De Lisle carbine
- Thread starter soldier506
- Start date
That picture is of a cutaway early Sterling production De Lisle with the Lanchester Mk I sight.Unsub said:
They are not blueprints, just the patent drawings, there are many differences between them and the engineering drawings.
You can still make noise cycling the action, in order to keep the noise down you have to go slow.
The original pads that were dovetailed into the bolt were to be made from bakelite but oak was substituted on many rifles.
- Location
- Tucson, Arizona
Don't know about the DeLisle being the best, I fired a suppressed Sterling and the only sound you could hear was the bullets hitting the metal target.
This thread needed some pics and blueprints.
The Delisle is one of the best suppressed weapons ever as it fired a powerful but subsonic round and did not have the noise of a cycling action. There was even rubber pads so the bolt could be cocked very very quietly. I have heard rumors of them being used up into the 1980's and 90's.
Could you give us some areas where the Delisle was used.....we never seem to hear any action reports about this weapon...even from the Second World War...
I have read almost the same thing.
Also, there have been copied for military applications using other bolt actions: Rem, Browning, Husqvarna, Steyr.
How did they muffle the clank of the bolt hitting the breech face?
Falklands?
Yes. However, I don't know about using it in the said 90's. But if we don't know, it doesn't mean it didn't happen.
fat tony
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Hope I'm not being a buttinski here but. . .
http://www.specialinterestarms.com/#Enfield%20K
.45 Cal carbine:
Man isn't this uglee!
What do you think of this quote Mudpuppy?
"We build on No. 4 actions, the No. 1 Mk. III is just too loose to give satisfactory results."
http://www.specialinterestarms.com/#Enfield%20K
.45 Cal carbine:
Man isn't this uglee!
What do you think of this quote Mudpuppy?
"We build on No. 4 actions, the No. 1 Mk. III is just too loose to give satisfactory results."
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We will probably never hear the full history of the De Lisle and the missions they were used on. It was a SOE weapon and they were not subjected to the same record keeping of the regular armed forces, they were most likley sent on some very interesting missions.x westie said:
There are stories of them being used in France, Holland, Germany, Burma, Korea, Malaya, Northern Ireland and the Falklands. I was told by a reliable source that there is some documentary footage of a commando party landing somewhere in France during WW II, by rubber boat and then proceeding to a stone church where they meet resistance members. One of the commandos was holding a De Lisle, they left to do their thing and the film records them returning to the church and back into the boat. This is supposed to be the only recorded footage of a De Lisle in action but I have never been able to track it down.
There are rumours that the rifle has never been stricken from the records of the British military and I have spoken with a former British armourer who said he handled several of them in the mid 80's. All of them were complete and ready for service.
The initial order was for 500 rifles but the Sterling contract was cancelled after 106 were produced. There has never been confirmation as to whether the parts for the full 500 were produced. If they were, then the De Lisle could have been kept operational for a long time.
It's unlikely that it is still being used today, as there are far more advanced suppressed firearms available, but who knows?
Well all the actions used for the De Lisle were loose as they were built from rifles that were no longer suitable for service. There is no reason why they could not have used the No 4.fat tony said:
I think these guys use the No 4 because it's more readily available to them.
That folder is ugly, I prefer this style
Lee Enfield
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Republic of Alberta
Easy, the bolt never hits the breech face.
Open bolt blow-backs are designed to fire before the round is fully chambered (at least that is the theory). The cartridge is supposed to continue into the chamber during the firing sequence which is supposed to retard (slow) the cyclic speed. The concept is called "advanced primer ignition".
Apparently is doesn't really work in practice.
So the cartridge case acts as a spacer between the bolt & breech face.
Mudpuppy, is that a picture of your rifle? It looks outstanding, very convincing. Maybe I missed it, but you should have a thread on the conversion process. If I had the machinery I'd attempt to do the same. What a great way to rescue a bubba'd enfield.
Yes it's one of my rifles.
It would take way to long to type out all the work that has to be done to build the De Lisle. It's not just a matter of modifying the rifle, there is a large amount of fabrication of new parts involved.Leg said:
You REALLY have to want one to attempt the build.
This is the summary list I send to people who ask me about building a De Lisle. I usually don't hear from them again after sending it.
