x2. I own 3 savages (17 hmr, a 11 fcxp3 in 243 and an axis in 270) and my barrels ALL look like #2. I cleaned em all before I shot them and yes they were dirty, but not what I would call 'bad'
Difference between a savage and a tikka barrel
- Thread starter kman300
- Start date
x2. I own 3 savages (17 hmr, a 11 fcxp3 in 243 and an axis in 270) and my barrels ALL look like #2. I cleaned em all before I shot them and yes they were dirty, but not what I would call 'bad'
Apples or oranges, turnips or grapefruits - it doesn't matter. For me, accuracy and resulting points, that's all that counts, we don't time ourselves - just shoot - whatever time it takes, then that's it. I just looked tonight at his T3. Smooth as silk. Tonight he was shooting about 1 to 1.5". Mine was shooting .75 to 1". And yes, we swapped out. He shot better with mine in a round - I knew someone would point out.
Another 40 rounds down the tube for her. Fun stuff!
Kman, you have been here long enough to know you can bad things about any rifle brand except savage around here!! You will either get berated by many, or told it is supposed to be like that and the one he/she owns is more accurate than rifles without such "design features".
How in heck is rifling that bad supposed to help accuracy, speed, and reduce fouling or friction, lol.
How in heck is rifling that bad supposed to help accuracy, speed, and reduce fouling or friction, lol.
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Hey, they're cheap guns and this is to be expected. It doesn't necessarily mean they're going to shoot poorly, but I did find the examples of Savage I've owned in the last ten years were very difficult to get clean barrel fouling wise. This would make a lot of sense, being that rough, this said mine shot fine.
tylerjwitty
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Northern Ontario
That's a riduclous post ..
I own two Savage center fire rifles and the both shoot well. After reading this thread I was curious so I got out a loupe and a high intensity LED bore light. First thing is that both barrel crowns were flawless, nicely machined and a very small taper (the actual crown) about the depth of the rifling.
I have a Stevens 200 in .308 that has shot at most 100 rnds. There no tooling marks visible on the top surfaces of the rifling, maybe worn smooth by use. I can see tooling marks in the grooves but they are very shallow and not wide, not nearly as coarse as what your pictures show. At least 90% of the groove surface is flat and smooth so I doubt that the small marks I can see in the grooves will have much affect on shooting accuracy or fouling. I don't see any copper build up in the tooling marks. I paid $280 total, new for this rifle (cost deal as a part time employee of a local shop). It shoots about 1.5 moa with a basic 4 X scope on it. I'm sure it would group tighter with more magnification.
I also have a Savage Mod. 12 FV in .308, no more than 500 rnds thru it. All of the comments about the Stevens above apply to this rifle but the tooling marks in the grooves are, if anything, less visible, maybe due to the more rnds thru it. It cost me $650 used and shipped. It shoots sub moa, about .7" average for 3 shot groups.
These rifles are not $2000 dollar Sakos but for what I paid and what they do, I'm more than happy with them.
I gather from reading I've done that these tooling marks are simply an unavoidable consequence of button rifling. if it is such a "bad thing" I doubt that people would be buying Savage rifles in the droves that are.
I have a Stevens 200 in .308 that has shot at most 100 rnds. There no tooling marks visible on the top surfaces of the rifling, maybe worn smooth by use. I can see tooling marks in the grooves but they are very shallow and not wide, not nearly as coarse as what your pictures show. At least 90% of the groove surface is flat and smooth so I doubt that the small marks I can see in the grooves will have much affect on shooting accuracy or fouling. I don't see any copper build up in the tooling marks. I paid $280 total, new for this rifle (cost deal as a part time employee of a local shop). It shoots about 1.5 moa with a basic 4 X scope on it. I'm sure it would group tighter with more magnification.
I also have a Savage Mod. 12 FV in .308, no more than 500 rnds thru it. All of the comments about the Stevens above apply to this rifle but the tooling marks in the grooves are, if anything, less visible, maybe due to the more rnds thru it. It cost me $650 used and shipped. It shoots sub moa, about .7" average for 3 shot groups.
These rifles are not $2000 dollar Sakos but for what I paid and what they do, I'm more than happy with them.
I gather from reading I've done that these tooling marks are simply an unavoidable consequence of button rifling. if it is such a "bad thing" I doubt that people would be buying Savage rifles in the droves that are.
