Explanation of the Remington 870 8.5” ruling and current production...SEE PICTURES!!!

ricka2 said:
this kinda opens the door for ccw because whats to stop me from putting a shorty pistol grip 870 in my backpack/briefcase/glovebox and going on about my day ?
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"Concealed" is the big word in that sentence. Even a pocket knife can get you charged for a concealed weapon if the LEO decides that was the purpose you were carrying it for.

Also keep in mind that it's not legal to shoot in most towns, so is also not legal to have a loaded firearm, nor is it legal to have it loaded in any vehicle. It certainly would make it more convenient to keep in your vehicle for the odd grouse or whatever other legal use you have for it.

On your hip in the bush is considered "open carry" and would be perfectly legal as long as you are allowed to load/shoot a firearm in that area. No different than having your rifle slung over your shoulder.
 
If you are allowed to discharge a firearm in a given location, it may be loaded. If you are now allowed, it must be unloaded and that is it. So, non-restricted 8" PG shotgun in a holster on your hip Unloaded, anywhere you please.
If I carry a rifle in a case it's concealed isn't it? What's the difference if it's an unloaded short SG in a holster on my hip covered by a jacket?
Please, correct me if I'm wrong here...
 
tapedeck74 said:
If you are allowed to discharge a firearm in a given location, it may be loaded. If you are now allowed, it must be unloaded and that is it. So, non-restricted 8" PG shotgun in a holster on your hip Unloaded, anywhere you please.
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Yes, but you coudl do that wiht a rifle or shotgun before anyway. Police will come and arrest you if you do it somewhere stupid, though...

If I carry a rifle in a case it's concealed isn't it? What's the difference if it's an unloaded short SG in a holster on my hip covered by a jacket?
Please, correct me if I'm wrong here...[
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It's your intent/purpose that matters.

A rifle in a case is to protect it, A gun under a jacket is to conceal it...
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what about in a backpack or fanny pack unloaded ? ammo in your pocket.It would not take long to load in a pinch .would this be legal ?You can carry an unloaded nonrestricted firearm down the street in a soft case or open carry can't you ? no trigger lock required because its under your control
 
ricka2 said:
what about in a backpack or fanny pack unloaded ? ammo in your pocket.It would not take long to load in a pinch .would this be legal ?You can carry an unloaded nonrestricted firearm down the street in a soft case or open carry can't you ? no trigger lock required because its under your control
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soft case sure.

open carry is just asking for trouble. i would not want to open carry a handgun in the US let alone a shotgun.
 
Gatehouse said:
Yes, but you coudl do that wiht a rifle or shotgun before anyway. Police will come and arrest you if you do it somewhere stupid, though...



It's your intent/purpose that matters.

A rifle in a case is to protect it, A gun under a jacket is to conceal it...
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Yes, you can do that with any non-restricted firearm. The law says I can carry it anywhere. As far as somewhere stupid....All it takes is Anybody seeing a gun for the sh*t storm to commence. If I walk from my house to my car and a gun-fearing neighbor spots me, I will not be having a good day.

So, in light of this fact, I carry my rifles in cases to "keep the fear down".

If I carry this tiny SG on my hip, how's that any different than on my back?
My jacket is covering it to prevent hysterics.

I see your point, but I don't see how it would be illegal.
As someone else mentioned, you could carry it in a backpack. How's that any different than a gun case, or a holster?
Of course, I'll admit, if the police found me with this shotgun on my hip, concealed or not, they will be asking questions...and most certainly believe that I'm doing something illegal.
But that doesn't mean it's illegal.
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I wonder whether this decision will have any affect on the few Ithaca Auto Burglars that are in circulation in Canada. IIRC they are deemed to be restricted but are factory made.

It's hard to see how the Dlask 870 could be non-restricted while the Ithaca remained restricted.
 
Claybuster said:
I wonder whether this decision will have any affect on the few Ithaca Auto Burglars that are in circulation in Canada. IIRC they are deemed to be restricted but are factory made.

