curious about old enfield pistol 38 s & w

saskgunowner101

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I was at a local gunshop, and noticed a couple of enfield mark 2 pistols in 38 smith and wesson. Anyone know much about these??? Value?? They're nothing special, more seem to be a curiousity than anything. Thought of getting one of these ugly ducklings.... Also curious if a guy could trim down 38 special cases for reloading these. Any reloaders tried this? Thanks in advance.
 
What do you want to know. They are great little plinkers. .38 S&W is no power house by any means. The big problem with the pistols is wear. Some have been really used and they have a lot of cylinder slop.

You can make cases out of .38 Spl. There are a bunch of original cases out there as well and you usually can find loaded ammo for fairly cheap. I load regular .38 158gr SWC with 2.0gr of W231 and it makes a nice load in the old girls and is fairly accurate.

A gun in good shape is around $200 top end. I have picked up a few and usually pay between $50 and $75 for them with the $200 being cream of the crop.

Just my 2 cents and there are probably others that will disagree with my pricing.
 
Standard British military-issue handgun through the 1930's, 1940's and into the 1950's. Manufacture commenced in 1927.

The British .380 service cartridge was, indeed, a military loading of the .38 S&W - originally with a 200 gr lead bullet, later changed to a 174 gr jacketed bullet, because of the International Convention banning "expanding bullets" in war. So .38 S&W cartridges will certainly work just fine in these revolvers, although the lighter bullets of most commercial loads will impact off point of aim somewhat.

It is not particularly practical to make .38 S&W casings by cutting down .38 Special casings, because the .38 S&W case and bullet are actually larger in diameter than the .38 Special case and bullet - see below. (In fact, a .38 S&W cartridge will not even enter a .38 Special or .357 magnum chamber.) However, since the rim diameter and rim thickness are essentially the same for both casings, you could use cut down .38 Special brass, but the body diameter would have to be "blown out" to .38 S&W dimensions. Actually, .38 S&W ammunition is still commercially loaded and sold, and casings are available, though perhaps not as common as .38 Special.

38swsm.gif


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Here's a picture of my Enfield No. 2 Mark I revolver - a rather early-dated (1931) one. Later on, the MarkI* version was adopted, in which the hammer spur was absent, so the revolver could only be fired in double-action mode. Thsi is sometimes referred to as the "Tanker Model" (supposedly because it was the Royal Armoured Corp which requested the modification because the hammer spur was prone to snag on things in the close confines of tanks and their hatches - but that doesn't explain why all Enfield revolvers were thereafter made without the hammer spur ....)

revolver_enfield_no2_mkI_04.jpg



Here's a link to the relevant Wikipedia article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enfield_revolver
 
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Do yourself a favor and skip the 38 S&W round. Oddball cartridge with nothing to recommend it. A weak sister compared to the vastly more popular 38 Special round. The final nail in the coffin is the weak action of top break revolvers.
 
Do yourself a favor and skip the 38 S&W round. Oddball cartridge with nothing to recommend it. A weak sister compared to the vastly more popular 38 Special round. The final nail in the coffin is the weak action of top break revolvers.

So, should all the muzzle stuffers forget it cause there are better more efficient firearms to shoot? You can't mean that, can you?
Surely your not telling all the break action guys that shoot the .44 Russian to "skip it"? Where is the fun in that? If you don't like that action,get a S&W Victory model in .38S&W. They are plenty tough.
The .38/200 S&W is a part of our history and I would hope that you would want to encourage someone to continue its' use instead of dumping on it.
Besides, they are a lot of fun to shoot and you cannot have too many guns of any calibre!! IMHO
 
I have three of varied age and manufacture (Albion Motors).
Oddly addictive to collect. They have specific accessories, holsters, lanyards, ammo cases.

The previous estimate of $200 top end is accurate. I've paid that for mint examples from a dealer.
 
Well, I slept on it, and its still itching the back of my brain. What exactly should I be looking for to know if they are in okay condition to shoot?? Both these pistols are beat up, one has a spur welded on, the other is the tanker version(no spur). I'm not sure what to look for cylinder/barrel wise.. Price tag is $125 for either one. Is this out to lunch?? If I told the shop to throw in a box of ammo, would it be acceptable?? I guess the bottom line is, I thought it would be a neat little project to have an odd ball gun in an odd ball caliber. I don't consider reloading a chore (still fairly new to it) and thought it would be an experience to make cases from 38 special, as long as its not dangerous. Not looking to get crazy performance out of it, cause yeah, it seems to be kind of anemic on the power scale.
 
I wouldn't mess with one with a welded on hammer spur, that is "beat up". I also don't think that a beat up I* is a good buy at $125.
You can see how tight the cylinder locks up when the trigger has been pulled and held back. It will be different than when the trigger is foreward. Make sure the cylinder rotates and locks up every try. There may be some play in the hinge and lock when the revolver is closed, but a little wiggle isn't going to do any harm. Easy enough to inspect the bore and chambers.
.38 S&W can be had, its not all that hard to find. Shortened .38 Special cases will work, they will have to expand, but the pressures are relatively low. Try loading hollow based wadcutters.
 
The 38 S&W crtge. is not an oddball one at all. It is an old one and started life with black powder. Smith and Wesson used this round in their early top break revolvers. When double action revolvers became popular in the 1890's, plenty were chambered in 38 S&W. The cartridge made the transition to smokeless powder and was very successful with a 158 gr. bullet. The Colt Police Positive and the early Detective Specials were chambered in 38 S&W as well as the S&W Military and Police Revolvers. During the 1920's Colt offerred their D frame revolvers in both 38 spec. and 38 S&W. The Police Positive was 38 S&W and the Police Positive Special was 38 spec. Smith and Wesson produced their K frame revolver in both cartridges as well. The WWII Victory models were produced in both 38 S&W and 38 spec. 38 S&W ammo is still available and is fun to reload and shoot. Can't say much on the Enfield revolvers as I've never had one, but they must be good or they wouldn't still be around.

Regards:
Rod
 
Well guys, went back for a better look. I'm now the owner (officially on tuesday) of one lil ugly duckling. The one with the welded on hammer was blued, mine is parkerized, 1942 vintage. Maybe not so beat up as I thought. Shop wouldnt budge on the price, but gave me a deal on the ammo, so it worked out good. Think it was ben hunchak that helped me out there. Will get the better half to get pics of it on the computer once it gets home. Thanks for all the input.
 
For a WWII piece the price on these things is outstanding. Standard equipment for most commonwealth troops. Allows for anyone to get into the pasttime for a song. Congrats.
 
The bore is typically, grove diamenter, .360 - .361 so standard 38 bullets will not work. They are for a .357 bore. What I am doing is swapping lead hollow points so that the hollow is against the powder and expands to catch the grove. I also set tham as deep as possible in the cartridge. Works better that way.
 
Yup, I sold you that gun, after reading this thread, maybe we should have charged you more!!....I hope you enjoy the gun, unless you hotrod the cartridge, you should get years of shooting out of it.
 
Yup, I sold you that gun, after reading this thread, maybe we should have charged you more!!....I hope you enjoy the gun, unless you hotrod the cartridge, you should get years of shooting out of it.
Much appreciated ben, and no, negative on the hotrodding! You keep me in mind next time another odd (put name here) comes in.
 
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