If you paid $150 for it and the bore is decent, you got a good deal. I hope people continue to run around repeating horror stories about Ross rifles, it makes them a lot cheaper to buy for those of us who know the difference.
Got my first Ross today!!!
- Thread starter Tinman204
- Start date
- Location
- Iroquois Falls ON
As stated above correct bolt assemby is the key. This goes for any firearm, even modern guns. The Browning lever action, for example, will blow back in your face if assembled incorrectly.
I have 2 more questions about my Ross that maybe some of you could answer. The first is what is the Ross' wood originally finished with? This one looks too shiney to be original, I'm guessing it's been varnished at one time or another.
My second question is what kind of distances do you guys shoot your Rosses at? I'm curious what type of groups can be achieved and at what distance?
My second question is what kind of distances do you guys shoot your Rosses at? I'm curious what type of groups can be achieved and at what distance?
Linseed oil. Your stock has been reshaped and sanded. Original stocks tend to be very dark if they haven't been sanded or stripped.
Range depends entirely on safety and your ability. I read an account from WWI of a group of Canadians soldiers who were firing on a German trench at 950 yards. Their fire was so accurate the enemy had to cease fire and take cover below the lip of the trench.
Range depends entirely on safety and your ability. I read an account from WWI of a group of Canadians soldiers who were firing on a German trench at 950 yards. Their fire was so accurate the enemy had to cease fire and take cover below the lip of the trench.
Thanks for the info. I'm guessing the limitations of my Ross will be me for sure! As for the stock I'm not sure what to do with it. It's been sanded and varnished at one point many years ago. There's no linseed oil on there for sure, it looks nothing like my Enfield. The finish is very shiny but the wood is dry. I fear that I may get cracks in the wood if I shoot it often. Anyone have any thoughts on that? It's not the original finish on the stock, if it was I'd rub some linseed oil on it and be done. To me if I remove the varnish and put 10 or so coats of boiled linseed oil on it I'm only protecting the wood, not bubbaing it? Or should I leave well enough alone? What are some of your thoughs?
If you ar worried as to the integrity of the wood, I would take the action off the stock and get some Linseed Oil into the wood. You an just slather it on with a rag, let it soak in.
When it tarts to slow down on absorbing the stuff, hit it with a good coat of Double Boiled Linsed Oil, which will then partway seal the wood. It won't dry out any more from inside.
The oil becomes a part OF the wood and adds greatly to its strength.
As to the finish, you can strip varnish off quite easily, then stain the wood. Walnut was used on these rifles, so you use a nice dark Walnut stain. Then let it dry and rub n coat after coat of Linseed Oil.
******************************************************************
As to accuracy, very rifle is different, of course. I have one here which (using the load I gave you) tries to put its bullet on top of each other at 100 yards off the sandbags. Generally, it is a hlf-inch rifle or BETTER.
I have another here which has a honking great scope on it; it is a 1.5-minute rifle, seemingly at any range, but I haven't had it past 400 yet. Summer is coming, though. As well, I haven;t put any time into developing a load for that rifle; my OWN health was pretty rough for a long while there, but that is improving, thanks to my Little Yellow Pills and my BP is down from the ceiling, so I can SHOOT again this coming year.
Most Rosses, with just a little work, can become a 1-MOA rifle if you put the time into them. As made, the barrels were excellent....... and I'm using 2012 standards, not 1912 standards.
Yeah: that good.
FINE rifles.
When it tarts to slow down on absorbing the stuff, hit it with a good coat of Double Boiled Linsed Oil, which will then partway seal the wood. It won't dry out any more from inside.
The oil becomes a part OF the wood and adds greatly to its strength.
As to the finish, you can strip varnish off quite easily, then stain the wood. Walnut was used on these rifles, so you use a nice dark Walnut stain. Then let it dry and rub n coat after coat of Linseed Oil.
******************************************************************
As to accuracy, very rifle is different, of course. I have one here which (using the load I gave you) tries to put its bullet on top of each other at 100 yards off the sandbags. Generally, it is a hlf-inch rifle or BETTER.
