IDPA-POCO-Members [UPDATED-PROPOSAL TURNED DOWN FOR 3RD YEAR IN A ROW. SEE POST#285]

Would you be interested if there was IDPA at Poco Club?

  • Yes, I would like to see IDPA at Poco Club

    Votes: 106 74.6%

  • No, just drive to Chilliwack for your IDPA fix

    Votes: 36 25.4%
  • Total voters
    142
OK guys, when I started this Poll it was in response to a question I asked at the range the other day...why does Poco range not have IDPA? Nobody there could give me a straight answer, but the two guys I talked to seemed mighty interested as well. I'm not going into the whys and wherefores, but heck, we all just want to have IDPA at our range.

I too looked at the calendar and found that there are more than enough days for another shooting discipline to be had. So why not?

Fast forward to today. I find out that:
  1. Written presentations had been made for 2 years in a row.
  2. Reason given was the IDPA does not want to follow club rules. What rules might those be, nobody seems to know.
  3. Reason given, "IDPA wants to start a club within a club" and "something happened the last time, so the club can't take the chance." No details offered for discussion/debate.
  4. BB course is $200. IDPA safety course is $50.

So all in, I find it strange, personally, that the club refused the IDPA people starting a committee there. As a member, I'd love to find out why we are not be promoting another internationally-sanctioned shooting sport.

Looking forward to 2011, I sure hope we can get something going there.
 
Rottboy_8 said:
With the support of Canuck44, the IDPA affiliation proposal has been formally presented to the POCO Board for the past two years. Each time, there seems to be resistance of one sort or another. Thankfully, some members of the Poco board are allowing me to make another presentation for the EC meeting on March 8th.
If all those POCO members can spread the word and PM me your names, I will start a petition to present at that time. Its been a long road and lets hope we can reach the destination in 2011.
Will keep all posted on developements.
In the meantime, some of us Poco members continue to support IDPA out of the Chilliwack Club. As Katana infers, propogating additional activities for any club benefits all members.
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I'm in. PM on the way.
 
HUGODOG said:
... ask a few questions with regards to why, in the past two years, the request to include IDPA at Poco failed.
1. Would IDPA at Poco be part of IPSC - answer. .......
This was the reason why IDPA failed to get accepted in 2009. Some members of the Poco board insisted that IDPA be a sub-committe within the club's IPSC umbrella. This was unacceptable. There are countless clubs that are affiliated with both these disciplines and co-exist with no problems. I'm sure I will be able to get that same atmosphere at Poco in the future (lets hope its sooner than later)

2. Following along that trend of thought - who would run IDPA in Poco?
In the formal letters to the Board, I mentioned to them that any member of an IDPA committee would have to be current IDPA members. To run the matches, I personally, would prefer them to likewise be IDPA SO rated. For logistics, we are prepared, as there are 3 IDPA SO rated POCO members. In addition I know of 3 additional IDPA members (again already Poco members). Members from Chilliwack club who are IDPA SO rated are more than willing it initially assist running matches (will pay the day pass). Also have more than half of the Range Officers who have indicated their support to run events.

3. Who is saying no to IDPA in Poco and who is voting no in this forum.
As Canadians living in a free society, everyone has the option to chose as they want. Instead of asking why/who supports no, lets create an atmosphere to share ideas and convince them why an additional club activity would benefit, the club, all its members and further enhance the attractiveness for others to acquire club membership.

...........Otherwise Rottboy's March 8th effort would be wasted.
With the support for club members and CGN'rs in general, my efforts to succeed will not be for naught.
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REPLY in BOLD. Thanks man!!!!
 
OEM said:
OK guys, when I started this Poll it was in response to a question I asked at the range the other day...why does Poco range not have IDPA? Nobody there could give me a straight answer, but the two guys I talked to seemed mighty interested as well. I'm not going into the whys and wherefores, but heck, we all just want to have IDPA at our range.

I too looked at the calendar and found that there are more than enough days for another shooting discipline to be had. So why not?

