German Drilling in 9.3x53R

[fuzzy39]

So I’ve purchased a beautiful German drilling in 12x12 over 9.3x53R. It was made by Greifelt & Co From Suhl. From what I can find in my research, that company went out of business at the end of WWII (1945). I was told by Corwin arms that it is a 9.3x53R Finnish…. Not Swiss. It will chamber a 7.52x54R round and the action will close. As such I was pretty certain that it was a 9.3x53Finn. However, the more I read, the more I am feeling it made not be based on when the 9.3x53R Finn was developed.

I do plan to order some Cerrosafe…. If I can find… and do a chamber cast but was wondering if anyone had any more insight. I have dies for the Finn variety ordered and 7.52x53R Lapua brass ready to be neck up. Before I get deeper into potentially wrong components I want to make sure I don’t have a Swiss variety, lol.

I plan to post some pics of the gun when I get a chance. I know there must be some German drilling experts on here that can help me.

Thanks.

 

[fuzzy39]

Here are some pics. I’ll will try and post some with proof marks later.

 

[Twan]

Why don't you order/purchase some new manufacture Sako ammunition? I believe they have 1 or 2 loads available.

 

[Frank870]

Nice drilling!

Congrats!

 

[fuzzy39]

Why don't you order/purchase some new manufacture Sako ammunition? I believe they have 1 or 2 loads available.

I’m looking at it through Wolverine… they may need to buy a case though, haha.

 

[fuzzy39]

So… I was just too antsy to wait for dies. I was like, well, I’m sure I can neck up this Lapua 7.62x53r brass with dies I have on hand. I just need to know what this chamber is!!

I first started the night off by slugging the bore. I didn’t have any soft lead balls but I did have a few hundred .366 cast Bullets (lubed).I was mainly wanting to make sure that the 9.3 bore was not actually a .358 diameter bullet as some of the German drilling were. The bullet tapped through perfectly with the dowel and confirmed the hore is .366. Step one complete.

Next step… I started with a Lee 303 British shell holder as nothing else I had would fit the brass. A little tap with the rubber mallet and I was off to the races….

Next, what sizing die would I have that would let me run the brass through to neck it up without any other changes. 35 Sambar, what else! I was fortunate when Redding sent me the Sambar dies, they messed up and put a .338 expander button in. So tonight I was able to neck up to .338 then change back the button to .358 and neck up again. Unfortunately, the 9.3x74r is too tapered and I could simply run the brass through them. And, because my 9.3x74r dies are RCBS, I couldn’t change up the expander die…. What to do?

Well, I figured .358 to .366 is a small jump. I can size this by hand!!! I took out the expander pin and button from the 9.3x74r and sized the brass up by hand. Eureka!! It worked. Case looked perfect. I dropped a 270gr Speer bullet on top and gently seated it with my 35 Sambar dies. Almost too beautiful to believe…. It worked.

Next step, chamber the dummy! The round slide in perfect, action locked up, firing pin dropped!! Yeah.

So at this point I am pretty comfortable thinking that this drilling is in fact 9.3x53r Finnish. I can’t find any cerrosafe in Canada, so I cannot do a chamber cast. I found the 9.3x53 Swiss round in my Carteidges of the World but it did not show the specs.

I would very much appreciate if someone who had those specs could send me a copy or link. I will post a picture of the specs of the 9.3x53r Finnish round. I would also appreciate, I’m pretty sure you could not chamber the Finn round in the Swiss chamber and visa versa. I’m sure a more knowledgeable gunnie than I, could confirm that.

So tonight was a “Great Success” (Borat reference!

 

[fuzzy39]

Here are the pics

 

[Brutus]

Three point lockup & side clips too! Looks like the bee's knees for black bear and wild boar hunting and a proper rimmed big game rifle cartridge.

 

[Why not?]

If that were my gun, and it chambered and closed on a 7.62X54R, I would fire a brass-cased factory round in it. The bore is so much bigger than the bullet it wouldn’t develop enough pressure to damage the gun.

