Leupold clone arrived and NFG

Gatehouse said:
I'm not trying to be nasty, I have never laid eyes on a clone...
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Oh, yes you have;).... I used one at Haggisfest in the hunting rifle shoot... or maybe you didn't take a close look.

It was on the Tikka to see if it can handle the .308.... (still haven't decided what I am going to put on the Tikka permanently), later the clone will go onto the CZ rimfire.

The only issue I have with it so far, is that the magnification ring is difficult to turn.
 
popcan said:
Oh, yes you have;).... I used one at Haggisfest in the hunting rifle shoot... or maybe you didn't take a close look.

It was on the Tikka to see if it can handle the .308.... (still haven't decided what I am going to put on the Tikka permanently), later the clone will go onto the CZ rimfire.

The only issue I have with it so far, is that the magnification ring is difficult to turn.
Click to expand...

No wonder I felt dirty after handling that rifle...:p
 
The seller was as good as his word. He supplied me with an address in Markham, Ontario to return the scope to and he is sending a replacement from Hong Kong.

It appears that the Zinde Optical Company in mainland China manufactures the Leupold clones but I can't be for certain.

I remember as a kid in Toronto in the mid to late 50's when Japan started exporting cheap junk to Canada. Most of what they exported were copies of goods manufactured in the USA or Canada and pure c**p. I put myself thru University working summers at Taylor Instruments in Toronto and they had an indoor-outdoor thermometer that showed a very small flaw in the plastic case on the back in one of the corners. Nothing that would stop you from buying the thermometer.

The Japanese came out with an identical copy at 1/3 the price that, believe it or not, showed the same flaw in the case.....obviously they made a mould of the original.

That Japanese junk disappeared by the early 60's and now look at what they are exporting, Toyota, Canon, Panasonic, Toshiba, etc, etc, etc. First class quality.

China has the potential to also produce first class quality products. Those optical companies just need a push in the right direction and I can almost guarantee you they have the ability and will some time in the not too distant future produce a Leupold look a like that will be as good as an original and 1/2 the price.

I'm looking forward to receiving the replacement to attach it to the Saavge .243 and take it out to the range....hopefully I will have a better report.






bushpilotmexico said:
Well I guess it's not the first $100 CAD that I have thrown away and it won't be the last.

My Leupy clone arrived from Hong Kong on Tuesday. I removed my Elite 3200 10 x 40mm from my Savage 12BVSS and installed the clone.

When it arrived I got all excited, exterior finish was excellent, optics reasonably clear and sharp.

I bore sighted it at 25 yards and got out to the range this morning at 5:00 am conditions were clear with a slight north wind.

My first shot was low 3 inches and to the left 3 inches......I adjusted the scope accordingly and fired another sighter shot. Now I was high 2 inches and right 4 inches. I adjusted accordingly and my shot didn't even hit the target.

I removed the bolt and bore sighted again. The crosshairs were 2 FEET low and 1 1/2 FEET to the left. I readjusted the scope and fired another sighter. This one landed high and to the right. I readjusted the scope and this shot was off the paper again.

SO my advice to all my fellow CGN'ers is to preceed with caution if you are considering buying one. I'm going to contact the seller and from all reports I am sure he will tell me to ship it back to Toronto and he'll send another one BUT I don't think you'll ever be able to depend on it.

It sounded too good to be true but in all honesty China would be better off making a quality scope at say 50% less thasn a comparable Leupold and looking for customer satisfaction.
Click to expand...
 
Sorry, 0.7" from top of the elavation drum to the bottom?

I was looking for total usable MOA in the range of elevation adjustment, sorry if I wasn't clear.
 
As to China producing top drawer optics, they already do and do so for some most prominent names in the optics world.

In fact, so does the Phillipines....and Romania.

The Ebay stuff is there for a reason. price and volume. They supply the wannabe or someone looking for a less expensive item. What I will say is that for the money, the product is very good, by all the positive accounts on this and other boards.

The product does have its lemons, so does Zeiss/Luppy, but compared to the horrid stuff at this price point offered through normal retail outlets, it is a deal.

No different then the Elite 3200 10X. For under $200US delivered, the amount of flak this scope received when it first came out from US shooters was staggering. How could a scope this cheap be considered a TACTICAL scope? How much complaining is there now?

I am not saying that the lowest priced products from overseas are going to beat higher priced point items. However, the costs of manf and margins are changing what a good product should/could cost.

Many scope brands charge an enormous premium for their name. This has opened the door for many companies to make equal if not better products and offer them at a better prices. This is quickly eroding market share and changing how the big names price and make their products.

How much of the Luppy product line is actually manf in the US and not China/off shore? Where is ALL the Luppy glass manf? Might surprise you...

Since the US forces are now on an optics buying spree, keep an eye out in 2007/8 for all the new gear. I bet there will be many better product for less money then the present gold ring crowd.