I have another here which has a honking great scope on it; it is a 1.5-minute rifle, seemingly at any range, but I haven't had it past 400 yet. Summer is coming, though. As well, I haven;t put any time into developing a load for that rifle; my OWN health was pretty rough for a long while there, but that is improving, thanks to my Little Yellow Pills and my BP is down from the ceiling, so I can SHOOT again this coming year.
Most Rosses, with just a little work, can become a 1-MOA rifle if you put the time into them. As made, the barrels were excellent....... and I'm using 2012 standards, not 1912 standards.
Yeah: that good.
FINE rifles.
Thanks for the info Smellie. I'm thinking putting my stock back to the original color and finish is something I'm going to start doing right away. I just finished my sportered Enfield which took pretty much since I got it, wanted to take my time and let that BLO dry properly between coats.
I was supposed to be picking up my first press and a bullet mould last night but unfortunately they ordered me a .311, 95g instead of .311, 185g! So I'm waiting on a mould and my collet dies set still. I got my press so it's just a matter of mounting it to my bench.
I'm still looking for 31 cal gass checks locally but it seems 30 cal is the only thing I'm finding. I'm sure very soon I'll be well on my way to making match grade ammo so I can experiment with my new Ross.
I'm very excited to spend a day putting 50 or so down range just to see what she'll do. The three rounds I shot were way off but I was shooting off hand, freezing my butt off and to put the icing on the cake I later realized that the front sight blade was as far to the left as it could go!
I was supposed to be picking up my first press and a bullet mould last night but unfortunately they ordered me a .311, 95g instead of .311, 185g! So I'm waiting on a mould and my collet dies set still. I got my press so it's just a matter of mounting it to my bench.
I'm still looking for 31 cal gass checks locally but it seems 30 cal is the only thing I'm finding. I'm sure very soon I'll be well on my way to making match grade ammo so I can experiment with my new Ross.
I'm very excited to spend a day putting 50 or so down range just to see what she'll do. The three rounds I shot were way off but I was shooting off hand, freezing my butt off and to put the icing on the cake I later realized that the front sight blade was as far to the left as it could go!
It's been said but (now that I got to seeing your pics) your bolt is assembled perfectly. Note the distance between the bolt sleeve and bolt head, width of your thumb, "Rule of Thumb". Hole up. Perfect.
You've already shot it but you should also carefully watch the bolt rotate into lockup as it closes up into the receiver- it has to turn 90 degrees.
All of that good, you have an incredibly strong rifle!
You've already shot it but you should also carefully watch the bolt rotate into lockup as it closes up into the receiver- it has to turn 90 degrees.
All of that good, you have an incredibly strong rifle!
Idon,t think there is such a thing as .31cal. gas checks. .30cal gas checks are what you use for .311 bullets. I use lead bullets size .314 with .30cal gas checks in my #4 Longbranch
.
I was going to suggest that you buy a set of LEE Collet Dies until I read your Post #27. You can not go wrong with them, as you not only get the neck size die but also a full length one for range pickups and other brass that may not initially fit. The problem with full length sizing the .303 British is that the cases seperate after a very few reloadings when they are full length resized all the time. After firing the cases first time, they will go back into the chamber because they are formed to THAT particular chamber and do not need full length resizing.
The 13 grain Red Dot load was developed by C.E. Harris, a staff writer with the American Rifleman, as an all around load for military rifles. It was intended for CAST BULLETS only, of a weight similar to or less than the original military bullet weight. At 1300 fps, gas checks are not really needed, but with some rifles may improve accuracy with them. Some bullets will take the .30 calibre gas checks, and I prefer Hornady brand because the "crimp" onto the base of the bullet. When target shooting a long time ago, I used cast bullets out to 600 yards with acceptable accuracy, and it should be possible to get the same accuracy out to 300 yards as you do with Mark 7 Ball ammo. The 13 grain charge may have to be adjusted up to plus or minus ONE grain, but should not really be more than 14 grains of Red Dot.
