HU: Norinco '.22 KKW Trainer' (now with pics)

[beerdog]

Well I ordered one on the 18th after reading this thread, and got it today Twas a festevus miracle.
only toke 1/2 hour or so to clean, 1st I wiped it down with shop towel hand wipes,boiled the bolt (the firing pin was slow as expected),and ran a few patch's though it and she ready to go.
The rear sight seems off to the right and the stock not a perfect fit but hey for the price you cant go wrong.

 

[marba]

norinco bolt is the same as the # 1 .

 

[Dr.Lector]

I’ll post some more things about Norinco trainers.

Long time ago, when I heard for the first time
the name KKW associated with Norinco
I was very puzzled because I knew
the Chinese prefer to re-nameeverything they copy.
But if you simply google “Norinco KKW” you’ll find out that
these guns were imported by Navy Arms in US.
I’m sure that Navy Arms ordered these guns to be marked TU-KKW.
You may also find pics like these:

There was also a short version:

In the last 2 pics, note the distance between
the receiver and the rear sight.
I scaled the last 2 pics and the barrel lenghts seem
to be about 25” iand 20.5” or something like that
which makes the short KKW about the same lenght
as our JW25.

I also believe (from what I found on the net) that
JW16 and/or JW23 were magnums.

There is also the TU-33/40, about the same lenght
as JW25, imported in US by the same Navy Arms.
One thing that suprises me is how early
some of the guns were made.
I found references about TU-KKW in US
manufactured in the mid 60’s.
However, I don’t know if they were marked as such
or when they were imported. I don’t believe US directly imported
guns from China before 1971.
Anyway, the quality of all these guns is
way better than our JW25.
Wood is much better looking and without
that crappy paint found on my JW’s.
Also the metal has better finnish.
Looking on the net you can see the popularity of the
chinese models is about the same as the real KKW.

Some people have an obsession collecting KKW’s
original or copies.
I think they need a life or a shrink (or both).

I also found that not everything marked JW was a 22.
JW2000 is a shotgun.

External hammers, double triggers.
Not my style, but it may be your thing
if you like to play “Cowboys and East Indians”.

Also, not all the JW in 22 caliber were Mauser trainers lookalikes.
This is JW 27. Her mama was ugly.

A friend allowed me to take some pics of one of his guns.
This is TU-33/40.
It’s bought used in US and imported by him about 20 years ago.
He never fired it.

Quick release scope, same lenght as JW25.
MUCH better finnish, much better looking wood.

Navy Arms’ import marks read N.A.C. RIDGEFIELD N.J.

Scope and mount are very neat and excellent finnish.
Scope is 2.75 power with 18mm front lens.
I wish they would import them today.

The reticle is a heavy, thick duplex.

 

[Mr AR15]

I want one of the scopes for my Norc. Anyone know where to get them.

I'd also like a sling for mine but Marstar is sold out of. I wonder if a full size sling would fit this gun?

 

[sscowboy]

Well I ordered mine on the 20th and it arrived on the 24th. I started the cleanup process yesterday. It's what I expected for $99. As stated before, there are a lot of sharp edges and tooling marks, the front sight is aligned way too far to the right, the rear sight doesn't line up with the barrel, and the stock has a small crack right beside the side mount for the scope. Other than the small crack, I'm pretty pleased with the stock. If it wasn't for the crack I would probably leave it, but I think i'm going to fix the crack, and refinish the stock at the same time. This gun should turn out to be the perfect winter project.

 

[MauserMike]

My K98k repro sling from Landser Outfitters is a perfect fit.

 

[skirsons]

If you want the sling to fit and pull tight, you need to shorten it and remake the holes. I ordered a yugo sling (9.99) that is used in good condition for the purpose. No use spending $40.00 on a repro.

I don't know if there are any of the longer K98 clones in Canada. All I can find at the retailers is the JW-25a. Some company in Canada, I think it was Milarm, had a JW-25 and a JW25a listed, with the JW-25 costing more. I assumed it was because the JW-25 was the longer version and I sent them an email, and received NO REPLY.

I have bought one of those Tu-33/40s off of someone on this board, with the scope and all (I think it is actually stamped TU-kkw) - all I need is for the paperwork to go through.

 

[Dr.Lector]

Before putting any kind of sling, inspect the front metal loop where the sling attaches on your gun.
Mine is so SHARP that it makes me wonder if the chinese made it like that on purpose, just to make sure it cuts your sling.

 

[Pistol Packin' Mumma]

How long are these .22's on sale at Lever Arms???? I see they are closed till Jan.2/08

 

[pontcanna]

As of December 23, Lever Arms said:

"Still lots left.

Thanks
Brett
Lever Arms"

 

[live-to-hunt]

I see a few people on here have asked about scope mounts on the trainer ,but no answers.The sacope mount that I've seen work on the .22 cause of the bolt or the rear sight is a see through mount .

 

[sscowboy]

Spent a few hours today and got mine cleaned up. Used a can of brake cleaner that I picked up and that just melted the cosmoline off. After getting into the bolt and hosing it out the firing pin seems to hit harder. I also polished up the bottom of the firing pin and it seems to be running a lot smoother. I used a vise-grip to get the front sight straightened out so it's pretty much centered now. The rear sight is still crooked.

