Handgun Hunting Support
- Thread starter SIGP2101
- Start date
1) - there's still a lot of people uncomfortable with bowhunting. It doesn't have a huge base of support within the community, but rather is tolerated because there's some place it makes a hell of a lot more sense than using a gun, and
2) - we have minimum power requirements for bows
Not to mention minimum broadhead sizes for some animals.Really. ANd they all became proficient in less that 6 times using a handgun? Their 6th time shooting they could all shoot to a skill level suitable for hunting at 50 yards?
I find that hard to believe. Having watched several newbies learn now, i think it would take the average person a little longer to be truly proficient at that range.
So no, i don't think i'm terribly unusual.
Remember - i did not say that people couldn't get that good, or even that I couldn't get that good. I said that it's much harder to get that good than it is with a rifle.
Well bow hunting had a few advantages in its argument that were a little more 'obvious'. And lets remember bow hunting was not held in high regard for a long time.
One - we already allowed it so it was an easier fight. Unlike handguns which faced a political challenge, bows are not thought of as 'dangerous weapons' by the gov't. That meant that they didn't need to win other hunters over, they just had to keep other hunters from turning against them. We will actually have to have support from hunters to force the gov't to bring this back. Different fight.
Two - the expanded interest in bowhunting is gaining momentum without as much resistance by hunters because it's recognized as being the more practical method in many circumstances. For example, around towns. I've actually thought of getting a bow for shooting in the no shoot zones, where a rifle wouldn't be safe or practical even if it were legal. Also - theres some people who don't have or can't get a gun license, but can get a bow.
Three - it was recognized that it's an ENTIRELY different hunting experience. Just like falconry is entirely different. You can experience almost the same thing as 'pistol hunting' using a small rifle, but bowhunting can only be experienced with a bow.
Four - THEY, like i'm trying to convince YOU guys to do, put forward the argument that modern hunting bows are NOTHING like bows of days gone by. With 300 fps bows out there, and advances in broadhead tech, as well as sighting systems that make it much easier, it is perceived that today's bowhunter with just a little practice can be relatively assured of a good hit, and that that hit will be fatal. There is a sense that this is more true today than in the past. Whether that's accurate or not i have some suspicions about, but that was the impression they were able to create.
So you can see the difference.
But there are lessons to be learned there. We too can point out that modern loadings have the ability to be more powerful than turn of the century wheel guns. We also can demonstrate that there are opportunities that go missed if all you have is a rifle. And while we may not be able to argue handgun hunting is a radically different experience than rifle hunting, we CAN argue that it allows you to hunt differently and therefore represents a new experience because you can go and do things that would be difficult with a rifle.
It's all in how you 'package' it.
Foxer. Who are you at arguement with here in the last pile of pages other than everyone? Or is it just me?
Its a drag that we seem left with those that would support hand gun hunting in this thread, and now we're argueing over ridiculous and frivolous details with, sorry, it seems just you.
Its a drag that we seem left with those that would support hand gun hunting in this thread, and now we're argueing over ridiculous and frivolous details with, sorry, it seems just you.
Foxer, turn o' the century wheel guns were nowhere near the 44 mag in power and as I previously mentioned bolt action hand guns shoot big game rifle rounds. It's all about barrel length isn't it? Mine's bigger than yours, batter up.
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
Salty said:Foxer. Who are you at arguement with here in the last pile of pages other than everyone? Or is it just me?
Its a drag that we seem left with those that would support hand gun hunting in this thread, and now we're argueing over ridiculous and frivolous details with, sorry, it seems just you.
As I stated earlier on, our first, and possibly greatest hurdle, is convincing those WITHIN our ranks. It's our 'divisions' that will prove to be our greatest adversary. If we can't get it straight between us, how can we take it to the next level?
Salty said:Care to give the Coles notes version??
They don't appear to have any.
I mean, it's legal to hunt wiht a handgun, but the let peopel choose what works best for them.
There are restrictions on ML (over 45 cal) and Bows (weigth of draw/size of arrow) but noting I coudl see abut handguns.
Gatehouse said:They don't appear to have any.