The .303 seems to like cast bullets at velocities up to about 1900 fps, but results are "spotty" after that as leading of the barrel may develop. However, I have used paper patched lead bullets up to 2700 fps out of the .303 with no leading.
.
I was going to suggest that you buy a set of LEE Collet Dies until I read your Post #27. You can not go wrong with them, as you not only get the neck size die but also a full length one for range pickups and other brass that may not initially fit. The problem with full length sizing the .303 British is that the cases seperate after a very few reloadings when they are full length resized all the time. After firing the cases first time, they will go back into the chamber because they are formed to THAT particular chamber and do not need full length resizing.
The 13 grain Red Dot load was developed by C.E. Harris, a staff writer with the American Rifleman, as an all around load for military rifles. It was intended for CAST BULLETS only, of a weight similar to or less than the original military bullet weight. At 1300 fps, gas checks are not really needed, but with some rifles may improve accuracy with them. Some bullets will take the .30 calibre gas checks, and I prefer Hornady brand because the "crimp" onto the base of the bullet. When target shooting a long time ago, I used cast bullets out to 600 yards with acceptable accuracy, and it should be possible to get the same accuracy out to 300 yards as you do with Mark 7 Ball ammo. The 13 grain charge may have to be adjusted up to plus or minus ONE grain, but should not really be more than 14 grains of Red Dot.
The .303 seems to like cast bullets at velocities up to about 1900 fps, but results are "spotty" after that as leading of the barrel may develop. However, I have used paper patched lead bullets up to 2700 fps out of the .303 with no leading.
.
I'm going to try the 13 grain red dot load that you mentioned Buffdog. Smellie mentioned that load to me in an earlier thread and it sounds like what I'm looking for. I've stated before my wife has nerve damage in her left arm so she pretty much has to shoot from a rest one handed. She can shoot off hand but the recoil can cause major nerve pain in her bad side. She has fallen in love with my Enfield and is becoming a very good shot with it (better then me IMHO!). If I can take some of the recoil out of the rifle it will be much easier on her.
The other thing is I love to collect guns but shooting them is the best thing since sliced bread. When I bought the Ross people were continually asking me if I was going to shoot it? I said to them "why else would I have bought it?". If I shoot often I would rathe send low pressure lead rounds though my 100 year old gun the a hot round that will wear my bore out over time.
I cast around 10 pounds of lead the other day into ingots so I'm anxiously awaiting my mould. I purchased 80 pieces of once fired imperial brass at the Brandon show. I'm in the process of chambering the ones that are not exceeding the OAL for a case and most seem to chamber in my Ross, so I'm guessing I can neck size only and I should be good to go. I'll buy 30 cal hornaday gas checks next time I'm close to wholesale sports, I thought they didn't make .31 cal gas checks and was going to buy the .30 cal ones yesterday but the guy at the store kept saying .31 cal so I didn't buy them.
Anyhow, thanks to all of the Ross owners who keep giving me all of this great info! I think I'm a Ross guy now, it feels like a match grade target rifle and being a large guy, the full length barrel and weight feel right to me.
The other thing is I love to collect guns but shooting them is the best thing since sliced bread. When I bought the Ross people were continually asking me if I was going to shoot it? I said to them "why else would I have bought it?". If I shoot often I would rathe send low pressure lead rounds though my 100 year old gun the a hot round that will wear my bore out over time.
I cast around 10 pounds of lead the other day into ingots so I'm anxiously awaiting my mould. I purchased 80 pieces of once fired imperial brass at the Brandon show. I'm in the process of chambering the ones that are not exceeding the OAL for a case and most seem to chamber in my Ross, so I'm guessing I can neck size only and I should be good to go. I'll buy 30 cal hornaday gas checks next time I'm close to wholesale sports, I thought they didn't make .31 cal gas checks and was going to buy the .30 cal ones yesterday but the guy at the store kept saying .31 cal so I didn't buy them.
