The spring bear hunt is a bit of joke. They put more restrictions on it than ever, and still only allowed one tag per year in most areas. Same amount of hunters hunting same amount of bears, only with more rules. Cant see it helping the moose much at all.
End moose calf hunt, Ontario government urged
- Thread starter Arclight
- Start date
canadian hunter312
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Brant County
Misquoting? It's a direct copy/paste from the MNRF website. Not my opinion, not some news article, directly from the MNRF website. I'll highlight the important part for you to make things easier.
""Between 2013 and 2015, Ontario has conducted aerial surveys in 59 of the 67 wildlife management units where moose are hunted, representing 88 per cent of Ontario's moose hunting areas.
The 2015 surveys were completed in 27 wildlife management units in Ontario and showed the following changes""
Since when is 27 WMU's considered "only a couple"? Please, do tell. Unless you're suggesting they've posted completely false information?
canadian hunter312
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Brant County
You said
You asked someone to correct you and I did. Saying they don't have the budget to have an accurate idea of the moose populations is a lie, unless one considers surveying 88% of the moose hunting area isn't good enough? Maybe if you would have taken the time to follow the link you would have noticed the charts showing the population change over up to a 9 year span.
Like I said, people spreading lies and misinformation. Adding abbreviations doesn't change the fact.
Wonder if they do aerial surveys there like they do around here. The previous season to last a local CO was doing the fall moose count flight in the area. When the season opened a short while later both him and his hunting partner both filled their tags with large bull moose. That helps the moose population I'm sure. Also really helped out with public relations between the CO's and the hunters. People are still angry about it.
This is the 21st century. There's only one factor in wildlife management that matters...the human factor. Humans account for more mortality on big game than all other factors combined. Put another way...if you removed humans and measured the results, you would see more gains in wildlife populations than if you accounted for all other natural factors combined...weather, predation and disease included.
Habitat loss is the largest factor, followed by overhunting or poaching. If you are one of the guys that thinks I'm kidding look at how well large trophy game management zones are run in Africa and certain U.S. States. Not only do these areas have large carnivores and predators but they have the healthiest populations of game species with the highest densities of game found anywhere.
Why? Well, they don't shoot calves or young of the year. Nor do they shoot females generally. And they wait until their animals reach maturity before taking the oldest, mature specimens of the herd. This maintains age structure as well as performing several other important functions including optimum density and forcing competition for territory which maintains rank and dominance within the species. Together these forces act in species specific natural selection.
But the key is and always will be managing humans and how many animals we take from our wild herds. The fact that provincial game managers cannot deliver game efficiently to the market (hunters) is evidence enough that it's time to privatize game management in Canada.
As a landowner, hunter and conservationist, I have stepped forward and personally invested my own hard earned money to purchase, protect and preserve habitat because I know our government is inexperienced, incompetent and incalable of managing wildlife to my standards. Thus I must take matters into my own hands and manage my resource before it becomes a museum display.
Habitat loss is the largest factor, followed by overhunting or poaching. If you are one of the guys that thinks I'm kidding look at how well large trophy game management zones are run in Africa and certain U.S. States. Not only do these areas have large carnivores and predators but they have the healthiest populations of game species with the highest densities of game found anywhere.
Why? Well, they don't shoot calves or young of the year. Nor do they shoot females generally. And they wait until their animals reach maturity before taking the oldest, mature specimens of the herd. This maintains age structure as well as performing several other important functions including optimum density and forcing competition for territory which maintains rank and dominance within the species. Together these forces act in species specific natural selection.
But the key is and always will be managing humans and how many animals we take from our wild herds. The fact that provincial game managers cannot deliver game efficiently to the market (hunters) is evidence enough that it's time to privatize game management in Canada.
As a landowner, hunter and conservationist, I have stepped forward and personally invested my own hard earned money to purchase, protect and preserve habitat because I know our government is inexperienced, incompetent and incalable of managing wildlife to my standards. Thus I must take matters into my own hands and manage my resource before it becomes a museum display.
What you quoted from the MNR website is definitely true but they can make numbers say anything they want to.
Yes they did surveys from 2023 to 2015 but they were very hastily done and not very comprehensive due to budgetary restrictions on flying hours.
These facts were from a few different CO's last fall during the moose hunt in Northern Ontario. The head office can publish all the numbers they want the public to hear but the guys in the field know what's going on in the real world.
Yes, as one of our fellow gunnut said above, the human factor. If I recall correctly the Ontario MNR stats show a decline in the number of "licensed" hunters participating in the fall moose hunt.
Trimmer 905
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
You wouldn't happen to be an Ontario public servant being a good little Liberal,would you?
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I have been hunting same area since 1972 when it was one tag for a moose. Our camp was only accessible by water and air and then the snowmobile came along and we had a longer season to hunt moose back then. We saw moose every, spring, summer and fall. Now we have clear cuts, roads, trails that vehicles can run 24/7 all year round on some of them. This gives more access to hunting, poaching and select harvesting. We are lucky to see a moose in spring, summer or fall now and if I recall we only had 10 adult tags for our WMU last fall. Never seen a calf or signs of a calf in our area last fall and yes if I did see a calf I would try to shoot it as would every other hunter that was out hunting calf in the two week calf season. The MNR is the biggest problem in how they handled the moose population. I attended all the MNR meeting in how the tag system will increase moose population and tags. Stop the calf and maybe the cow hunting for a few years and this this will also reduce the number of licenced hunter which is the only thing the MNR has done to date.
tracker, I'm not sure I understand your post properly. Are you saying that you agree with the suggestion that calf-hunting should be abolished...and yet, until and unless it is, you would still shoot one yourself if the opportunity presented itself?
A bit hypocritical, no? "I know what the right course of action is...but I won't follow that course unless I am forced to!" Or am I misunderstanding your post?
I'm afraid that this sounds like the classic Ontario moose hunter attitude that I and others have mentioned before: Gotta kill a moose, every year, no matter what. As long as that mindset prevails, the MNR will never change things for the better.
A bit hypocritical, no? "I know what the right course of action is...but I won't follow that course unless I am forced to!" Or am I misunderstanding your post?
I'm afraid that this sounds like the classic Ontario moose hunter attitude that I and others have mentioned before: Gotta kill a moose, every year, no matter what. As long as that mindset prevails, the MNR will never change things for the better.
Trimmer 905
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
When the number of hunters is reduced,so is the revenue from license sales and the ensuing spin-off effect on tourism. THAT is the ONLY thing the Wynne Liberals are concerned with. All the rest of their theories and actions are smoke and mirrors BS.
verminaard
CGN Regular
- Location
- SW Bantario
The fact that is has returned in itself will help. It will still take time to make up for 16 years of pleasing the SJW's.