It's hard to see how the Dlask 870 could be non-restricted while the Ithaca remained restricted.
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I think the classification will remain the same. The Auto Burglar was always essentially thought of as more a shotgun caliber pistol, than a short barreled shotgun.

I had been wondering about the Encore Rifles, and what the CFC would have to say about taking a factory rifle, and installing the factory pistol length barrels and pistol grip. My guess is they will argue that you'd recreated what TC itself market as a pistol, and it would be restricted.
 
Canuck223 said:
I think the classification will remain the same. The Auto Burglar was always essentially thought of as more a shotgun caliber pistol, than a short barreled shotgun.
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But the Auto Burglar is to the Ithaca Flues what the short 870 is to the Wingmaster. Both are factory products that started out as full length shotguns.

Consider the various revolving carbines that are non-restricted rifles. Can I remove the long barrel and stock, put on a factory pistol barrel and after market grip and have a non-restricted handgun?

The more I think about the anomalies this creates such as the Game Getter, TC Contender and other potential variations the more I wonder how long this decision will stay in place. I'm not going to put my money down on a shorty 870 just yet.
 
Claybuster said:
The more I think about the anomalies this creates such as the Game Getter, TC Contender and other potential variations the more I wonder how long this decision will stay in place. I'm not going to put my money down on a shorty 870 just yet.
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I agree because technically with this and the current laws of open carrying of a non-restricted you could get one of those drop leg holsters, leave the 3 shells in your pocket, and carry it down the street with you, drive with it, etc. It wouldent be concealed and being non-restric it would all be legal within the eyes of the law. You would probably be questioned about it everywhere you went and the cops would raise concern. Decision could be reversed and bam... your out the money for the barrel because it would have to be destroyed. Then again, imagine if everyone started walking around with these and the CFC went the other way and said fine, carry your pistols but they HAVE to be concealed, your freaking people out with your short shotties. I know im dreaming, but its okay to dream right? :D

There is alot of new questions that arise from this one firearm.
 
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Pure Energy said:
........Decision could be reversed and bam... your out the money for the barrel because it would have to be destroyed.
There is alot of new questions that arise from this one firearm.
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Guys, even if the CFC reversed its decision I believe the worst to happen would be that you couldn't use the pg and would be 'stuck' with the full buttstock. The short fulll stock gun shave been around for almost two years without problem or question. Even at that setup the gun would still be tiny compared to a 20" and still non-restricted.
Remember this is not an exemption to the current laws, it is a modern and recent study of the existing law. There is no letter to say "This is exempted" it says that the definition of Prohibited does not apply to this setup.

Cheers
 
Hmm,the CFC might change de status of this shotgun if we get too much of them scaring soccer moms :rolleyes:..

On the other side,if we could get a few thousands peoples carrying it around for some times,sooner or later,someone will show it in the medias as a good exemple of "loophole" in the law : And there,we will be able to shoot back and say "Hey..what's the matter !? A few thousands peoples are carrying it daily since a while and nobody got hurt right !?"..

Maybe this little baby could be our ticket to CCW on the long run or i'm just another fool :confused: ?? You could build a perfect exemple of armed citizens in Canada who show that nobody become a mad shooter starving for innocents targets when the owner isn't in the woods...

Schneider ;)
 
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Ike said:
Guys, even if the CFC reversed its decision I believe the worst to happen would be that you couldn't use the pg and would be 'stuck' with the full buttstock. The short fulll stock gun shave been around for almost two years without problem or question. Even at that setup the gun would still be tiny compared to a 20" and still non-restricted.
Remember this is not an exemption to the current laws, it is a modern and recent study of the existing law. There is no letter to say "This is exempted" it says that the definition of Prohibited does not apply to this setup.

Cheers
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Yeah I was just about to edit my post and add that. Adding a full length stock that is. I know its not an exemption, its a loophole and its awesome how you guys figured it out.
 
Not sure if someone asked this, but how does it shoot? is it a kick in the teeth? Worthy for protection in the woods? Or do you have to be to close for comfort for it to be effective? a will it fly out of your hands without the forend grip? we are talking heavy loads here.
 
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