Flint Rifle....Round Ball and or R.E.A.L.(Big) Boolit?

^ agreed, 120grains of powder under 200grains of lead at 50m on a 120 lbs deer sounds like a metric tonne of overkill to me!? I guess it could depend on what you mean by humanely...torn in two at mid-ships? {joke} I'm told 80grains of black is more than sufficient to yardage inside 100. Placement is key, not poundage.
 
eaglesnester said:
Now for them reals dropping down the barrel like you said. That can be dangerous as hell and does nothing for your accuracy. It is dangerous because yur bullet can move off the powder charge and act like an obstruction in the barrel when U touch it off. This can blow up your gun and injure or possibly kill you. Heres whatcha do. Make them reals into paperpatch bullets. take any copy paper or typing paper 20lb and paper patch em. Look it up on the web for how to do this. With a paper patch bullet U do not need to lube em and U will get a tight gas seal and you will have to use your ramrod to get em down on the charge. The accuracy will be tremendous especially if you use a lubed felt or wool over powder wad. Yur accuracy can go up by 500%. It is good that this bullet requires paperpatching. In a way you are lucky that the diameter of the cast bullet is under speck so U can have the opportunity to paperpatch.
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I respectfully disagree. Long range ML target shooters have been shooting conical bullets out of fast twist barrels since the mid-19th century, and almost without exception, they have used grease grooved or paper jacketed bullets that slide down the barrel with nothing more than the weight of the ramrod pushing them. Typically, the bullet with its paper jacket will measure .001 under the land diameter. Anything tighter will damage both the paper jacket and the bullet. As I mentioned earlier, swabbing between shots is necessary. The bullet fits too loosely to grip the rifling, until the powder ignites, at which time the pressure causes the base of the bullet to start moving a tiny bit sooner than the nose, causing the bullet to "bump up", ie get fatter, and grip the rifling. One of the reasons to use a heavier charge of powder is to make sure that it has sufficient pressure to do that, not for increased velocity. The fact that the bullet may not stay seated firmly on the powder charge is an issue in hunting situations, for sure, but I would argue that this makes them less than ideal for hunting, unless the rifle is carried muzzle up. That said, I have never had a bullet that moved down the bore.
As for paper patching the REAL bullet, it is a pretty good idea, except that I think that the high ridges might damage the patch. Try it. A traditional PP bullet is smooth sided. If I can figure out how to post pics I will post a pic of PP bullets, if anyone is interested. Another option would be to lube the REAL bullet real well, I think that might be a pretty good option.
 
This from the Lee Precision web site:

Rifling Engraved At Loading (REAL) Bullet Molds
A solid bullet that loads easily even after many firings because of its unique cleaning action. Will not tumble. A perfect hunting bullet with heavy loads. Easy to cast. Shoots accurately even in greatly oversize barrels.

R.E.A.L

Rifling Engraved At Loading (REAL)
The driving bands are large enough to adequately engage the rifling when pushed into the muzzle, and thin enough to withstand maximum charges without stripping or gas cutting.
Unique Cleaning Action
You can shoot all day without cleaning your rifle between shots! When inserted into the muzzle, tiny scraping edges are swagged forward on each driving band. These perfect fitting scrapers remove the fouling from the previous shot.

Easier, Faster to Load
It's easy to load straight and true, easier and faster than a round ball with patch. Easily stabilized with very light charges, the REAL bullet also retains accuracy with maximum loads. Each band is generously tapered to the rear with an angle close to that of a lathe center, so as to center the bullet against the rifle bands. When pushed in, the bullet automatically centers in the bore.

More Accurate
The bevel base of the REAL bullet contributes to greater accuracy. When the bullet exits the bore, the gas escapes equally around the perimeter of the base. The uniform bevel is resistant to nicks that would permit gas to escape prematurely and cause a jet effect on one side of the bullet.

Combo Molds
These molds cast one REAL bullet and one round ball bullet.

Next time at the range I am going to see how many shots I can get off with out swabbing the bore and see if accuracy suffers.
 
fraserdw said:
Depends on what you are shooting for. Most loads of 50/54 cal round ball are insufficient for big game. Indeed, in test only 120 grains of Powder with 200 grain round ball fire from a 28 inch 1:48 twist barrel achieved acceptable foot pounds to kill deer humanely at 50 meters. Round Ball is great for punching paper especially with light target loads.
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I think a lot of Elk and Moose need to be notified about this. Especially the ones with a hole on each side. This sounds like a sales pitch from a gun store that only sells modern Muzzle loaders to people that don't know anything about real Black Powder and Round balls.
 
Nice Flinter! I have the same rifle except caplock. Been shooting P.R.B and R.E.A.L's for many years. I started with Black powder and then switched to 777, but switched back about 5 years to Goex black. I really didn't see what the big hype was with the 777 to be honest. 65 grains of 2F behind ball and 80-90 grains behind the REAL's is what I use for target shooting. In fact I did bag a nice deer with it a few years back at around 70 yards with round ball over 65 grains. I don't have to swab for about 12 shots with PRB and about 4-6 REAL's. Mine grabs the REAL's at the 2nd rib from the tip. It shoots accurately with either projectile.
Al
 
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