PGW calling out ATR? This should be interesting
Since I don't actually work for Alberta Tactical Rifle, he's actually calling me out. LOL
Desert Tactical Arms Stealth Recon Scout .338LM
- Thread starter Target Sports Center
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Since I don't actually work for Alberta Tactical Rifle, he's actually calling me out. LOL
- Location
- calgary alberta
PGW calling out ATR? This should be interesting
Yes this is getting a bit ridiculous.
Ross and Steve If you want to journey out west once the weather here improves some,I would be more than happy to spend a weekend at our range with you.
We have many respected members on this forum who shoot the 338s that I have built and they are finding the same results of under .5 moa 5 shot groups on a consistant basis. By consistant I am saying this is not a 1 or 2 time occurrance but rather the norm on a good day.
I imagine guys with your background and experience realize that some days a shooter can do no wrong on a target and other days would be better staying in bed, but on the whole the reports we have got back, which matches our own experience, is that the rifles I build are easily capable of sub 1/2 moa shooting on a regular basis.
If you want to challenge 25 or 30 CGN members who own 1 of the 338s I have built be my guest.
I refuse to get into any sort of pissing match on the forum however, but again offer you the opportunity to come and shoot with us. I have a good video camera and a real nice set of gongs for targets.
Well we are of course out west all the time and yes this is getting ridiculous. .5 moa is bigger than 3" at 1078 yards by a lot. Claiming that such accuracy is routine at that distance is what gets us fired up and we remain of the opinion that it is not realistic to make such claims.
I think in fairness it was Glock making those claims and he now indicates he does not work for you (although it would seem that he does).
I also recall posts where you claim to have multiple 50 cal rifles that shoot 1/4moa. It was pointed out by others at the time that this is world record territory you were travelling in with not one but several rifles...
It is a disservice to the LR community to basically indicate that 3" groups at 1078 yards is no big deal. Groups like this make the world's best shooters get on the phone and call their friends from the range to put the word out. Groups like this on a consistent basis (meaning the gun will average it) simply do not happen at least in the realm of mere mortals such as Steve and I and the rest of our crew out here....
I'd like the opportunity to purchase a rifle that could routinely shoot 3 inch groups at 1078 yards. No wandering accuracy though.
Me too, but it is also going to have to compensate for my lack of talent as well as shooting the 3" groups. Rick, you think you can build one like that?
Mark
Sorry about the thread jack. It was kind of going off on a tangent anyway but all the same, a new thread is necessary. I'm going to make some calls and see if I can get the up close video footage from Wild TV so EVERYONE can see just how out to lunch we are with our claims. I'll start a new thread when I have a video to post.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
That is one of the more interesting rifles I have seen of late. I think the bullpup design is a superb layout for a LR sniping rig. Very nice looking rifle and LIGHT. Even with a suppressor, it would not be overly long. Like it
Pity, my wallet will not let me play...Assume it would be non restricted????
From what I have read about the development of the 338 LM before it became the LM, the orig design was for a 250gr bullet to get to 3000fps. Most rifles of the day and what Lapua ended up producing would put this bullet right around 2950fps in a 26" pipe. The 300gr bullet was speced around 2700fps.
Getting 1/3 min accuracy at 1000+yds is certainly within the realm of possibilities. There are a whole bunch of LR BR shooters trying to keep them at this level of accuracy. You can check out the match results from places like Williamsport. They are getting close but it is no mean feat with todays tech.
If I may suggest a simple test, set up a target at 300yds with 2 aiming spots or just move your scope. Shoot a 5 rds group. Wait for the barrel to cool to your liking, then shoot another group on the same piece of paper.
Of course, shoot on a nice calm day with nice light with good solid rests and all the scope mag you can live with. 300yds is still close enough that a light gust isn't going to push you too far off course.
A 1/3 min rifle will group 5 rds into 1" at that distance. Done twice on the same target, you have a 10shot 2 group average to compare. If you are having a great day, repeat.
My testing has shown that if you can do this, the odds of being to shoot 3 and 4" groups at 1000yds is viable. Conditions play such a large role at 1000yds that is takes some really talented shooting and good wind indicators to keep up this level of performance.
But it can be done.
Look forward to seeing some groups on paper.
Jerry
Pity, my wallet will not let me play...Assume it would be non restricted????
From what I have read about the development of the 338 LM before it became the LM, the orig design was for a 250gr bullet to get to 3000fps. Most rifles of the day and what Lapua ended up producing would put this bullet right around 2950fps in a 26" pipe. The 300gr bullet was speced around 2700fps.
Getting 1/3 min accuracy at 1000+yds is certainly within the realm of possibilities. There are a whole bunch of LR BR shooters trying to keep them at this level of accuracy. You can check out the match results from places like Williamsport. They are getting close but it is no mean feat with todays tech.
If I may suggest a simple test, set up a target at 300yds with 2 aiming spots or just move your scope. Shoot a 5 rds group. Wait for the barrel to cool to your liking, then shoot another group on the same piece of paper.
Of course, shoot on a nice calm day with nice light with good solid rests and all the scope mag you can live with. 300yds is still close enough that a light gust isn't going to push you too far off course.