Fast forward to today. I find out that:
  1. Written presentations had been made for 2 years in a row.
  2. Reason given was the IDPA does not want to follow club rules. What rules might those be, nobody seems to know.
  3. Reason given, "IDPA wants to start a club within a club" and "something happened the last time, so the club can't take the chance." No details offered for discussion/debate.
  4. BB course is $200. IDPA safety course is $50.

So all in, I find it strange, personally, that the club refused the IDPA people starting a committee there. As a member, I'd love to find out why we are not be promoting another internationally-sanctioned shooting sport.

Looking forward to 2011, I sure hope we can get something going there.
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Make these two bold issues a bit more clear. IDPA has nothing to do with the club rules. As is taught in the IDPA SO course, all IDPA SO's MUST abide buy each individual clubs rules, you work your match and COF around the clubs rules.

On the fee. IDPA charges no fee for any course, any fee charged for an NOS or SO course would be implemented by the hosting club not IDPA.
 
And let's clear this up again, Black Badge $200ish includes first year of membership in IPSC. So IDPA safety course is actually the $50 plus you have to get your membership in IDPA, which is $60. So a $100 difference. Why the difference, because IPSC instructors have decided to get paid for their two days of instruction. IDPA guys do it for free.
I do think the BB could be changed a fair bit, and one day could be enough. But the powers that be say 2 days, so 2 it is. But even with 2 days we still see people that don't learn enough. So maybe 3 would be better? Lol.
I don't think the fee structure is a reason for the BOD at POCO to not let IDPA in. The fee structure is more of a reason for some to choose one over the other on an individual basis.
 
Slavex said:
And let's clear this up again, Black Badge $200ish includes first year of membership in IPSC. So IDPA safety course is actually the $50 plus you have to get your membership in IDPA, which is $60. So a $100 difference. Why the difference, because IPSC instructors have decided to get paid for their two days of instruction. IDPA guys do it for free.
I do think the BB could be changed a fair bit, and one day could be enough. But the powers that be say 2 days, so 2 it is. But even with 2 days we still see people that don't learn enough. So maybe 3 would be better? Lol.
I don't think the fee structure is a reason for the BOD at POCO to not let IDPA in. The fee structure is more of a reason for some to choose one over the other on an individual basis.
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I don't charge anything for the course, only the cost of materials. Who's making the money? Not me. Not ever. In fact, it costs me money to give a course and I don't mind giving back to the sport.
 
RePete said:
........don't charge anything for the course, only the cost of materials...........
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Its the same case in IDPA. At Chilliwack Club for example there is a Safety/Holster course which I hope to integrate into a Poco Club course. Therefore cost for the shooter would be:
CND$140 / Yearly Poco membership (funds go to Poco Club)
US$60/ Yearly IDPA membership (funds go directly to IDPA Head Office, Arizona)
CND$50/ one time integrated club Safety/Holster course (these funds go directly to the administrator of the course for material and time - pls. note that I personally, am not certified to conduct a S/H course)
 
$60 US a year for your IDPA membership yes, but again $50 for the course is a club thing, IDPA does not have any fee's for NSO or SO courses. Like RePete, I charge nothing to administer the NSO and/or the SO courses. Any fees charged are the clubs business. Any fees IDPA Instructors may get should be to cover expenses only, food, travel and lodging if necessary, that's it.
 
Reading everything in this thread starting 2nd Feb till today 22 Feb. I get the impression that most of the people who take the trouble to express their opinion are in favour of IDPA at Poco. I would like to hear from some of those who voted "no" IDPA at Poco. At least we can have a constructive dialogue going so that Poco will be a much more fun place to enjoy your hobby. So that IDPA is in addition to IPSC and not instead of. I shot IPSC for years and enjoyed it immensely. I chose IDPA because it present another facet to the shooting sport. Why not make it available to the members so that they can choose.
 
