Horrible hunting video.

I have read a variety of opinions and where i personally sound is such: The only real thing i have issue with is the laughter and on going video and not taking another shot.

This year i took a buck with my bow that ran 100yrds in the bush and fell. I tracked after 15-minutes and he was still alive and looked like he had steam left. I didnt feel it was safe to attempt to cut the throat and didn't feel another arrow was the answer. I walked out of the bush to my dads house which was a 5 minute walk and grabbed the .22 and when I returned It did make one last burst but had already expired.

Did it suffer? Yes
did i find it funny? No

I just think you need to do what you can do to end it faster and I have cut throats on lots of game not once did i enjoy it or find it funny but its part of hunting and happens.
 
bearkilr said:
Bears bawling will make most peoples' skin crawl, still does to me.......
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So there lies the issue: If we disagree on the ethics of this video as shooting sports and hunting enthusiasts - people not involved in either will think this is another opportunity to rant over bad people, using bad guns.

Bottom line - this kind of publicity none of us needs, regardless.
 
Not that anyone gives a sh!t what I am saying. But if you are going to show a video like that on youtube don't you think he could have acted with an ounce of compassion. I'm sure you have seen tones of bears die an million times worse than that.....but to share it with the world? Sadly hunters are generalized by these types of videos and as clean a kill as it may or may not have been. People see a video like this and lump all hunters into a heartless stereotype. He could have had some compassion. I take pride in the fact that tonight when I go to sleep I know I would have done everything I can to end the needless suffering of a dying animal that is 15 feet away from me.
 
Here's my take for what it's worth, I'm going to swim upstream somewhat...
Reading into the 6 pages thus far, my opinion is that most responses thus far have been fueled by emotional reaction and not so much sound reasoning.
With that said, I only watched the video once. The shot in my opinion was about as good as it gets. It was an obviously lethal hit, only discrepancy being it was a spinal. The same result would have come about had the bear ran off wailing into the woods, death came within 90 seconds. As others have said, the hunter wouldn't have had to witness the death itself if it had run off.
Now personally, I have 0 experience with muzzle loaders. By approximation, to fire again he would have had to reload and fire within 60-90 seconds. With no experience with muzzle loaders I don't know if that would be accomplishable or not. Myself, I would have started the process of reloading the instant I fired the shot. I always do, regardless of the game I'm hunting and regardless of the firearm I'm using just incase a follow up shot is required.
Personally I don't think the laugh was meant in the way some of you guys have interpreted it. I think it was a happy reaction at getting results for a successful hunt, not laughing at the animal's suffering. I know when I killed my first deer I laughed out loud too. Not at the death, but joyfully for finally getting my first deer.
I will however agree that placing the video in a public venue was not the most intellegent decision to make.
 
7.62mm said:
So you think that putting another round into the body or head of the bear would somehow sooth your soul?????

The bear was dead........it's body and mind just didn't know it yet........somehow by making its CNS system not function, you think you are more humane than any given hunter out there that just wants to feed him/herself?

The shot was good, the shooter got the spine and the lungs...the bear expired within say a minute 30 seconds..........the only gripe I have.......not really a gripe, cause not sure if I wouldn't do it myself......is the laugh, right after the shot.......otherwise a good legal and ethical kill, as far as I am concerned.
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With any luck you will suffer the same way when you go. The shot was good my ass, the shot was taken from maybe 20 ft. away and baiting animals like that is also ####.
 
interlakegrl said:
No that anyone gives a sh!t what I am saying. But if you are going to show a video like that on youtube don't you think he could have acted with an ounce of compassion. I'm sure you have seen tones of bears die an million times worse than that.....but to share it with the world? Sadly hunters are generalized by these types of videos and as clean a kill as it may or may not have been. People see a video like this and lump all hunters into a heartless stereotype. He could have had some compassion. I take pride in the fact that tonight when I go to sleep I know I would have done everything I can to end the needless suffering of a dying animal that is 15 feet away from me.
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I absolutely agree! The video is taken in real time, so he captured the moment exactly as it happened, he should have used some discretion and kept it for himself, and not posted it on the web. I too would have taken a finishing shot, or at least attempted to get the gun loaded. If the bear expired before I reloaded, then so be it. However I would not have posted the video on youtube.
 