Anyhow, thanks to all of the Ross owners who keep giving me all of this great info! I think I'm a Ross guy now, it feels like a match grade target rifle and being a large guy, the full length barrel and weight feel right to me.
[quote:The problem with full length sizing the .303 British is that the cases seperate after a very few reloadings when they are full length resized all the time unquote]
you will not have this problem with a model 10 Ross, unlike the #4 Enfield, they were built to very close tolerances and do not have an oversized chamber.
Brownie
you will not have this problem with a model 10 Ross, unlike the #4 Enfield, they were built to very close tolerances and do not have an oversized chamber.
Brownie
Mine has an "E" on the barrel stating that it has an enlarged chamber. But I fired 3 rounds with no signs of problems. My Enfield has a sloppy chamber for sure and the rubber band trick is solving that problem. What I was worried about is the brass I bought is of unknown origin so if it was say fired in an Enfield it could be fire formed to large and therefore not fit my Ross chamber. They seem to chamber so I don't see any issues. I just purchased 2 boxes of Privi ammo and a box of imperial so I will fire some of those in the Ross and keep the separate from my Enfield brass.
I'm so happy that CGNer's on here let me know about the lee collet die, I was getting turned off of reloading .303. My friend that sold me my enfield said he reloaded .303 for my gun and had problems keeping case head separation in check. He also was full length sizing.
One more thing while I think of it to crimp or not to crimp. I understand the perpose of crimping bullets, but it seems some people crimp .303 and some don't. What are some of your thoughts on this? Will my brass last longer without crimping? But will I lose accuracy without a crimp? My thoughts were that if loaded 13 grain loads of red dot that is a fast burning powder and therefore a crimp shouldn't be necessary?
I'm so happy that CGNer's on here let me know about the lee collet die, I was getting turned off of reloading .303. My friend that sold me my enfield said he reloaded .303 for my gun and had problems keeping case head separation in check. He also was full length sizing.
One more thing while I think of it to crimp or not to crimp. I understand the perpose of crimping bullets, but it seems some people crimp .303 and some don't. What are some of your thoughts on this? Will my brass last longer without crimping? But will I lose accuracy without a crimp? My thoughts were that if loaded 13 grain loads of red dot that is a fast burning powder and therefore a crimp shouldn't be necessary?
.
You are right on your rifle having an Enlarged chamber. The "E" stamped on the barrel shows this. BROWNIE is right when he states that they were built to close tolerances, BUT most of the Military Ross M-10 rifles have had their chambers Enlarged later by reaming the chamber oversize.
Personally, I do not crimp bullets. As long as there is enough neck tension on the bullet to hold it in the case securely, I am of the opinion that you do not need to crimp them. Crimping is also harder on the mouth of your brass, as you are working it every time you crimp. The purpose of crimping a bullet is so that the bullets in the magazine do not move backwards from inertia when the rifle is fired. This applies mostly to hunting ammo, especially in a cartridge of large bore designed for dangerous game. I have not crimped bullets when reloading for over 50 years, and I shot a lot of them both on the target range and on big game.
One purpose of crimping is to give a bit of resistance to starting the bullet, so that the powder will be fully ignited. With the 13 grain Red Dot load, this is not really necessary. I have also used Magnum rifle primers with some other powders to give better ignition, but I use standard primers with the Red Dot load.
On bullets, especially jacketed bullets, some have a crimping groove and some do not. When you load for maximum accuracy, you sometimes need to move the bullet out further or even in a bit due to the shape of the nose of the bullet and where the full diameter of the bullet contacts the rifling. It is very likely that the mouth of the case will not be lined up with the crimping groove. What happens is that the brass at the mouth of the case must now push into the bullet at a place the bullet has no allowance for crimping. This can then force the whole neck and shoulder backwards and actually put a bit of a projection at the point of the case where the sharp angle of the shoulder decreases to the neck. This bulges out the case and creates difficult loading into the chamber, (if it will load.)
