Fn Fal

Because we can't have them, we want them.

I suspect they'd make a fun heavier bush rifle - fulfill the black/scary rifle, hunting, bear defence, semi auto, shtf, and truck gun categories all in one go.
 
bladerogers said:
What makes the FAL so great though? I mean, they look heavy, fire a heavier round then the AR, and just seem to be so, so, blah....what am I missing??
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1- they are a part of our national heritage,and a lot of us would like to have 1- esp a CANADIAN 1- it's about as national as HOCKEY
there's a variation floating around that has a collapsible stock, that's an absoulte dream-
for a lot of us, it was our first gun- tks to the canadian govt- others may come and go, but you never forget your first
 
OK, and that's it?? not sure about the "As National as hockey" bit myself...to me that has enfield all over it. I think I joined the CF shortly after these were replaced by the C7 (94).

By the way, I am as Canadian as any Canadian on this board, so spare me with the beaver and leaf patriot act, please ;)

If that is why there seems to be such a following then I guess I am not missing anything. Frankly was hoping for something more informative than that, more positive in terms of an actual review of the firearms positives...not the "Every Canadian wants one!" BS... but that does confirm my suspicions. Hey, and for what it's worth, looking at some of the price tags south of the border, I'd probably buy one anyhow.

EDIT- Sorry t-star, I think I misread your response. especially a Canadian one = Canadian FAL. Ahh, ok...now that I can understand and not take offense to. My apologies. Really though, what made this rifle stand out? I've read about some ex-mil that were upset by the phase out and replacement by the AR platform. reasons?
 
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you talk to any soldier from that era, and you'll find that they either love their issued weapon, or hate it- i never got a chance to do anything with the g3. but had both the fn and the m14- personally, i love the m14- it balances better, mounts a scope more rigidly- the only way i ever saw to mount a scope on the c1 was a special body cover- the main complaint of any of the "big three" was too long and too heavy plus uncontrollable on full auto-
 
Exactly. yeah, to me it doesn't appear to have any appeal over and above the M14. Far as I am concerned, an auto M14 would simply be a waste of ammunition, so I just never understood the passion that so many display for FN/FAL. To each their own of course, just wanted a better idea of what these rifles are about, since I'll likely never have the opportunity to fire one, let alone own one.
 
every issued battle rifle at the time HAD TO HAVE full auto capability- they were trying to make the average rifle all things to all people, and do away with the squad level lmg- then somebody brightened up and figured that a mag fed lmg was nfg anyway as you wasted too much time on mag changes- something that goes back as far as the mg34 and earlier- YOU NEED A BELT- every one of the b/rs suffered from it- too much muzzle climb on f/a as well-
that's how we ended up with the mouse gun and the logistical nightmare it posed - ie even at squad level, you had your rifles in 1 caliber and the saw in another- unless you were in the navy and had a stoner- well the navy was always brighter than the rest - the real reason to have f/a is SUPPRESIVE FIRE,or to blast your way out of an ambush- it's also useful for tree clearing( mad minute)
 
bladerogers said:
Exactly. yeah, to me it doesn't appear to have any appeal over and above the M14. Far as I am concerned, an auto M14 would simply be a waste of ammunition, so I just never understood the passion that so many display for FN/FAL.
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Have both, much prefer the FN, in fact I doubt I would have bought the M-14 if I could still shoot my FN.

Much easier stripping, simpler mechanism, not as accurate as a "tweaked" M-14, but better than a "rack grade" M-14. Trigger machanism can be stripped without tools. Firing pin comes out without tools, even the extractor can be taken out with a punch or "bulleted cartrige", (though it is easier with the tool). Gas system can be stripped and cleaned without tools. Gas plug does not work itself loose like it does on some '14s. I could go on....

ALL 7.62 "battle rifles" are useless as full-auto assault rifles, but that is the American's fault for insisting on the 7.62x51 as the NATO standard. Originally the Belgians and Brits wanted the 7mm (.280), similar in performance to the 6.8 SPC. In fact, the FN was originally designed for the German WWII 7.92x33.

Originally, the C2 or its equivalent would have been in this caliber also, and probably would have worked better. The C2 was a flawed concept and only Canada stuck with it. The Aussies tried a redesign of their L2A1s to correct the faults, but instead went with a GPMG and relegated their L2s to stores and reserve training.
 
