Great ballistic test from Norma

Ardent said:
I couldn’t find the part in the video where the bone stopped the 2800fps bullet from reaching the goo behind it unfortunately.
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Well there are a few bullets they didn't test against the adamantium poodle scapula so we really don't know ;)


DOUGLAS D said:
I'm pretty sure Spruster would have a bone to pick with this thread.Laugh2
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I see what you did there! Quite humerus.


DGY said:
Oh he would lol… what happened to him?
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He got pinked a while back but I don't know what finally bit him in the azz! Wish I did lol

If he were here perhaps he'd tell us about the coyotes he shot through the lungs at dead runs from 200 meters, offhand...with a 243. They were completely unfazed and had to be dropped with a 308. Cause they get big out there.

Maybe the bullets would have splashed on their shoulders.
 
Venison shoulder. Somebody out there is scratching their head thinking they took a good shot and never recovered the Buck.

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Eye opener eh? That isn’t the first time I’ve seen that. But they always get ignored. My hunting partner pulled a grissled .277 cup and core bullet off the shoulder bone of a 380 public land bull elk. That’s a heart breaker for someone.
 
Bullets do really weird things sometimes. But anything that makes it through two gel blocks and into a third ain't stopping on an elk shoulder lol
 
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pathfinder76 said:
Is that observation based on you gel shooting experience or your elk shooting experience?
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An answer which says "I really have no answer"

Your previous insistence that a cup and core bullet and a monolithic are both going to come out of gel with 100% weight retention already showed you shouldn't be talking about gel as if you understand it in the first place :) Ego seems to be interfering with that.

Show me one bullet that is making it through multiple gel blocks but not a magical bulletproof elk shoulder without that being considered by just about everyone as a fluke. Just one.
 
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pathfinder76 said:
Joel, how would you do that? Which is exactly the point. Jello is not an elk.
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You can't name one bullet that performs great in gel but fails to live up to that in elk?

Here's the thing. "Jello" doesn't have to be an elk. Properly calibrated ballistic gelatin gives you a consistent, repeatable medium in which to test bullets against each other and have results you can compare and extrapolate from. That's exactly what it was designed for.

Again, if someone thinks that cup and core bullets and monos provide the same results...or that a bullet is going through 30+ inches of gel, but not making it through one elk shoulder, it really just highlights that they don't understand.

If you think it is so unreliable, again, what is just one bullet that does great in gel but would not make it through an elk shoulder? One can't be too hard, can it?

PS: 35 Whelen with a 250gr Partition isn't making it through two gel blocks :)
 
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Joel, no one can. Which is the problem.

But I have seen with my own eyes a 150gr 7mm Swift Scirocco flatten and fail to break or penetrate the shoulder of a bull moose. A second shot killed the bull. How do you think that same bullet performs in ballistic gel? I’m sure you can find that data online.
 
pathfinder76 said:
Joel, no one can. Which is the problem.

But I have seen with my own eyes a 150gr 7mm Swift Scirocco flatten and fail to break or penetrate the shoulder of a bull moose. A second shot killed the bull. How do you think that same bullet performs in ballistic gel? I’m sure you can find that data online.
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That particular one, or in general?

Because that particular one failed. Pretty sure we can all agree that a 150gr 7mm Scirocco bonded is an excellent choice for moose. Would you stop recommending that bullet for big game, or was it really kind of a freak one-off?

As a breed I bet they do very well. But, if that one turned itself into a dime, I bet it would have done pretty badly in gel, honestly.

Rare as it may be, even a premium bullet can fail.


As far as "no one can" I have to disagree. The results of many great bullets, like Accubonds, Trophy Bonded whatever iteration, Partitions, etc etc etc consistently perform better in gel than many traditional cup and core bullets (that still kill a LOT of big game and are rarely found wanting!) and Monos even more so...

This tells us something.
 
Joel said:
That particular one, or in general?

Because that particular one failed. Pretty sure we can all agree that a 150gr 7mm Scirocco bonded is an excellent choice for moose. Would you stop recommending that bullet for big game, or was it really kind of a freak one-off?

As a breed I bet they do very well. But, if that one turned itself into a dime, I bet it would have done pretty badly in gel, honestly.

Rare as it may be, even a premium bullet can fail.
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Actually Joel, no that particular bullet wasn’t a great option. Which is why we now have the Scirroco II. Apparently lab testing in Jello doesn’t alway translate well into the real world. Lol.

Bullet companies don’t hang their hats on lab results. That’s why bullets change.
 
Ah! I didn't know that! Thanks for the info! In that case...

ht tps://www.handloadermagazine.com/swift-scirocco-ii#:~:text=The%20box%20the%20bullets%20are,to%20a%20pure%20lead%20core.

"A few years after Sciroccos reached the market, quite a few mega-magnum cartridges, such as the .300 Remington Ultra Magnum, were introduced. “I thought people with these big magnums would be mostly shooting big game at long range,” Hober said. Instead, he started receiving reports of hunters using these magnum cartridges shooting Sciroccos at game at 50 yards or so. The mushroomed bullets often had a split in the jacket or had expanded out nearly flat."

They should perform as such in close range or high velocity shots just like a lot of other lightly constructed bullets do. How would they be any different? Why would they perform differently in gel?

Hardly a unique phenomenon that too weak of a bullet is driven too fast. They don't really shine in gel either.

Like the 250gr Partitions do, which still don't exit block #2 lol
 
There is always some sort of gear failure with some people. Triggers freezing up, bullets failing to penetrate, non-extraction, scopes and mounts not holding zero…

These people must hunt a lot to have these types of gear nightmares… which online are spoken as the rule rather then some odd exception.
 
Joel said:
Ah! I didn't know that! Thanks for the info! In that case...

ht tps://www.handloadermagazine.com/swift-scirocco-ii#:~:text=The%20box%20the%20bullets%20are,to%20a%20pure%20lead%20core.

"A few years after Sciroccos reached the market, quite a few mega-magnum cartridges, such as the .300 Remington Ultra Magnum, were introduced. “I thought people with these big magnums would be mostly shooting big game at long range,” Hober said. Instead, he started receiving reports of hunters using these magnum cartridges shooting Sciroccos at game at 50 yards or so. The mushroomed bullets often had a split in the jacket or had expanded out nearly flat."

They should perform as such in close range or high velocity shots just like a lot of other lightly constructed bullets do. How would they be any different? Why would they perform differently in gel?

Hardly a unique phenomenon that too weak of a bullet is driven too fast. They don't really shine in gel either.

Like the 250gr Partitions do, which still don't exit block #2 lol
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Just so you know, the failure I saw was from the super duper mega magnum 280 Remington. But the above sounds great.
 
pathfinder76 said:
Just so you know, the failure I saw was from the super duper mega magnum 280 Remington. But the above sounds great.
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So how DID they do in gel? Were they even tested? Any video of a comparable bullet doing great? I can't find anyone doing any testing on an original Scirocco

Why would something like a Failsafe or any of the actual tough bullets (or a good cup and core) not have beat the brakes off em?

Sorry man, but soft bullets come apart and flatten out in LOTS of mediums besides one a good 30-30 170gr or 303 Brit vanilla bullet can make it through at average ranges lol

There's nothing special about big game as a medium. Interestingly enough, lots of dudes are dumping big game very well with ELD-Ms and they're going through all kinds of bones, and their gel results ain't exactly stellar when combined with a great big game bullet.

Again...not seeing where these bullets that can't be trusted are excelling in gel. Ever.
 
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