Does anyone know how to remove the rear sight ramp? I'm thinking if I can get it off I'll be able to tell what is pushing it off to the side.

Other than that, the only other issue is a safety that is really hard to flick on and off. I think I'm going to have to do a little bit of filing to get it working well enough that it will actually be useful.

Does anyone have a set of see through rimfire rings that they could slap on the rifle with a small scope and take a picture? I'm trying to decide between trying to get a small scope to fit (4x20mm) or just going to a reddot.

 

[10x]

Spent a few hours today and got mine cleaned up. Used a can of brake cleaner that I picked up and that just melted the cosmoline off. After getting into the bolt and hosing it out the firing pin seems to hit harder. I also polished up the bottom of the firing pin and it seems to be running a lot smoother. I used a vise-grip to get the front sight straightened out so it's pretty much centered now. The rear sight is still crooked.

Does anyone know how to remove the rear sight ramp? I'm thinking if I can get it off I'll be able to tell what is pushing it off to the side.

Other than that, the only other issue is a safety that is really hard to flick on and off. I think I'm going to have to do a little bit of filing to get it working well enough that it will actually be useful.

Does anyone have a set of see through rimfire rings that they could slap on the rifle with a small scope and take a picture? I'm trying to decide between trying to get a small scope to fit (4x20mm) or just going to a reddot.

If the rear sight mount is spot welded on -
Use a dremel tool with a small cutting blade to cut the spot welds holding the sight on. Cut on the sight side, not the barrel side.
To get the rear sight out, push down on the hinge pin end of the ramp, then push the whole ramp to the rear of the gun. The leaf spring underneath pushes out to the front. This will allow you to see how the sight is mounted to the barrel

As for the safety, polish the bearing surfaces of the safety before you take a file to it. A bit of shine and taking the edge off the corners seems to make the safetys work a whole lot slicker. Take too much off with the file and you will have a safety that is dangerous.

As for brake clean, it is great stuff to remove grease, gunk, and to clean guns. Just remember to use a light layer of good oil after you clean with brake clean.

 

[marba]

I've cut three of the rear sights off three diffferent rifles and all three sights have been SPOT WELDED on the barrel. the sight has been cruedly welded on.

 

[Mr AR15]

The rear sight ramp (just the ramp, not the base) is removed by pushing it down and pulling it back.

 

[marba]

SORRY ,for not being on the ball " THE REAR SIGHT MOUNT IS WELDED ON"

 

[762shooter]

See thru rings

Does anyone have a set of see through rimfire rings that they could slap on the rifle with a small scope and take a picture? I'm trying to decide between trying to get a small scope to fit (4x20mm) or just going to a reddot.

A friend of mine did that to his. See thru rings and an old Weaver 1.5-4 scope with no objective bell. It looks good and the bolt handle clears but just clears the eyepiece.

 

[Dr.Lector]

In my opinion too, the see-thru rings are the only way to go.

After I straighten out the rear sight, it would be a pity
not to have the option of iron sights.

But I had a better look at it and I predict that
it won't be easy if I want to do it right.

 

[skirsons]

A good scope solution is to get a Mauser 98k scout kit on Gun Accessories.com or similar. These do fit the Norinco. The nut that slides into the slot where the spring was might need a little trim with the dremel, but otherwise it fits perfectly. The near identity between a Norinco rear sight and a 98k rear sight was also confirmed in fitting the handguard for my G33/40 project.

Then you just get a handgun LER scope or similar and you have a nice, ZF-41 look-a-like.

I wish I still had the pic of when I had one done up like that. I used the Yugo mount.

http:// w ww.gunaccessories.com/MilitaryScopeMounts/Mauser/index.asp

 

[sscowboy]

If the rear sight mount is spot welded on -
Use a dremel tool with a small cutting blade to cut the spot welds holding the sight on. Cut on the sight side, not the barrel side.
To get the rear sight out, push down on the hinge pin end of the ramp, then push the whole ramp to the rear of the gun. The leaf spring underneath pushes out to the front. This will allow you to see how the sight is mounted to the barrel

As for the safety, polish the bearing surfaces of the safety before you take a file to it. A bit of shine and taking the edge off the corners seems to make the safetys work a whole lot slicker. Take too much off with the file and you will have a safety that is dangerous.

As for brake clean, it is great stuff to remove grease, gunk, and to clean guns. Just remember to use a light layer of good oil after you clean with brake clean.

Thanks for all of the great info everyone.

Everything was oiled up again after I did the brake-clean thing.

I found the problem with the rear sight. It looks as though the two hinge posts on either side were cut in crooked.

What is the best way to fix this? Somehow I'm going to have to get both of the posts sitting straight across from eachother.

The safety is stiff because when it is engaged it is having to push the firing pin back about 1/4 inch further than it is already sitting.

I'm thinking with this if I file the two angles on the firing pin that click into the safety back 1/8 of an inch, the safety will only have to push the firing pin back 1/8 of an inch, instead of the 1/4" it is pushing it now.