Took the tikka shooting today. I cleaned the barrel down to bare steel at home as you can see from the picture I posted in the OP.
First shot at 110 yards by itself and then the next 3 stacked in a nice group. First 4 shots.
Next 3 at 220 yards.
I'm just using some old Winchester Ranger ammo with 168gr hpbt to get the brass. Can't complain though, gun shoots!
First shot at 110 yards by itself and then the next 3 stacked in a nice group. First 4 shots.
Next 3 at 220 yards.
I'm just using some old Winchester Ranger ammo with 168gr hpbt to get the brass. Can't complain though, gun shoots!
ALBERTA BOY
Regular
- Location
- Edmonton, AB
Savage literally makes the worst rifles on the market today. Anyone who doesn't agree just doesn't know.
I have had SO many quality control issues with their crappy rifles.
I have had SO many quality control issues with their crappy rifles.
Well, hell ya...never shot out to 1,500 yards and have never been trained to do so, but I'd give it a whirl. The point I was making was that it really does not matter what brand, how expensive or the prestige of the rifle to the target. In shooting points, it is the accumulated group that matters. My Savage shoots incredibly well against my son's Tikka T3. BOTH are great shooters, but in my case (and it could be an anomaly too) when I shot my savage against his Tikka, my Savage received higher points because it shot tighter.
I'm not going to denigrate this post into a Tikka versus Savage. They are BOTH fine rifles and it does not seem to matter how the barrel was made to shoot well. So ya, once I learned how to shoot at 1,500 yards (if my little 243 could even accomplish such a thing with any kind of reasonable accuracy - with the little 70 gr pills I shoot), I'd be game to try it. For now, I will continue to use it at 350 to 400 yards as it does the job I need it to very well thank you.
Or maybe you don't know as much as you think you know? For the record, I have had no QC issues on either of my Savages.
The quality control issue that has bugged me the most recently is a way oversized chamber on a brand new $1100 Winchester 70 Light Coyote. Its so oversize that factory rounds sit low in the chamber so way eccentric to the bore and won't shoot worth a darn. Have you not heard about all the quality control issues on the new Marlins since Remington moved production to a new plant? How about Mossberg bolt handles breaking off?
Is every Savage perfect? Of course not, but most others aren't either. Savages are designed for simple assembly by low skilled workers and sell at attractive prices as a result. One reason that QC issues slip thru is that Savage is working flat out to meet demand, that says something about the markets opinion of these rifles. Not everyone can afford a BMW but Ford and Chev are making some pretty good cars these days.
Father Hood
Regular
- Location
- Lower Mainland, BC
Some of these posts make me laugh.. as a matter of fact, my issues with Savage rifles have been such that I have just ordered a 12 LRP in 6.5 CM and another 12 BVSS in .308 to ad to my 10 fcp-k that is now in 300wsm and shooting just fabulous out to 1200 yrds so far.
ALBERTA BOY
Regular
- Location
- Edmonton, AB
I'm well aware of the qc issues with marlin/Remington.
I've bought several of their rifles and experienced some of the problems first hand.
None of the problems hold a candle to the problems I've been seeing with savage rifles. Try are the worst. Hell, their design is seriously flawed. It's a joke. I've noticed that people without clues buy them and fail to note the qc issues because they don't know what they are looking at. There is a segment of the population who does most of their shopping at Walmart and are happy with whatever Chinese crap they get there. These are the same people who are savage supporters.
Whoa - tell us what you really feel?!? Adding into the spice a little bit of racism, profiling and just bad taste and you got yourself a whole lost of any credibility, if there ever is such a thing on the internet. Your post is absolutely uncalled for and false as I don't shop at Walmart and will wager that over 80% of your computer's motherboard, hard drive and other peripherals were manufactured in good 'ol China.
This kind of unsolicited bias has no place in these forums.
- Location
- West Quebec
Took the tikka shooting today. I cleaned the barrel down to bare steel at home as you can see from the picture I posted in the OP.
First shot at 110 yards by itself and then the next 3 stacked in a nice group. First 4 shots.
Next 3 at 220 yards.
I'm just using some old Winchester Ranger ammo with 168gr hpbt to get the brass. Can't complain though, gun shoots!
Judis priest if I got those results in my calibre 223, I would be over the moon.. nice work what model?
