Frontier's new Imperial Defense AR's

I bought one of these and I'm totally happy with it, infact, the first thing I did after giving it a good deep cleaning ( like I would do with any new gun ) was to buy 500 rds of ammo and have fun. All of the AR mags I have for my other AR's worked fine. It did take a little to get used to the 180 safety but no big deal. I shot all 500 rds that afternoon with no FTF's or FTE's.
In short , thois is ag reat ENTRY level AR. I may not hop inot the sand box with it but, I would/am going to use it for 3 gun matches and having some fun at the range.
XLR8
 
For what it's worth these guns come in a hard plastic case (supplied by distributor), two steel 30/5 (internally pinned) mags and a cleaning kit. Phil.
 
P of PDent said:
In response to these points:
-I have seen many AR 15-s from almost every manufacture including Colt that have light staking on the gas key. Our armourer is satisfied that it was done properly.
-agreed that the machining was not perfect and if outward appearance was a criteria then this would be important,
-the selector is infact backwards and can be replaced if this is a deal breaker
-the specs are very similar to the claims from some other manufacturers about being "milspec" and certainly wouldn't meets Kevin B's criteria as a front line AR 15. This having been said we are not trying to sell these to the military or law enforcement where peoples lives may be on the line. We bought these to fill a void in the black gun market that was wide open for the short barrel (10.5" and 14.5") market. If these guns fail to work properly then we will deal with this as it occurs.
-I don't know what gun you looked at that was "fouled beyond anything that would be left behind by factory test rounds". I just examined both guns on display and both appear clean without any carbon or fouling obvious in the bore or on the bolt.
Time will tell if these were a good deal or not and if they stand up over time. I just got off the phone from the distributor and he advised so far there have been no serious issues with the 100 guns in the country. So far one gun had a canted front sight (something that is a fairly common problem even with the main suppliers). The distributor (North Silva) have indicated they will stand behind these guns. They have had previous experience with AR 15 s as they were the previous Bushmaster distributor (before Remington/Ceberus bought them) and are the S&W M&P AR 15 distributor. If you think these guns are over priced then wait and see what the new year will bring for pricing from the other manufacturers. We thought about breaking up the uppers and lowers and maximizing our profits but deciding against it and as such there are no short uppers for sale as they all came as complete guns. Phil.
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Don't get me wrong, any gun is a good gun:) I just think that for the money being asked these small details should be taken care of (backwards fire control). While aesthetics is not that important, rough machining could be indicative of other problems not readily visible. And even though they aren't being offered for LE/Mil use it should still be made the right way. These guns will do just fine for plinking but they're not for serious use......happy blasting
 
I'm not sure what this "Backwards fire control" means. The selector works as it should, it goes all the way to what we would think would be the "Full Auto" notch. Personally, I replace all of the selectors on my personal AR's with "Full auto" selectors so the stupid thing, as I'm left handed, does not touch my trigger finger.
As for these rifles. They seem just as well made as anything else, the finish is strange but servicable, all of the threads I checked (Barrel at the flash hider and stock at the lower) were standard and not metric. I'm not sure who has good enough eyes to see the difference between a "Millspec" buffer tube and a non millspec tube without actually measuring it but they must be far better than mine. The cromed bolt is a nice, if not really a required touch. As these rifles are intended for the civilian market, I think they will do nicely, thank you. Time will tell how well they will actually do, I look forward to seeing them on the range. I'm sure, as with most other guns made today, they will shoot far more accurately than the guy holding it and prove to be wuite servicable. The mags, by the way, are steel not aluminium.

Scott
 
QOR said:
The guys at P&D said that they asked and got no answer....
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They're made in the UK at Mick's factory on his premises, I assume. Like I said he is the real deal, he's been in the gun business for decades. The real question is where he got the tooling from. Can't see why he would want to make these somewhere other than where he's made stuff in the past. I suppose I should give him a call.
 
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m39a2 said:
I'm not sure who has good enough eyes to see the difference between a "Millspec" buffer tube and a non millspec tube without actually measuring it but they must be far better than mine.
Scott
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It's quite easy actually and since you have one in your possesion you'll be able to fill us in.

Take a look at the the threads on the buffer tube where it joins the lower receiver. If the outside of the buffer tube is the same diameter as the threads it's a commercial tube. If the diameter of the tube is smaller than the outer portion of the threads than it should be "mil spec".

You mention the strange finish, what about on the barrel, is it parkerized, blued or unknown?

Oh and post some pics so we can complain about it some more.;)
 
Any and all guns imported into the UK must be proofed, these guns have no UK proof marks at least non I can find, so as far as that you can draw your own conclusions. As far as the buffer tube, I know the difference, just never cared before, non mil spec. Finish seems to be a heavy park but I'm not really sure. These are pretty well made guns but fit and finish again, never really matter to me, I only care about how accurate and how reliable.
I don't own one, I have 7 other AR platform rifles right now and my AR cabinet is full, so for the time being I'll wait to see what other people report. If XLR8's note is any indication looks like we have a winner.

Scott
 
FUgly...

[TOTALLY SUBJECTIVE, ESTHETICS ONLY MODE]

Saw two of these on Saturday... handled them but didn't shoot them... immediately noticed "cosmetic issues"... machining is rough, finish is uneven and "shinny", locking lugs on the chromed bolt looked like they were cut either early on a Monday morning or just before 5 on a Friday, engraving was crooked... with Bushmasters sitting right next to them in the rack at similar price point, I felt dirty just touching them...

[/TOTALLY SUBJECTIVE, ESTHETICS ONLY MODE]
 
m39a2 said:
Any and all guns imported into the UK must be proofed
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Not necessarily, the Act says "intended for sale" in the UK and which also means any CIP member, IIRC. Certainly when I lived in the UK I used to buy guns abroard in places like Switzerland and the US and I only had to get them proof tested when I sold them on.

I'm not quite sure how it applies to exports, if the firearm is being manufactured for sale abroad in a non-CIP member country I'm not sure it has to be proof tested. Usually with a company like Purdy for example they aren't sure where the thing will end up so they get everything proof tested.

However if you look at a Glock sold in Canada, it has no Austrian proofmarks. Their proof law is basically the same as the UK. I was under the impression they got around it by shipping everything over disassembled but they can't be because the barrel must be tested once completed, so there must be some sort of exemption for exports.
 
As a side bar note I did purchase of the 10.5" carbine and have shot assorted ammuntion through them, the gun functioned flawlessly with everthing that I put through it, accuracy was as expected from a carbine using an aimpoint with magnifier, the finish was interesting on the carbine and was uneven in some area's - this however did not detract from the shooting enjoyment, I will be shooting assorted frangible ammunition through the carbine on Thursday and the weekend. The chrome lining on the barrels was well done when compared to our American counter-parts, the hard chromed bolt and carrier was also well done, and aided in the clean-up.

gadget
 
Reaper said:
I was not impressed with the Imperial Defense Rifle, crude to say the least, definitely NOT worth over $1500.00. For that amount of money I would expect proper fit and finish, unfortunately Imperial Defense doesn't deliver. Couple that with almost a year for delivery time (to a local shop), I'll stick with the other established rifles for that price.
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I think an RRA over at Questar is the way to go. RRA is a company with a solid machining and quality reputation. $1563cdn at this writing for a Midlength A4. Have a read of this review: http://www.ar15-ar15.com/Rock_River_Arms_Quality_Review_s/42.htm
 
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