HK45- which version to pick?

Rock Out w/ Ur Glock Out

Rock Out w/ Ur Glock Out

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Looking to pick up an HK45 and don't know which trigger to get. I have no experience with HK's. From what I've seen there's the L.E.M model (heavy trigger, D.A.O) and I've also seen the V1 model (SA/DA, de-cocker and safety). I'm looking for a full size and would love to source and OD green one. Any suggestions on where to purchase and find these would be appreciated too. I can only find the black model.

Any opinions on which is best? I think there are other versions also but I would like some user input.

Thanks,

Rock Out
 
Rock Out w/ Ur Glock Out said:
Looking to pick up an HK45 and don't know which trigger to get. I have no experience with HK's. From what I've seen there's the L.E.M model (heavy trigger, D.A.O) and I've also seen the V1 model (SA/DA, de-cocker and safety). I'm looking for a full size and would love to source and OD green one. Any suggestions on where to purchase and find these would be appreciated too. I can only find the black model.

Any opinions on which is best? I think there are other versions also but I would like some user input.

Thanks,

Rock Out
Click to expand...
Personally, I would go with the V1, but I'm not a fan of DAO triggers in general.
 
I own and use the USP 45 with the LEM, it's a BIG improvement over the standard trigger, that said it's not for everyone. The LEM kit "pre loads" the hammer at about 90% and effectively removes that horrible HK "long take up" in the trigger, I'm a "lefty" and with it the only controls left are the slide release & the mag release. The USP is a "rock solid" performer, and the LEM only makes it better IMO.
 
Thanks guys! mildot I'm not picky on whether I have the safety or decocker but rather in having the best trigger. How heavy does the LEM feel compared to the S/A of the V1?

Also I want this specific holster- BladeTech WRS LEVEL II DUTY HOLSTER W/TAC-LIGHT for the HK45 with a Surefire300. Any ideas where to find??

Rock Out
 
I own an HK45c LEM, actually in the colour you are looking for. I think it is a great pistol and love the colour though mine is the compact model. Bought from Wanstalls. I have never fired an HK da/sa so cant comparebut the LEM system works, just takes a little practice like anything new.

Here is a post from hkpro forum about the LEM trigger. Just gives an expatiation about the LEM vs DA/SA. Sorry for he wall of text.

"In answer to the question, “What exactly is the LEM trigger?” here is a brief synopsis.
In the P2000/SK pistol, as well as an LEM USP/C or LEM HK45/C, the LEM trigger is a DAO light action trigger that has the same trigger pull weight first shot to last.
The first shot will have a long but light take-up and then will release the hammer and fire the pistol at a factory pre-set pull weight. In the standard LEM V2 version, the trigger releases the hammer at about 8 pounds of pull. In LEM V1 the pull weight is 5 pounds and LEM V4 the weight is 7 pounds. The various weights are achieved by trigger return spring and firing pin block spring changes. V3 is not an LEM trigger but is SA/DA and it functions and feels the same as the V3 trigger in the USP/C pistol.

The LEM light action system uses a two-piece hammer arrangement such that when the slide is racked or a round is chambered (by racking the slide) the lower, unseen part of the hammer is brought to full #### position and the hammer spring compressed. The hammer “spur,” or top part of the hammer, follows the slide forward and the pistol appears to be “decocked” but the pistol is still in a 90% cocked condition.
When you shoot, as you pull the trigger the hammer will come back to the full #### position. As you reach the release pull weight, the trigger will release the hammer and the pistol will fire. If you hold the trigger fully to the rear as the pistol cycles the next round, you only have to let off the trigger .3 inch to reset the trigger. At that point the same amount of trigger pull weight, except for the long take up, will fire the pistol again. You will notice that after the pistol fires the hammer will be in the full #### position if you did not release the trigger, but as you release the trigger to reset the trigger, the hammer goes forward about 1/3 the way. After reset, as you pull the trigger again the hammer comes back again to full ####. If you release the trigger all the way then the hammer will go all the way forward into the “decocked” position, but remember, the hammer spring is still fully compressed and ready to fire and will do so with a light, but long pull of the trigger. The hammer spring cannot be decompressed without pulling the trigger so if you wish to do this, there had better not be a round in the chamber!

The LEM also has repeat strike capability. If for some reason the pistol does not fire, and you wish to try to ignite the round again, you do not need to rack the slide to pre-load the hammer spring. You only need to pull the trigger again which will fully compress the hammer spring and release the hammer. However, starting from the fully uncompressed hammer spring condition the pull weight will be between 11 and 13 pounds, similar to the DA pull on the non LEM USP/C. After the round fires or you rack the slide (which pre-loads the hammer spring), you will again have the light LEM pull.


