Larue's new lowers

Even if they are out sourced I highly doubt Mark Larue would have his name put on something he felt was not up to snuff.
 
More vapourware unless it actually makes it into Canada. LaRue (and many other manufacturers) has never shown any interest in selling to us up here in Canada, no reason to get all gaga about this or any other product until they do.
 
Bartledan said:
Sigh. Forging makes a stronger, tougher final product than billet machining.

It was the mountain bike weenies who convinced the world billet was somehow better. It's not. It's easier for small shops to get into, that's it. Lower cost of entry != better product. Considering whole beaches are black with AR lower forgings down south, this is a novelty item.
Click to expand...

Agreed! but then they have an execuse to jack the price up by 150 bucks.

Look at the way Vltor cut their receivers - they can probably cut those receivers as far as forgings.
 
mebiuspower said:
No interest? Have you actually spoke to any of their guys? :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Yes, I have. Spoken repeatedly to Mark (LaRue) directly at SHOT every year for the past several years and he has consistently stated outright that he does not have an interest in selling to Canada or taking an order for export to Canada even if we did all of the export paperwork, permits, etc..

His explanation was that he was working now at full capacity and could still barely fill his domestic orders and commitments... he said that to take an order from me would be a waste of time as he wouldn't be able to deliver and would end up just postponing the estimated delivery dates as "export" sales were not a priority.

I am NOT the only dealer/exporter that he said these things to.

Mark may say one thing in public (on various Forums) but he says very different things in private... myself and others have heard and seen this first hand for ourselves.

If Mark truly wanted to have his products being properly exported and sold in Canada they would already be here... the fact that they are here in dribs and drabs (usually indirectly and often through "grey" or "black" channels) speaks for itself.

Actions speak louder than words.

Mark
 
Armedsask said:
With billet you get a more consistent product. Forging and casting can lead to problems with porosity (air pockets), incomplete molds, errors in the mold, etc.

The big upside to billet is the more consistent internal structure of the metal, and cheaper start up as mentioned.
Click to expand...

All the problems you mention above are purely those of cast products. For a forging, you could mention warping during the aging process (anyone reading this who doesn't understand the link between the word "aging" and aluminum forming/manufacturing should go outside and play catch or something) due to uneven internal stresses. That's why a stress relieving heat treatment is specified.

How exactly do you think billet is made? It's cast and forged.... the forging process being "extrusion", in most aluminum.

Billet machined parts are not more consistent or better than forged and machined parts. Period.

Indeed, billet machined parts have crystal structure orientations that match the initial forming process direction for the billet. Forged parts have crystal orientations that match the geometry of the finished parts, thereby reducing the availability of slip planes for plastic deformation.

Casting has an absurdly low cost of entry, too. Send a CAD model to an investment caster, and wait for the truck to show up. Minimal finish machining, and you're done.

In terms of tooling cost, from highest to lowest, assuming that the casting will be jobbed:

Forging (10)
Billet machining (4)
Investment Casting (0)

In terms of material waste, which in high volume manufacturing becomes a greater cost than tooling, from most waste to least waste:

Billet machining (10)
Forging (3)
Investment casting (1)

In terms of mechanical performance of the final part, best to worst:

Forging (10)
Billet machining (6-8)
Casting (5-6)

So, rifles... specifically military rifles, are high volume items for which maximum performance is required, generally irrespective of cost. This solidly suggests forging. In fact, billet machining has all but vanished from serious (read: non-hobbyist) firearms manufacturing. Investment casting is MUCH more popular. It provides a quite high quality finished product with minimal material waste and overall high quality.

Billet machined parts look like RaceFace brake levers, so people think they are *awesome*. Style over substance. It's especially cool when they are anodized purple.

Investment casting can also build parts which are actually impossible using any other process. It's CRAZY what some of the parts come out looking like.

At SHOT last winter, I met the dudes from Montreal who investment cast for basically everyone in North America. They make those silly alloy Glock frames, f'rinstance. (they are not the designers of said silly glock frames, just the jobbers.)

Why do I write these damned dissertations? Is my life so boring?
 
greentips said:
Agreed! but then they have an execuse to jack the price up by 150 bucks.

Look at the way Vltor cut their receivers - they can probably cut those receivers as far as forgings.
Click to expand...

We need to get into this game, hey? You know what would let us crank up prices for a dubious or non-existent increase in performance?

More Cowbell!

cowbell.gif
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom