dont want ring marks on my higher priced scopes

TDC said:
Try TPS rings, 98% concentricity, never seen a ring mark yet from a set.

TDC
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I've used loads of different rings without lapping and never got ring marks either. Lapping is not done to prevent ring marks although it can be one of the benefits, especially on rings with minimal contact with the scope tube or on a rifle where the holes in the action are not perfectly aligned.
 
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Don't buy crap. Spend the money and get a matched set of Nightforce Rings.
Torque to 25" pounds as per manufactures.
 
I suggest one of two things, A quality 1 piece mount like a near Alphahunter, or 1 piece piccatiny rail and good rings and you won't go wrong. You can bed the rail to the action if your concerned about action flaws, and a set of high quality matched rings like ATRS and I've never had a scope slip or be marked more than a slight color change in the matte finish. You get what you pay for, and I've never lapped either brand for my multiple Nightforce scopes.
 
I use this:

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sheephunter said:
And if the holes in the action are not perfectly aligned then the best rings in the word can still benefit from lapping. Lapping aligns the rings on a particular rifle..
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Why not then correct the alignment problem properly rather than screwing up a good set of rings?
With most rifles having 6x48 screws and holes, the alignment problem is easily repaired properly by opening the holes up and tapping 8x40 threads in the holes.
I guess it all boils down to whether you like things done right or not.
 
Why not then correct the alignment problem properly rather than screwing up a good set of rings?
With most rifles having 6x48 screws and holes, the alignment problem is easily repaired properly by opening the holes up and tapping 8x40 threads in the holes.
I guess it all boils down to whether you like things done right or not.
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you are absolutely correct!! -- but in some shops that will result in four 8x40 holes in your receiver exactly where your 6x48 holes were. And still not aligned :)

(something about this thread that is reminiscent of an incident that occurred in a grade 9 Auto Shop Class many years ago when the "yutes" were constantly pre-occupied with arguments about this "high lift cam" and that "radical racing cam" etc etc until one day the frustrated shop teacher brought in two camshafts for a 283 Chev and demanded that the class experts identify which was the "radical" Crane cam and which was the stock Chev cam....ABSOLUTE silence!! )
 
AP said:
you are absolutely correct!! -- but in some shops that will result in four 8x40 holes in your receiver exactly where your 6x48 holes were. And still not aligned :)
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That might be true for shops that are not well equipped, but with CNC mills and skilled operators who understand the concepts, it is not hard at all to get it right.
 
alberta tactical rifle said:
Why not then correct the alignment problem properly rather than screwing up a good set of rings?
With most rifles having 6x48 screws and holes, the alignment problem is easily repaired properly by opening the holes up and tapping 8x40 threads in the holes.
I guess it all boils down to whether you like things done right or not.
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I'm guessing for the average guy that buys a Savage/Rem/Win, that a quick lap of the rings will do the job adequately....and there's no need to take it to a CNC-equipped shop and leave it there for months. There's absolutely no harm in lapping rings and for the average guy buying a rifle off the shelf and throws a set of $70 rings on it, the benefits are there. We can talk about exception to the rule all day long or we can talk about what the average shooter does and hopefully help people on this site a bit. My point was leaning to the latter.......Most ring marks are a result of slight misalignment....lapping is an easy fix. If my boat springs a leak I can plug the hole or I can build a new boat......ultimately both result in me being dry.
 
sheephunter said:
I'm guessing for the average guy that buys a Savage/Rem/Win, that a quick lap of the rings will do the job adequately....and there's no need to take it to a CNC-equipped shop and leave it there for months. There's absolutely no harm in lapping rings and for the average guy buying a rifle off the shelf and throws a set of $70 rings on it, the benefits are there. We can talk about exception to the rule all day long or we can talk about what the average shooter does and hopefully help people on this site a bit. My point was leaning to the latter.......Most ring marks are a result of slight misalignment....lapping is an easy fix. If my boat springs a leak I can plug the hole or I can build a new boat......ultimately both result in me being dry.
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Agreed with cheap rings that are not precision made, lapping has no ill effect and will solve slight alignment issues.
Lapping a high quality ring is a BAD idea in most cases.
For the general motoring public that run stock production rifles and less expensive optics lapping mass produced rings IS a viable option.

On a higher end rifle there is no excuse for misaligned scope base screw holes in the first place. It can happen but as I suggested, it is not that difficult to correct properly.
A 1 piece rail can also be of benefit simply because it allows for mounting the optic where it is needed for optimal eye relief, but we see many rails that exacerbate the problem as they are not true either.
To mount a $3000.00 or $4000.00 optic in cheap rings makes no sense at all, hence there being a few manufactures such as ourselves who make a ring set that is made in identical pairs with maximum tolerances of less than .001 . Our rings will NOT leave marks when properly installed and lapping our rings will increase the dimensions of the bore enough to allow for slippage, yes they are that precisely made.
 
TDC said:
One piece base is the only way to go.

Tdc
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sheephunter said:
On some guns yup.....
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If a one piece is available for the rifle then it's the only way to go unless you are buying a custom built rifle where everything has been trued and there is no risk of receiver misalignment.
A two piece base on a production rifle is a hunting rifle not a precision firearm in my opinion.
Spend the money and buy quality components or don't complain when you have ring marks or you just can't seem to get the small groups you expect the rifle should be capable of.
 
Concern about weight is another reason guys shy away from one piece bases. Lots of great two-piece systems on the market and a quick lap gets everything in alignment in most cases.
 
sheephunter said:
Concern about weight is another reason guys shy away from one piece bases. Lots of great two-piece systems on the market and a quick lap gets everything in alignment in most cases.
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The weight difference isn't even worth mentioning. Hit the gym and save the money on a lapping tool and time.

Tdc
 
TDC said:
The weight difference isn't even worth mentioning. Hit the gym and save the money on a lapping tool and time.

Tdc
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LOL....I can think of quite a few sheep hunters that would disagree but each to their own. Two piece mounts work just fine for me. No desire to own another one piece base.
 
sheephunter said:
LOL....I can think of quite a few sheep hunters that would disagree but each to their own. Two piece mounts work just fine for me. No desire to own another one piece base.
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Ya, on a hunting rifle they are fine and will work but a one piece would still be better.
Did you have a bad experience with a one piece mount? The weight difference is so small I can't even imagine you could feel the difference.
 
cr5 said:
Ya, on a hunting rifle they are fine and will work but a one piece would still be better.
Did you have a bad experience with a one piece mount? The weight difference is so small I can't even imagine you could feel the difference.
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Without going to high-end, pricy one piece bases I honestly don't see any advantage on a hunting rifle. There is no alignment guarantee with a low-mid-priced one piece base so you still need to lap. I feel I can get better quality in a mid-priced two piece than I can in a mid-priced one-piece. And, with mounts like the Talley Lightweights, I take one mounting point out of the equation so it makes for a more solid connection to the rifle than a rail would. Plus, access to the magazine becomes more difficult. I'm not sure what advantage a one piece really offers me and I can think of several disadvantages. I don't feel that spending 15 minutes lapping rings once in a rifle's lifetime is that onerous.
 
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