I would, however, have a nicely formed case to measure. It’s not my gun to do that, but sure wouldn’t mind having one like it.
Ted

 

[conor_90]

I almost bought this but was apprehensive about the chamber

I love stuff like this in theory but never have the time in reality

 

[fuzzy39]

If that were my gun, and it chambered and closed on a 7.62X54R, I would fire a brass-cased factory round in it. The bore is so much bigger than the bullet it wouldn’t develop enough pressure to damage the gun.

I would, however, have a nicely formed case to measure. It’s not my gun to do that, but sure wouldn’t mind having one like it.
Ted

Hey Ted,
Thanks for the advice. I don’t any 7.62 Russian rounds. Could I skip the necking up process and use the cream of wheat and wax plug fireform method? I’ve always necked up and just shot medium loads. I’ve never fireformed anything. I’ve never hesitated with modern bolt actions. The break action drilling gives me pause, haha.

 

[New Camper]

I have "Designing and Forming Custom Cartridges for Rifle and Handgun" from the International Cartridge Archives by Ken Howell. Appears you have it sorted, but if you need dimensions of both the 9.3x53 Finnish and Swiss rimmed rounds just PM an email or number I can send a picture by text. Long story short, neither will chamber in the other... length and diameter of shoulder and base vary enough to be obvious.

FTR, Howell suggests annealing neck and shoulder of 7.62 Russian brass and fire forming with inert filler should you be unable to obtain properly drawn and headstamped brass. Nice looking rifle. I'm fond of the drillings but so often they are either pristine or rough: I'd like an in between one with tight action, good bores but pre-scratched so that I can enjoy to the fullest.

 

[fuzzy39]

A little more research into the development of the 9.3x53R Finnish….

https://waffenlager.net/ammo/93x53r.html

I know, website is in Finnish and for some reason the English tab won’t work for me haha. Anyway, looks like it was first created in Finland in 1930!

Thanks to New Camper for the cartridge specs!

 

[Why not?]

Hey Ted,
Thanks for the advice. I don’t any 7.62 Russian rounds. Could I skip the necking up process and use the cream of wheat and wax plug fireform method? I’ve always necked up and just shot medium loads. I’ve never fireformed anything. I’ve never hesitated with modern bolt actions. The break action drilling gives me pause, haha.

You could certainly try COW and wax fireforming with a few cases and see how it goes. I have no idea what powder or charge you should use, but there will be someone on here who can help you with that.

Interesting thread. Please keep us posted,
Ted

 

[fuzzy39]

Soooo….. I did a chamber cast with Cerrosafe last night and low and behold, the chamber appears to in fact be the 9.3x53R SWISS!!! I did not take measurements yet as I only have calibers and not a micrometer. It is crazy that the 9.3x53Finn round I made chambered.

I should be able to simply use the 7.62x53R brass once I get dies.

I guess I’ll be speaking with CH4D Monday to cancel the dies I had ordered and get some Swiss ones, lol.

I’m enjoying this goose chase, lol.

 

[iron cat]

Well, I'll bet no one saw that coming!
Interesting project for sure!
Cat

 

[Brutus]

Looks like a juicy round indeed.
That could be paired up with two Brennekes.

Past owner was Van Helsing.

 

[fuzzy39]

I plan to use the 9.3Finn data seeing that the Swiss case capacity is clearly greater. I did take measurements and did confirm is is the Swiss version. If anyone has a head stamped 9.3x53R Swiss piece of brass or round…. I would love to buy it. Mainly just just to have that piece of history to go with the gun

 

[fuzzy39]

CH4D has the Swiss dies in stock and they were in the mail last Tuesday… shouldn’t be long before this old girl will tell some stories!

 

[fuzzy39]

And the chase continues….
I received my dues from CH4D. Stamped 9.3x53R Swiss. Everything looked good. Lubed up 20 cases of Lapua 7.62x53R brass, then the moment of truth. I run it through the die, shoot! It created a beautiful 9.3x53R Finnish case!!! No way!

I contacted CH4D the next day. The gentleman was incredulous. No way it is stamped Swiss, could it be wrong he tells me. Well, it was. I sent back the dies along with the chamber cast and diagrams of both published cases. So, I wait again. Haha.

Eventually I will get the right dies…. Not likely for hunting season though.