A 1/3 min rifle will group 5 rds into 1" at that distance. Done twice on the same target, you have a 10shot 2 group average to compare. If you are having a great day, repeat.
My testing has shown that if you can do this, the odds of being to shoot 3 and 4" groups at 1000yds is viable. Conditions play such a large role at 1000yds that is takes some really talented shooting and good wind indicators to keep up this level of performance.
But it can be done.
Look forward to seeing some groups on paper.
Jerry
Troy I for one dont doubt your claims but people fail to realize that the shooter is the prime factor when shooting at long ranges. A 2 MOA shooter using 1/2- 1/4 MOA equipment is still a 2 MOA Shooter regardless of much money one spends on gear to improve there results.
Not the first time that he made Outrage claim, and he doesn't work for Alberta tactical, that really funny, he there with rick every gunshow, that I see, that really funny.
It good that finally some one stand out and say some thing...
It good that finally some one stand out and say some thing...
If you read the the previous posts and if you knew about the case dimension differences between the 338 Lapua Magum and the 338 Lapua Magnum Ackley Improved .You would realize that he was using hand loads not factory ammmunition as welll the there is no factory loaded ammunition manufactured for the 338 Lapua Magnum Ackley Improved Cartridge
Max Owner
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
It was determined a year or so ago that GunBoy has a bone to pick with Alberta Tactical Rifle.
Last time I was out at 1,000 I couldn't even hit the 4' X 4' pallet armed with Federal Gold Match and a ballistics calculator. I turned up too much in hind site.........
Because I am a weenie, doesn't make others the same. We have seen these threads before......
Why would anyone come on here and make bogus statements?
Pick yer long range shooting days. Friend and I canceled because the wind was too strong and gusting. Woulda been a complete waste of time. So pick a day where wind ain't there.
Imagine what can be done.
Last time I was out at 1,000 I couldn't even hit the 4' X 4' pallet armed with Federal Gold Match and a ballistics calculator. I turned up too much in hind site.........
Because I am a weenie, doesn't make others the same. We have seen these threads before......
Why would anyone come on here and make bogus statements?
Pick yer long range shooting days. Friend and I canceled because the wind was too strong and gusting. Woulda been a complete waste of time. So pick a day where wind ain't there.
Imagine what can be done.
So You telling me that you are a Weenie, because you cannot hit a 4X4 at 1000yard, well I am telling you that you not a Weenie at all, but believing that some one can hit a target at 1000yard with 3" group consistently with a Tac Gun then you might as well being a Weenie, I got a $1000 say and calling those out that said they can do it, 3" at 1000 consistently. How about putting you money where you mouth is.
Oh yet by the way there was many incident about a year ago that got me picking with Rick, and One of them was that he is going to produce an action, for his tactical rifles, and 2 Christmas has pass, there is No action, he even gone as far as telling other that he is producing rifles for military trial out. mean while other had done it and succeeded, like PGW, they din't talk about it, but done it.
Now let talk about you, If there any one having problem or picking with is You and PGW guy, and from looking at it, that you don't like them.
Don't tell me that you still believe 3" at 1000yard, CONSISTENTLY BUDDY WHAT ARE YOU SMOKING, BECAUSE I WANT SOME.
Oh yet by the way there was many incident about a year ago that got me picking with Rick, and One of them was that he is going to produce an action, for his tactical rifles, and 2 Christmas has pass, there is No action, he even gone as far as telling other that he is producing rifles for military trial out. mean while other had done it and succeeded, like PGW, they din't talk about it, but done it.
Now let talk about you, If there any one having problem or picking with is You and PGW guy, and from looking at it, that you don't like them.
Don't tell me that you still believe 3" at 1000yard, CONSISTENTLY BUDDY WHAT ARE YOU SMOKING, BECAUSE I WANT SOME.
I know what you mean, I have read the post, but by having a larger powder capacity doesn't mean more accurate, shooing 1/3 inchs group at 100yard, doesnt mean you going to do 3" at 1000yard, that just math, not even the military can claim that head shoot is done at 800meter consistantly. infact 1000yard is just with in the range for 338 lapua and 338 ack.
Max Owner
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I am almost open minded enough to believe that almost anything is possible.
My theory is if one bullet can hit "that spot" why can't the next bullet hit "that spot"
Conditions will be a big factor. Wind. Mood of shooter. How many coffees/pop/café latte oles......... Humidity.
Hand loading (with diligence) would help with the consistency of ammunition.
I do admit that 3" at 1,000 is pretty damn good. Mysticplayer took allot of heat for saying that a 223 could hit at 1700 yards. But it was done as witnessed by allot of people. I was NOT one of them.
So who knows?
My theory is if one bullet can hit "that spot" why can't the next bullet hit "that spot"
Conditions will be a big factor. Wind. Mood of shooter. How many coffees/pop/café latte oles......... Humidity.
Hand loading (with diligence) would help with the consistency of ammunition.
I do admit that 3" at 1,000 is pretty damn good. Mysticplayer took allot of heat for saying that a 223 could hit at 1700 yards. But it was done as witnessed by allot of people. I was NOT one of them.
So who knows?
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