FNs are sweetness in execution. Fast handling, durable, reliable. Easy to strip. They are also much more controllable in rapid fire, and that includes full auto. An M14 rock 'n roll is a gong show. The rifle leaps out of your hands and I don't know that you could ever develop the technique to dump a full 20-round burst without endangering everything around you. Full auto with an FN is not precision, but you can at least hold on to it and get through the mag without flipping over onto your back.
 
you were taught NOTHING in basic?- you NEVER do a full 20 round burst or 30 as the case may be- even our beloved bren it's always "son of a b*tch for your firing sequence- it's been that way with every saw or lmg i ever handle- the barrels just won't take it-
 
t-star said:
you were taught NOTHING in basic?- you NEVER do a full 20 round burst or 30 as the case may be- even our beloved bren it's always "son of a b*tch for your firing sequence- it's been that way with every saw or lmg i ever handle- the barrels just won't take it-
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That is the biggest crock of sh*t I've ever heard. A FAL will put rounds down range "full auto" mag after mag until you can see the round going down the red-hot barrel. Is it accurate, well, that all depends upon how much adrenaline is running through your system. If it's a lot, then: "Yeah" accurate enough to kill! Your statement is ridiculous tot he extreme! I'll bet you've neve even fired a selective fire weapon! Clam-it!
 
I ran 4 30 rounders through a C2 on rock and roll as fast as I could change mags. Every round was a tracer too. It took it, but it was a tad warm though. :D
 
You can put a dozen or more mags down it and it will be fine! Hot? Hell yes, but it will perform!
 
Corpus said:
That is the biggest crock of sh*t I've ever heard. A FAL will put rounds down range "full auto" mag after mag until you can see the round going down the red-hot barrel. Is it accurate, well, that all depends upon how much adrenaline is running through your system. If it's a lot, then: "Yeah" accurate enough to kill! Your statement is ridiculous tot he extreme! I'll bet you've neve even fired a selective fire weapon! Clam-it!
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you are wrong and he is right. it was taught. son of a b+tch. you will burn out the barrel with sustained fire. i was taught it for the old smg (sterling) and the old gpmg. besides that, i can't speak for other countries but in the canadian army, at least when i served (85-92 regular) we had a thing called fire discipline. you didn't fire unless ordered by your section commander. when you did get to the assault then you could fire at will. this changed with the new weapons, but you still had a fire team leader. it aint the movies. you don't or can't carry loads of ammo. with the fn i carried 4 mags in pouches, i mag in rifle, and 2 bandoliers. the c7 i carried 4 mags in pouches, 1 in the rifle, 6 scrounged u.s. mags in a mess tin pouch. 1 bandolier in the ruck. besides after fighting threw the objective and re orging. you do a ammo count and redistribute ammo. of course this is my opinion and opinions are like as+holes, every one has one. you sound like you have seen the odd angery shot?
 
@ King66 - Burning out a barrel vs. Can it be done vs. Will "Butter-Bars" let me, are different disciplines in-and-of themselves, aren't they? Not only that, but burning out a barrel is a matter of opinion most of the time isn't it? The bottom line is that the FAL was designed to take that kind of punishment, and has for 50 some odd years; all round the globe! What you refer to as burning out the barrel can only be guessed at, but another bottom line is that if it puts the rounds down range inside the targets chest cavity then it ain't "burnt out" is it? It's a stone-faced killer, isn't it!

I've put mag after mag down a FAL to the point where the hand-guard melted, and the rifle was still usable, and plenty accurate after that! I wasn't arguing military fire discipline for the Canadian Army to the man. I was telling him that the machine is designed to take the kind of abuse that he believes impossible! It will do it all day long, and then some!

You were peace-time Army, and good on you for your service, but if what he was indicating were true, then a lot of good men--that DIDN'T serve in peace-time, would be dead today because they couldn't lay down the kind of lead that is needed to save their lives in heavy engagement. The FAL was built for WAR, and war it can bring, sir! Wear it out, throw it on the ground, piss down the barrel to clean it/cool it off, butt-stroke an opponent, and keep going! No problem what-so-ever for the FAL platform.

You're arguing peace-time, by the book, procedure, and I'm telling you what that machine can actually do, and has done, and will do, everytime; if called upon to do so, by necessity or choice; "sun-uf-ah-b*tch!"
 
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t-star said:
you were taught NOTHING in basic?-
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Happily, I didn't shoot any MGs in basic, or ACIS or MOUTS or any of those other awful places where they make you make your bed in the morning. I shot them at places like Genesee and Knob Creek where if you can afford the ammo, then you can pretty much do whatever the hell you want.

What years was the M14 issued in Canadian Army basic training, by the way?
 
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