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HUGODOG said:
Reading everything in this thread starting 2nd Feb till today 22 Feb. I get the impression that most of the people who take the trouble to express their opinion are in favour of IDPA at Poco. I would like to hear from some of those who voted "no" IDPA at Poca. At least we can have a constructive dialogue going so that Poco will be a much more fun place to enjoy your hobby. So that IDPA is in addition to IPSC and not instead of. I shot IPSC for years and enjoyed it immensely. I chose IDPA because it present another facit to the shooting sport. Why not make it available to the members so that they can choose.
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Good point. It is clear from the Yes:No ratio of 3.4:1 (as of this writing 51:15) that the overwhelming majority of poll voters want IDPA. It would be unreasonable for POCO not to open the club to IDPA.

It would be interesting to know who voted YES and NO. In some forums, it is possible to see this info.

Yeah, let's hear from the POCO IDPA detractors. Why don't you want IDPA in POCO? Speak up so we can hear your side.
 
I don't have any stock in this, but, effective change at any club arises only by those members who show up to vote. Those members that want IDPA at a club, put forward a motion at a meeting, and have a vote on it. It seems pretty straight forward to me!

If you have to convince others to vote with you, do so in a respectful manner. Maybe have a video presentation to the board with video's of recent IDPA events elsewhere. Just some thoughts!
 
7.62mm said:
.....do so in a respectful manner....video presentation to the board with video's of recent IDPA events elsewhere. Just some thoughts!
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Have done one better than that. Put up a couple of sample stages for the Board Members to see how its run!!!!! Thats been offered in 2009 and 2010 presentations. BTW, its all been done in a respectful manner. There's no other way than to co-exist and coordinate with all club board members and regular members alike!!! Great suggestion and will continue to work with that mind-set.
 
couple things, not a chance I'd ever even join Poco so no option to be on the board. Next while your poll options show a lot of people like the idea of IDPA at Poco, it's a poll open to all members of CGN, most of whom are not members at Poco. I doubt we have more than 100 members from Poco here on CGN. What counts is members you'd get at a meeting who can bring this to the board. You need to convince your board that this is in the best interest of the club. which can be hard to do. Failing that, you need to elect a BOD of who supports this idea, which means you need people willing to take on duties as board members, and the support of voters at the AGM. This can take years to achieve depending on how BOD rules are setup.
 
Slavex said:
couple things, ...... What counts is members you'd get at a meeting who can bring this to the board. You need to convince your board........This can take years to achieve depending on how BOD rules are setup.
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As with any organization the acceptance of any change is not an easy task. Its been 2 years with the current efforts and it may take years more. With threads like this, valued opinions are all welcome. To change a political envirionment (such as the board) for the sole purpose of getting a new discipline activity into the club is beyond my available time and moreso, defeats the purpose of IDPA affiliation.
Just because its hard doesn't mean it impossible and, your totally correct, as support is what counts. Will keep on truckin to achieve our goal of introducing an "additional" activity for the benefit of all Poco club members.
 
One of the clubs that I used to belong to had great shooters and represented the country in Olympic shooting events and regional competitions. Naturally the recognized shooters were voted in as BOD. As years go by, the shooters got older and slower. Eyes faded, physically aging, which is natural but they hung onto the power of the BOD and never wanted to teach or make available the shooting sport to younger members.

Is this happening at Poco where the BOD is unwilling to accept another discipline i.e. IDPA because it might dilute their "power" at Poco? Hence the fear of IDPA forming a club within a club argument?

IDPA as a shooting discipline is closer to Jeff Cooper's original concept of combat shooting, where the shooter carries concealed production weapon and reacts to external threats where cover is an important factor. I personally think that the El Presidente excercise should be done with firearms concealed under garments.

However having said that, IPSC is a lot of fun too when one can hose away at targets without worry of cover, tactical sequence or tactical reloads. Safety issues are the same with both disciplines, its just what gives you more fun. Why not shoot both disciplines. That's what I will do if both are available at Poco.
 
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