Johnny G1 said:
With any luck you will suffer the same way when you go. The shot was good my ass, the shot was taken from maybe 20 ft. away and baiting animals like that is also s**t.
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Arguing ethics about baiting is no different than arguing ethics about gun ownership. Your ethics tell you that baiting is wrong, anti gunners ethics tell them personal gun ownership is wrong. Should one persons ethics or beliefs legislate the actions of others?
 
Weapontech said:
So there lies the issue: If we disagree on the ethics of this video as shooting sports and hunting enthusiasts - people not involved in either will think this is another opportunity to rant over bad people, using bad guns.

Bottom line - this kind of publicity none of us needs, regardless.
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There is no disagreement from me on that point of view.......


What I do have issue though, is that hunting is somehow more barbaric than penning up an animal for it's entire life, and then slaughtering it with no compunction.

Hunting....by it's very nature is violent.....but so is farming an animal for its eventual slaughter........the 2 beasts, whether having their throats cut by a hunter or a farmer, is no less violent, in the end.

The kicker is, the free ranging bear/deer/moose........lived a "FREE" life.
 
I'm on the fence on this one. Both sides of the argument have valid responses. Myself, I would have at least tried to reload my rifle and attempt a second shot. As was mentioned, how many deer have been shot, and then run over 100 yards and ended up suffering much longer than that bear did. Its just that the sound of that bear is just plain sad to hear, and with a deer, you usually hear nothing.

I think the error was putting this video on the internet for all to see. Anyone who was neutral on hunting, and has seen this video, probably will turn anti hunter, and the people who already were anti hunters and watched this video , just added to their distaste of hunting and hunters.

and baiting animals like that is also s**t.
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That's just another big can of worms you are opening
 
It will sadden anyone with a conscience to see any type of creature suffer a violent death. Everything works perfectly in theory. Only trouble is that generally reality doesn't pay much heed to theory.
I'm sure the guy posted the video because in his mind, and in his ethics play book, he did everything right and was proud of it.
What's more ethical, game animals being hunted, or farm animals slaughtered by having their throat cut then waiting to bleed out?
 
i hunted deers and small games the past 20 years on and off, i may be called a meat hunter, marksmanship and respect are ranked first in my book about ethic and behaviors toward the game himself.

i hunt with my own rules.

1-long shot allowed , i use 270 wm only, but i keep it scoped only if he's at more than 300yrs. i dont shoot if i dont have the right near perfect angle, my prefered shot is slightly neck-head junction for deers. perfect for an on/off effect on the game.

i absolutly shoot for a clean kill. i absolutly never aim the belly(for an easy primary dressing) and if i cant get a clean angle/location on my target, my first reflex is waiting mode till my time comes ......but it sometimes doesn't work accordingly with a plan, so....

2- ...if i have to track for more than hundreds feets, the first thing i'm looking for is the need or not of a back up shot immediatly (possible with deers)..(gosh i'd like to be allowed a pistol as back up). i realy dont like tracking an agonizing animal,patience, marksmanship and timing are the keys for a clean kill and less work lol..

3-i shoot to kill only, never randomly,and by this fact i accept that i may not pull the trigger on many occasions offered, caused by my own work ethics considerations as hunter wich are directly related to respect of my game (it happen 1 on 2-3).....and also that my mates(always the same buddies) might not be fans of my behavior about it in a specific scenario.

given the fact i hunt deers only, it make things easier i suppose.
 
Its the child in the video, the kid is grow up having no respect for wildlife with teachings like that. The child had the instinct to finnish the animal off, the father laughed it off. That to me is the distusting part of the video, and again that video is NOT helping anyone here. It is just fueling a fire of an anti's view of gun control,I do see Canada banning guns in our future if this chit keeps happening. For the guy who knows him, the video is still up maybe a quick phone call before the media gets a hold of it. I am sure there are anti's trolling this website and other social websites just looking for things like this video.
 
There are things that happen when hunting that should not be taped in the stess of the moment a shot is pulled and a animal is wounded the calous behaviour of the man is the most disturbing Why people post videos of this nature on U tube is beyond me. If things went wrong on my hunt or a friends you can be dam sure there won't be a tape of it
 
7.62mm said:
So what is the acceptable standard? 15 seconds.....1 second......as fast as the average person can reload......which is exactly what? What in your mind would have been acceptable?

