing a multinational conglomerate gun manufactures like Bretta for riping off the consumers. i say right on. We need more gun reviewers like him.
 
Ok... right now the one thing I hate more than cheap rifles that pretend to be high end rifles is nonecks dam huge freaking lord of the rings van mural in his sig line.... trying to read through this tread that dam thing keeps blinding me!

done
 
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