The difference between it and the standard trigger is with a V1 standard trigger, you can start from a hammer down condition where the first shot will be DA and have a 10-11 pound pull weight as you fully #### the pistol and fire it. After firing, the hammer will stay back in the full cocked position even if you release the trigger fully and all shots after that will be in a SA mode with a trigger pull of about 4-5 pounds unless you decock. The reset on the SA trigger is roughly .254 inch but if you release the trigger all the way, you have about 1/2 inch of take up before firing the pistol at the lighter SA trigger pull weight (if you release the trigger all the way on a LEM trigger you also have the long take up before you fire the pistol again).
Many do not like the transition from DA heavy first shot pull to follow up SA light trigger pull.
If you release the trigger after shooting the hammer stays fully cocked and in SA mode, so if you want to decock it you use the decocker to safely drop the hammer and release tension on the hammer spring. You cannot release tension on the hammer spring with the LEM trigger without pulling the trigger, which will fire the pistol if there is a round in the chamber. There is also no manual safety on the LEM trigger but on the USP/C and HK45/C a manual safety can be retained with the LEM trigger. No safety can be added to the LEM P2K/SK firearms. "
 
Figured since I was up would add some colour to the thread.

HK45c%20(small).jpg
 
I bought the HK .45 USP Tactical back in '06. I am not an HK geek so I can't speak about anything else...but that gun has the best trigger I have seen on a factory service gun of this type. The sights are excellent. The only gripe I have is the polygonal rifling which the manufacturer refuses to endorse for use with cast lead. (Yeah, I know - all the cool kids are running hard cast in theirs and have had zero problems...but I hear of enough KABOOMS to make me wary. I shoot expensive jacketed bullets in mine and recommend that anyone else do the same).

I still have it and can't bring myself to sell it. HK's have a way of growing on you...and sometimes I dunno if that is a good thing or not! ;)



I put that flash hider on to add weight out front and protect the threaded barrel. I would like to get a can for it just as a conversation piece and I heard someone actually makes fake ones that are actually legal in Canada...but that is something for later.
 
I don't know how the HK45 LEM feels but I had a P30L with light LEM and I didn't care for the l-o-n-g first stage. V1 (DA/SA with safety) is my preferred H&K trigger. I agree with you on the OD model--I really like mine.

xtTAxat.jpg
 
Hk45....just love it...pretty heavy da trigger...but the sa is crisp with just a little travel...I like it.
 
You have to understand that the LEM (Law Enforcement Modification) trigger was designed for extra safety for LEO. The LEO perspective on different triggers systems:

1. SAO triggers were good but had the burden of an extra safety lever that required two separate manipulations to shoot and slowed you down in critical times when your life was in danger and milliseconds make the difference between life and death.

2. DA/SA triggers tried to address that by removing the saftey and making the first DA shot heavy, there by reducing the chance of a negligent discharge. The problem is they are too heavy in DA the transition to subsequent light SA shots can again cause NDs. The pistol also needs to be decocked from SA prior to holstering. That again adds an extra control lever, requires more training and causes problems in the field... while they are decocking their gun a new threat might appear.

3. They went to DAO triggers to address the light SA pull and improve safety in high stress situation when you have to account for every shot, however most DAO triggers are too heavy for accurate shooting (just like DA mode in DA/SA) and have a very long reset so follow up shots tend to be slow.

4. This is why striker fired partially/fully precocked guns like Glock/M&P/PPQ/VP9 became very popular with LEO. They have no extra controls to fumble with for safety or decocking and they they have a long (safe) trigger pull but with a short reset for fast follow up shots.

The goal for HK with LEM was to create a light DAO trigger with a short reset to partially emulate the Glock trigger but on a hammer fired gun. They took a good look at the Para LDA system and designed something very similar but with shorter reset. The LEM advantages are:

1. Lighter initial pull then DAO or DA/SA systems
2. Short reset for quick follow up shots
3. 'Automatic decocking' when trigger is let out all the way

As you can see LEM has very similar characteristics to a striker fired guns. This is a very good system for law enforcement or for someone that carries their gun, but its still a DAO/artificially long trigger pull system at heart. For Canada where we have range queen guns I think it makes zero sense to have an LEM gun unless you compete in IPSC/IDPA type shooting and want a lighter first pull then DA/SA system. The HK45 particularly has a nice DA/SA trigger with some components from the HK Match trigger system. If you just use it as a range gun, you will have no advantage to using LEM. You will use your gun in SA mode either 100% of the time or 90% of the time if you decock the first shot (why?), and the DA/SA trigger is superior to LEM in that kind of use. With LEM you will be hunting/training for the reset point, because if you let out the trigger all the way you will have the same length (but lighter) pull as DA mode on DA/SA. With the SA mode the trigger will stay back and the SA reset and stroke length on the HK45 is shorter and superior to the standard USP/P30 series trigger.

The only downside to the DA/SA HK45 as I see it is the safety lever that you have to ride (like the 1911 that the HK45 tried to emulate/replace) or it will get in way during shooting. Unlike the P30 that has an out of the way decocker on the back, the lever on the HK45 is all-in-one for safety and decocking. That is why my favourite variant for the HK45 in Canada for range shooting is the DA/SA V4 version. It has no levers on the left and a decock only safety lever on the right side that does not get i the way of shooting for a right handed person. Some will think this is crazy but not having the need for cocked-and-locked carry in Canada this makes perfect sense to me. It will imitate the P30 out of the way decocker.
 
I have HKs in both and prefer the LEM.

Does anyone know if you can buy the full sand or green HK45 in Canada? I have seen a few where the lower is coloured but the slide is always black.
 
Give the lem a shot. I'm a big fan of learning one trigger pull, and that's exactly what you need to learn in lem.
 
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