The bear died in a short period of time.......full stop.....it was a legal hunt.......full stop.

Should this video have been posted on the internet? I am not sure....I don't think some people have a full grasp of reality when it comes to life and death, and humans feeding themselves, I certainly wouldn't have posted it personally, but I see nothing wrong in the ethics or morality in what the hunt comprised of......if it was a legal hunt, I am all good with it.
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I would say as fast as one can reload. Especially considering he could see the animal was not out, and had a muzzle loader, that leaves two options.

1) start reloading asap. If the bear dies before he's finished reloading, then he has still made the effort.
2) carry a second gun in case of events like this, or others.

7.62mm said:
I personally think, this whole issue ties in well with the whole East/West divide that we see on this forum.

Western hunters "Tend" to take longer range shots, ie 250+, and never witness what really happens when a game animal is shot through the heart and lungs. They always proclaim that the animal died in it's tracks, or only went 60 yards, they never witness the animal kicking and writhing on the ground, they always think it just dropped.........sorry to disappoint, but any body with a spinal cord has a reaction to death......it writhes and churns and claws at the ground, you just aren't there to witness it.

On the other hand, we have the Eastern hunters......who tend to shoot the game relatively close....and are witnesses to what the game animals body does in its death throws......I am not making judgment.....but any animal shot, humans included, will go through what that bear did in the video, whether you are witness to it or not.
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Hahah - you're stereotyping. Last hunt was in a shotgun only zone, and most of my areas you simply can't see further than 100 yards. Of the two deer taken, mine was dead where it was hit, my partners was down on the spot and had a second through the ear because it was still breathing when we got there.

I appreciate your arguement, however where we differ is in regards to legal versus moral.

Is it legal to do what he did? Yes

Is it moral to do what he did? In my opinion, no. Not only does it force the animal to suffer when that time could be shortened drastically, but it provides a negative image to the public at large. This is the same public that decides whether you and I hunt at all.

To put it in a different perspective, if you see a car with a flat in the middle of nowhere, do you do as morals dictate and stop to see if you can help or do you do as the law says and keep driving, because no one told you you had to.

In short, we disagree.
 
7.62mm said:
What I do have issue though, is that hunting is somehow more barbaric than penning up an animal...........
Hunting....by it's very nature is violent.....but so is farming an animal for its eventual slaughter........the 2 beasts, whether having their throats cut by a hunter or a farmer, is no less violent, in the end.
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I don't disagree; as a matter of fact, when I was younger I had the unique opportunity to work at the Hygrade abattoirs near Montreal back in the mid-80's. Quite frankly, my personal conclusion is that hunting is kindler and gentler than any modern method of putting meat on the table.

Having said that, this video (especially given the tremendous amount of negative U-Tube commentary) makes me cringe. Although many of us see nothing wrong, (and understand the realities of the sport), we remain a very small percentage; if John-Q-Public start to cry foul over it, we're toast. The spring Bear hunt in Ontario was cancelled a result of that exact knee-jerk reaction to a very wrong perception; and many of us here know the conclusion all too well.

My feeling is that the video is just bad press, regardless of what is right or wrong about it.
 
christ...how many of you wear panties? :rolleyes:

the bear died relatively quickly just like most other big game. those who are #####ing and moaning are clearly oblivious to what happens after you shoot an animal. after you have shot enough critters you pretty much get used to the fact that most animals suffer before expiring. put an arrow through the heart and lungs of a deer and it will run until it crashes into the ground (likely still alive at this point) and then thrash around until it dies.

humans view things totally different when they HEAR an animal in pain and think that a vocal animal suffers more than one who died quietly.

personally, i would have put another round into its head because i dont like to see anything suffer. but, these guys shouldnt be getting all the flaming sent their way...
 
ummm Yes I do wear panties and I don't think my choice in underwear has anything to do with if I can hunt with an ounce of compassion or not. We as hunters just don't need anymore videos stereotyping us as cruel heartless bastard. Any more than panty wearers need to be stereotypes as a pussy. And maybe there was nothing more he could have done...and the animal dies fairly quickly but keep that sh!t to your self!!!
 
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