Help!! Shooting low is driving me crazy
- Thread starter MG4A6
- Start date
I have practiced a ton to avoid flinching, when I pull the trigger and there is no round in the chamber or something odd happens I rarely flinch. Caught myself doing it 3 times in the past 2 years so I don't think that's the problem(usually when I'm dumping the mag in a tight as spot as possible as fast as possible)... But you never know, next time I am at the range I will see who the Miculek is and see if they want to give it a go for me
Take sight image 3 from above, if I were to do that my group would be 4" below that center line... in a 2" group though. It's like I have to hide the threat with my barrel lol. I think I will head down to the shooting center and try some of their pistols with different sights.
Long: Great info! I will focus on the front sight like you suggested instead of focusing on lining up all the sites.
Your gun, if it is stock, is set up for Sight pic 2 above. If you still shoot low it is you who must change what you are doing. The gun is shooting where the sights are aiming when the gun goes off not where they were when you decided to pull the trigger.
Take Care
Bob
I would suggest flinching is separate from pre ignition push. Some flinching is movement due to fear of noise and recoil, which is not unnatural but is definitely undesired. Flinching generally results in poor trigger control and will result in poor groups. If a shooter is turning in decent groups for the distance, then we are likely not talking about a flinch. This is where pre ignition push comes in as it shows a shooter trying to actively control recoil and doing the exact same thing every time with good fundamentals resulting in a nice group just low.
Recoil control is a mandatory part of shooting if we are going to try shooting at speed, bill drills for example. A key part of recoil control is post ignition push where the shooter is actively bringing the gun back onto target. The only difference between pre ignition push and post ignition push is timing. Now that timing is hard to get right but it is needed if one is striving for really fast splits. That subtle difference is why I used the term pre ignition push vice flinch.
So if we want to minimize pre ignition push while still trying to shoot at speed we need to deal with the timing issues. Shooting a 22LR can help as it allows you to focus on the sights without the noise and recoil of a centerfire pistol, thus allowing you to learn more on how recoil acts on you and the gun allowing you to work out the timing better. Same thing with watching the front sight with a hard focus and focusing on calling the shot.
Another aspect going back to what I mentioned about chanting in your mind “Front sight, Front sight” is just keeping your mental focus on the sights vice the trigger or target. A target focus or trigger focus is a good way to have anticipation. Anticipation here though can be confused with flinching as it also results in poor groups as it usually also causes poor trigger control. Difference being that the shooter should be able to recognize that they were anticipating the shot and rushed into a botched round.
Recoil control is a mandatory part of shooting if we are going to try shooting at speed, bill drills for example. A key part of recoil control is post ignition push where the shooter is actively bringing the gun back onto target. The only difference between pre ignition push and post ignition push is timing. Now that timing is hard to get right but it is needed if one is striving for really fast splits. That subtle difference is why I used the term pre ignition push vice flinch.
So if we want to minimize pre ignition push while still trying to shoot at speed we need to deal with the timing issues. Shooting a 22LR can help as it allows you to focus on the sights without the noise and recoil of a centerfire pistol, thus allowing you to learn more on how recoil acts on you and the gun allowing you to work out the timing better. Same thing with watching the front sight with a hard focus and focusing on calling the shot.
Another aspect going back to what I mentioned about chanting in your mind “Front sight, Front sight” is just keeping your mental focus on the sights vice the trigger or target. A target focus or trigger focus is a good way to have anticipation. Anticipation here though can be confused with flinching as it also results in poor groups as it usually also causes poor trigger control. Difference being that the shooter should be able to recognize that they were anticipating the shot and rushed into a botched round.
Hmmm very interesting, I will take out the old S&W K frame .22lr and see what happens, it's a revolver and not the same sights but if I am flinching or pushing I should be able to tell. also I think I will get a recording of me shooting close in from the side with the 9mm, and a couple duds mixed in every 50 rounds or so like everyone is suggesting. That should also help solve the problem. I really like the idea of focusing on the front sight I think that will be a game changer Thanks for all the help guys! I will report back after I hit the range.
Thanks for all the help guys! I will report back after I hit the range.
Adjustable sight will fix the temporary issue but it won't fix the root of the problem if one is flinching like me. I can test fire with laser ammo all day long and get very accurate at home in the same distance compare to the range. When it comes to live round I shot low in 9mm while no problem in my 22lr Ruger 22/45 . So what I used to do in the past was to adjust my red dot on the 9mm Glock and tune the red dot way lower when at the range. I was happy. I was plinking steel with the red dot and all seems to be doing well... but it really wasn't. I was still flinching and it was never fixed. I just got around my problem.
One day I had to fall back to the default Glock17 slide with combat sight due to the red dot issue then my problem got amplified with nothing on target and all a few inches lower. I then realize that I have to address the root of the problem instead of getting around it. So I purchased a 22lr conversion kit and bought another Glock lower and made it exactly like my 9mm Glock. Since I know I had no problem shooting 22lr I know my brain was doing something weird when I know I was shooting 9mm. By having 2 identical guns in grip, feel, trigger pull one in 9mm and one in 22lr I found that my shooting lower problem tend to go away a little while right after I switched from the 22lr conversion back to 9mm. But a bit later the problem will come back. Then I will swtich back to 22lr and repeat. After a while I slowly, painfully, start fixing my flinching. I wouldn't say it is totally fixed now but I have improved and reduced the lower amount about 50+% constantly. I ended up stop using the red dot for now and force myself to use combat sight since there is nothing to hide and will reveal my problem.
Hmmm very interesting, I will take out the old S&W K frame .22lr and see what happens, it's a revolver and not the same sights but if I am flinching or pushing I should be able to tell. also I think I will get a recording of me shooting close in from the side with the 9mm, and a couple duds mixed in every 50 rounds or so like everyone is suggesting. That should also help solve the problem. I really like the idea of focusing on the front sight I think that will be a game changer
Which range are you a member of?
If CDTSA, then just come out during a league night. There is a combined 200+years of experience walking around there and would be more than happy to help you out.
Grab a semi and a revolver if you got it. Bring a hundred rounds for each gun. Bring holsters.
Come to Sheperd location on Thursday at 5pm. (You can come later if needed but later then 6 becomes difficult)
I am a giant flapping mouth so its typically easy to spot me. Or just ask for Jordan. I will walk you through everything else
See you out there!
I will try to come around noon to get some more practice in before hand but I have an IKEA delivery scheduled for Thursday so hopefully they come early. Either way I will see you around 5
FYI no holster for the revolver. I'll see if I can make something work on my battle belt though.
Thanks and see you soon!
FYI no holster for the revolver. I'll see if I can make something work on my battle belt though.
Thanks and see you soon!
I will try to come around noon to get some more practice in before hand but I have an IKEA delivery scheduled for Thursday so hopefully they come early. Either way I will see you around 5
FYI no holster for the revolver. I'll see if I can make something work on my battle belt though.
Thanks and see you soon!
Cool
See you there.
Also, just to clarify, when I say semi I mean semi pistol. This is not like a CQB clinic.