PARTS TO BE MODIFIED
Butt stock - hollow out for De Lisle cleaning kit
Trigger guard Assembly - attach new magwell and plate
Fore stock - cut to size
Bolt Body - cut to size & rethread and counter bore for firing pin spring (may require annealing and re-hardening), dovetail bolt handle for insert
Firing Pin - cut to size & re-thread (requires check for firing pin protrusion)
Firing Pin Spring - cut to size
Bolt head - recess face for 45 case and cut for ejector
Extractor - enlarge and re-cut for 45 case
Receiver - line bore for barrel, remove charger bridge, drill/tap for ejector assembly, enlarge existing ejector screw hole, drill/tap for barrel retaining screw, drill/tap for end cap assembly screw
Barrel - thread for receiver, barrel locknut, turn so OD fits inside line bored receiver, counter bore for bolt head, cut chamber, cut extractor recess, cut for magwell/feed ramp, profile and crown
Magazine - shorten and re-form feed lips, modify follower, weld/solder guide rib on back of mag, cut guide rib for Enfield mag catch
PARTS TO BE FABRICATED
Magwell assembly including bottom plate and magwell reinforce band
Front hand guard and attaching boss
Hand guard hangar and pins
End caps for suppressor tubes (front and rear are different)
Suppressor tube
Front swivel
Front sight protector
Front sight
Bolt insert
Suppressor support rods and end caps(2)
Barrel lock nut
Rear sight unless you can find an original Lanchester!
Stock spacer
Ejector assembly
Plus you will need screws for: front sight(2) hand guard(1) ejector assembly(1) barrel lock screw(1) end cap assembly screw(1) suppressor tube retaining screw(1)
PARTS USED AS IS
Butt plate and screws
Stock bolt and washer
Rear swivel
Rear trigger guard screw
King screw and spacer
Cocking piece
Firing pin retaining screw
Extractor spring and retaining screw
Trigger assembly
Bolt head release catch and screw
Mag catch assembly
Mag spring
Once you have all the parts modified or fabricated you can then assemble and final fit for feeding-extraction and ejection and then re-finish the whole carbine.
One of my favorite passages on the De Lisle -- "In fact every De Lisle was virtually a "one-off", with components manufactured individually for each gun. Staff Sergeant Harry Weeks, an Armourer of that era with knowledge of Sterling De Lisles nos 26, 28, 31 and 39, described them as "an absolute nightmare".
PARTS TO BE MODIFIED
Butt stock - hollow out for De Lisle cleaning kit
Trigger guard Assembly - attach new magwell and plate
Fore stock - cut to size
Bolt Body - cut to size & rethread and counter bore for firing pin spring (may require annealing and re-hardening), dovetail bolt handle for insert
Firing Pin - cut to size & re-thread (requires check for firing pin protrusion)
Firing Pin Spring - cut to size
Bolt head - recess face for 45 case and cut for ejector
Extractor - enlarge and re-cut for 45 case
Receiver - line bore for barrel, remove charger bridge, drill/tap for ejector assembly, enlarge existing ejector screw hole, drill/tap for barrel retaining screw, drill/tap for end cap assembly screw
Barrel - thread for receiver, barrel locknut, turn so OD fits inside line bored receiver, counter bore for bolt head, cut chamber, cut extractor recess, cut for magwell/feed ramp, profile and crown
Magazine - shorten and re-form feed lips, modify follower, weld/solder guide rib on back of mag, cut guide rib for Enfield mag catch
PARTS TO BE FABRICATED
Magwell assembly including bottom plate and magwell reinforce band
Front hand guard and attaching boss
Hand guard hangar and pins
End caps for suppressor tubes (front and rear are different)
Suppressor tube
Front swivel
Front sight protector
Front sight
Bolt insert
Suppressor support rods and end caps(2)
Barrel lock nut
Rear sight unless you can find an original Lanchester!
Stock spacer
Ejector assembly
Plus you will need screws for: front sight(2) hand guard(1) ejector assembly(1) barrel lock screw(1) end cap assembly screw(1) suppressor tube retaining screw(1)
PARTS USED AS IS
Butt plate and screws
Stock bolt and washer
Rear swivel
Rear trigger guard screw
King screw and spacer
Cocking piece
Firing pin retaining screw
Extractor spring and retaining screw
Trigger assembly
Bolt head release catch and screw
Mag catch assembly
Mag spring
Once you have all the parts modified or fabricated you can then assemble and final fit for feeding-extraction and ejection and then re-finish the whole carbine.
One of my favorite passages on the De Lisle -- "In fact every De Lisle was virtually a "one-off", with components manufactured individually for each gun. Staff Sergeant Harry Weeks, an Armourer of that era with knowledge of Sterling De Lisles nos 26, 28, 31 and 39, described them as "an absolute nightmare".
- Location
- Tucson, Arizona
DeLisle in use:
I did read they were used in Burma. They would wait for a jap convoy coming down the road and shoot ONE jap in each truck. Think about the psychology of that! By the time the rest of them reacted, the truck would be down the road and the next one would be in the line of fire.
I did read they were used in Burma. They would wait for a jap convoy coming down the road and shoot ONE jap in each truck. Think about the psychology of that! By the time the rest of them reacted, the truck would be down the road and the next one would be in the line of fire.
There should have been a significant improvement in the performance of the .45ACP with the longer barrel. I had a M1911A1 and a Reising out at the range and chrono'd rounds from the same box. Rounds out of the reising had 300 ft/sec over the rounds from the pistol. That works out to a lot of foot-pounds of energy with a 230-grain slug.