Another problem is that the .303 British case generally has a bit thinner walls than a lot of other cartridges. It was designed as a Military Cartridge to be shot ONCE and not really reloaded. This thinner case is more prone to collapse when crimped. Also, seating dies do NOT fully support the case body when the bullet is being fully seated. The neck area is supported but most dies have a generous clearance for the body of the case when being seated. This allows for expansion at the shoulder when a crimped jacketed bullet is wrongly seated. Your brass should last longer if you neck size and do not crimp it. Accuracy is another thing, and Cast Bullets seem to have laws of their own, and a lot more variables such as hardness, lubrication, and such. Generally bullets not crimped tend to be a bit more accurate. If you look at the Bench Rest Shooters, who are interested in the maximum accuracy, then ask how many of them crimp their bullets? Crimping does deform the bullet and deformed bullets are not consistent in accuracy.
That said, do not expect Bench Rest Accuracy out of cast bullets. I used them on the target range out to 300 yards, and could develop a load that gave the same accuracy as Mark VII Ball ammo, and even shot them out to 600 yards with good results on targets. You have to experiment to see what a rifle likes, but once you find the right combination, it is amazing what you can do.
.
You are right on your rifle having an Enlarged chamber. The "E" stamped on the barrel shows this. BROWNIE is right when he states that they were built to close tolerances, BUT most of the Military Ross M-10 rifles have had their chambers Enlarged later by reaming the chamber oversize.
Personally, I do not crimp bullets. As long as there is enough neck tension on the bullet to hold it in the case securely, I am of the opinion that you do not need to crimp them. Crimping is also harder on the mouth of your brass, as you are working it every time you crimp. The purpose of crimping a bullet is so that the bullets in the magazine do not move backwards from inertia when the rifle is fired. This applies mostly to hunting ammo, especially in a cartridge of large bore designed for dangerous game. I have not crimped bullets when reloading for over 50 years, and I shot a lot of them both on the target range and on big game.
One purpose of crimping is to give a bit of resistance to starting the bullet, so that the powder will be fully ignited. With the 13 grain Red Dot load, this is not really necessary. I have also used Magnum rifle primers with some other powders to give better ignition, but I use standard primers with the Red Dot load.
On bullets, especially jacketed bullets, some have a crimping groove and some do not. When you load for maximum accuracy, you sometimes need to move the bullet out further or even in a bit due to the shape of the nose of the bullet and where the full diameter of the bullet contacts the rifling. It is very likely that the mouth of the case will not be lined up with the crimping groove. What happens is that the brass at the mouth of the case must now push into the bullet at a place the bullet has no allowance for crimping. This can then force the whole neck and shoulder backwards and actually put a bit of a projection at the point of the case where the sharp angle of the shoulder decreases to the neck. This bulges out the case and creates difficult loading into the chamber, (if it will load.)
Another problem is that the .303 British case generally has a bit thinner walls than a lot of other cartridges. It was designed as a Military Cartridge to be shot ONCE and not really reloaded. This thinner case is more prone to collapse when crimped. Also, seating dies do NOT fully support the case body when the bullet is being fully seated. The neck area is supported but most dies have a generous clearance for the body of the case when being seated. This allows for expansion at the shoulder when a crimped jacketed bullet is wrongly seated. Your brass should last longer if you neck size and do not crimp it. Accuracy is another thing, and Cast Bullets seem to have laws of their own, and a lot more variables such as hardness, lubrication, and such. Generally bullets not crimped tend to be a bit more accurate. If you look at the Bench Rest Shooters, who are interested in the maximum accuracy, then ask how many of them crimp their bullets? Crimping does deform the bullet and deformed bullets are not consistent in accuracy.
That said, do not expect Bench Rest Accuracy out of cast bullets. I used them on the target range out to 300 yards, and could develop a load that gave the same accuracy as Mark VII Ball ammo, and even shot them out to 600 yards with good results on targets. You have to experiment to see what a rifle likes, but once you find the right combination, it is amazing what you can do.
.