I mean, it's legal to hunt wiht a handgun, but the let peopel choose what works best for them.
There are restrictions on ML (over 45 cal) and Bows (weigth of draw/size of arrow) but noting I coudl see abut handguns.
What a breath of fresh air.
Gatehouse said:They don't appear to have any.
I mean, it's legal to hunt wiht a handgun, but the let peopel choose what works best for them.
There are restrictions on ML (over 45 cal) and Bows (weigth of draw/size of arrow) but noting I coudl see abut handguns.
I guess a lot of Alaskans must have a lot more common sense than some would have us believe Canadian's do........
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
I was, and still am, hoping to go on a Moose hunt in Alaska with a handgun, .500 S&W. The original plan was for 2009 but if at all, 2010 is probably more realistic. I haven't got into the handgun 'details' but a guide indicates it isn't a problem. It was his impression there wasprobably more in the way of red tape transporting from here to the Alaska border than actually packing & using it hunting there. A check through the CFC dosen't really indicate that would much of a problem either, so, here's hoping. Next task, come up with the cash.
Montana
Firearms
Caliber: There is no caliber limitation during the general big game hunting season (except as specified under shotgun) for the taking of big game animals in Montana. Match the caliber and firearm to the size of the animal hunted.
The use of poisonous, explosive, or deleterious substances on or in any bullet or projectile is prohibited.
Shotgun: Hunters are prohibited from shooting deer or elk with shotguns, except with lead loads of 0 buck or larger, or rifled slugs.
Restrictions for muzzleloader and traditional handgun areas only:
Muzzleloader: A muzzleloader must meet the following criteria:
It must not be capable of being loaded from the breech of the barrel.
It may not be loaded with any prepared paper or metallic cartridges.
It must be charged with black powder, pyrodex, or an equivalent.
It must be ignited by a percussion, flintlock, matchlock, or wheelock mechanism.
It must be a minimum of .45 caliber.
It may have no more than 2 barrels.
It must use lead projectiles only, no sabots.
Traditional Handguns: A traditional handgun:
is not capable of being shoulder mounted;
has a barrel of less than 10 1/2 inches;
chambers only a straight wall cartridge,not originally developed for rifles.
Firearms
Caliber: There is no caliber limitation during the general big game hunting season (except as specified under shotgun) for the taking of big game animals in Montana. Match the caliber and firearm to the size of the animal hunted.
The use of poisonous, explosive, or deleterious substances on or in any bullet or projectile is prohibited.
Shotgun: Hunters are prohibited from shooting deer or elk with shotguns, except with lead loads of 0 buck or larger, or rifled slugs.
Restrictions for muzzleloader and traditional handgun areas only:
Muzzleloader: A muzzleloader must meet the following criteria:
It must not be capable of being loaded from the breech of the barrel.
It may not be loaded with any prepared paper or metallic cartridges.
It must be charged with black powder, pyrodex, or an equivalent.
It must be ignited by a percussion, flintlock, matchlock, or wheelock mechanism.
It must be a minimum of .45 caliber.
It may have no more than 2 barrels.
It must use lead projectiles only, no sabots.
Traditional Handguns: A traditional handgun:
is not capable of being shoulder mounted;
has a barrel of less than 10 1/2 inches;
chambers only a straight wall cartridge,not originally developed for rifles.
Idaho
Rifl e and Shotgun
In any hunt, including any-weapon seasons, it is unlawful to
pursue or kill big game animals:
• With any electronic device attached to, or incorporated on,
the fi rearm or scope.
• With any fi rearm that, in combination with a scope, sling
and/or any attachments, weighs more than 16 pounds.
• With any fully automatic fi rearm.
• With any shotgun using shot smaller than #00 buck.
• With any rimfi re rifl e, rimfi re handgun, or muzzle-loading
handgun, except for mountain lion.
Rifl e and Shotgun
In any hunt, including any-weapon seasons, it is unlawful to
pursue or kill big game animals:
• With any electronic device attached to, or incorporated on,
the fi rearm or scope.
• With any fi rearm that, in combination with a scope, sling
and/or any attachments, weighs more than 16 pounds.
• With any fully automatic fi rearm.
• With any shotgun using shot smaller than #00 buck.
• With any rimfi re rifl e, rimfi re handgun, or muzzle-loading
handgun, except for mountain lion.
Washington State-
Allow a pile of bolt action pistols in approved calibres. Same for revolvers in the 40 plus league..
http://wdfw.wa.gov/wlm/game/hunter/handguns.htm
Allow a pile of bolt action pistols in approved calibres. Same for revolvers in the 40 plus league..
http://wdfw.wa.gov/wlm/game/hunter/handguns.htm
Washington has this statement prior to thier big list
Firearms Which Meet Handgun Hunting Regulations
The recently revised handgun hunting regulations allow hunters to pursue big game with a .24 (or larger) centerfire handgun with a minimum barrel length of four inches. Regulations now provide handgun hunters with a truly dizzying array of potential hunting cartridges; unfortunately, not every legal cartridge represents a good choice for big game hunters.
Hunter responsibility has always been a critical component of the hunting experience and now--more than ever--it is imperative that hunters make responsible choices when selecting a particular firearm or cartridge for handgun hunting. The recommendations below represent guidelines prepared for your consideration by hunter education program staff. It is now legal, for example, to use a 9mm handgun to hunt deer or elk. Such a decision, however, would be inappropriate since there is no way that the 9mm cartridge is sufficiently powerful for big game hunting. Even though the 9mm may now be legal, it is not a responsible choice for big game hunting.
If you have any questions about our recommendations, or if you have any doubts about the suitability of your handgun/cartridge for big game hunting, we invite you to contact hunter education program staff at huntered@dfw.wa.gov or (360) 902-8113.
Best wishes for a safe, enjoyable hunt!
Firearms Which Meet Handgun Hunting Regulations
The recently revised handgun hunting regulations allow hunters to pursue big game with a .24 (or larger) centerfire handgun with a minimum barrel length of four inches. Regulations now provide handgun hunters with a truly dizzying array of potential hunting cartridges; unfortunately, not every legal cartridge represents a good choice for big game hunters.
Hunter responsibility has always been a critical component of the hunting experience and now--more than ever--it is imperative that hunters make responsible choices when selecting a particular firearm or cartridge for handgun hunting. The recommendations below represent guidelines prepared for your consideration by hunter education program staff. It is now legal, for example, to use a 9mm handgun to hunt deer or elk. Such a decision, however, would be inappropriate since there is no way that the 9mm cartridge is sufficiently powerful for big game hunting. Even though the 9mm may now be legal, it is not a responsible choice for big game hunting.
If you have any questions about our recommendations, or if you have any doubts about the suitability of your handgun/cartridge for big game hunting, we invite you to contact hunter education program staff at huntered@dfw.wa.gov or (360) 902-8113.
Best wishes for a safe, enjoyable hunt!
Gatehouse said:Walksalot, I messed wiht your post a bit to make a point. The same arguents have been made regarding bows, and We allow people wiht bows to hunt, and anyone that wants to be sucessful quickly learns that he must practice and beocme proficient. No difference to a handgun.
The reallity of the situation would be that wanting and having are two different things. I would venture to say if handguns were legislated legal the majority would mess with them for the first while and then they would be left at home. I don't think most would do the practice required to become and remain proficient with a handgun. Hunters should be spending time becoming and remaing proficient with a rifle leave alone a handgun.
.
Tell us aboutthe negative publicity? Why woudl it make a difference?
The law enforcement community would be against people carrying hand guns and the media would suck it up through a flavour straw. It would do far more harm than good to our sport
The government isn't "arming" anyone. We woudl buy our own guns
True that, bad choice of words.
What do border guards have to do wiht this? They are in the public every day, we are talking about going outin the bush and hunting wiht a handgun- 2 very different things.
Here we are talking about hunting with handguns and the people guarding our borders don't have them. It would be lidicrous of the government to let hunters carry handguns in the bush and let people guarding our borders go without. The net, net is you will walk on the frozen ceiling of hell bofore hunters will legally carry handguns hunting.