Jerry
 
mysticplayer said:
How much of the Luppy product line is actually manf in the US and not China/off shore? Where is ALL the Luppy glass manf? Might surprise you...



Jerry
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My understaidg is that Leupold uses Japanese glass.

I would imagine that thier parts are sourced fomr all over, and then simply assembled in the US, making it "Made int he USA":)
 
luepold clones rule....

424966-big.JPG
 
GH, there are only a few companies in the world that make glass for scopes. Mostly Japanese and Euro firms. However, the location of the factory today is pretty much in China.

These main companies also subcontract to 100% Chinese/offshore companies.

So 'Chinese' glass ranges from the Cheapie TASCO/Simmons special to Nightforce/Luppy. Will be interesting to see what happens to Nightforce now that the supplying company is closing down.

There is a very large chance that most every lense in a Luppy originated from China or another Asian country outside Japan. Most certainly all their lower grades scopes are.

In fact, many of these are also assembled overseas. Check the product for where they are classed as being manf. All their wind river stuff for sure and might include their Rifleman, VX1 and II (????).

To maintain the 'made in the USA' label, Luppy will assemble just enough in Oregon to satisfy customs and the men in uniform.

The world of optics is very small and getting smaller.

Jerry
 
BR, ALL covers a lot of their product line. Mk4, LRS, VXIII sure. Wind River, Rifleman, VXI - ????????

Here is a link to a 'new' very large American-Chinese joint venture factory. Wonder which US investors this includes?????

800,000 scopes is a lot.....

http://zos.en.alibaba.com/

Although a bit dated, you might like to read my new post I found while looking for different scope manf.

Text is from one Gale McMillan. Might know a thing or two about the gun business....

Jerry
 
I received my replacement scope from Hong Kong as promised. Thankfully I was able to send the original back to Markham, Ontario.

I shot the box test with it and it performed well. We calculated the clicks appear to be 1/3 MoA rather than 1/4

Exterior finish excellent and optics satisfactory.





bushpilotmexico said:
Well I guess it's not the first $100 CAD that I have thrown away and it won't be the last.

My Leupy clone arrived from Hong Kong on Tuesday. I removed my Elite 3200 10 x 40mm from my Savage 12BVSS and installed the clone.

When it arrived I got all excited, exterior finish was excellent, optics reasonably clear and sharp.

I bore sighted it at 25 yards and got out to the range this morning at 5:00 am conditions were clear with a slight north wind.

My first shot was low 3 inches and to the left 3 inches......I adjusted the scope accordingly and fired another sighter shot. Now I was high 2 inches and right 4 inches. I adjusted accordingly and my shot didn't even hit the target.

I removed the bolt and bore sighted again. The crosshairs were 2 FEET low and 1 1/2 FEET to the left. I readjusted the scope and fired another sighter. This one landed high and to the right. I readjusted the scope and this shot was off the paper again.

SO my advice to all my fellow CGN'ers is to preceed with caution if you are considering buying one. I'm going to contact the seller and from all reports I am sure he will tell me to ship it back to Toronto and he'll send another one BUT I don't think you'll ever be able to depend on it.

It sounded too good to be true but in all honesty China would be better off making a quality scope at say 50% less thasn a comparable Leupold and looking for customer satisfaction.
Click to expand...
 
mysticplayer said:
BR, ALL covers a lot of their product line. Mk4, LRS, VXIII sure. Wind River, Rifleman, VXI - ????????

Here is a link to a 'new' very large American-Chinese joint venture factory. Wonder which US investors this includes?????

800,000 scopes is a lot.....

http://zos.en.alibaba.com/

Although a bit dated, you might like to read my new post I found while looking for different scope manf.

Text is from one Gale McMillan. Might know a thing or two about the gun business....

Jerry
Click to expand...

Seriously though Jerry, do you have proof, at all, that any piece of a Leupold or Nightforce is manufactured in China?
 
The low end Luppies/wind rivers are already advertised as off shore sourced. It should also be on the products themselves. Unfortunately, US import laws allows any company to claim domestic origin if enough parts are manf or assembled in the US.

We know that none of the lenses are made in the US. Luppy has imported their lenses ever since they started. Most of the higher end products are sourced from Japan just like Bushnell Elite and some top Euro brands and Nightforce. There is only one big guy left and that is Light Optical. At least from the last info I read.

Hakko is no more - makers of many named brands and products like the Super Sniper. I think they made the Nightforce as well (?).

For some brands, the assembly is in Japan but where are the actual parts produced? Read that little link to Gale McMillan and his experiences in the scope world.

Why you can have a domestic Honda/Toyota and an imported Caddy.

Look at older Luppy catalogs from 2000 or when the Wind River first came out. Said that it was offshored sourced to be price competitive, yada, yada, yada. Rifleman and VX line falls in the same category.

Might not even be China. could also be the Phillipines as it seems that is where many Nikon products are made. Lots of luppy and nightforce products being marketed from Indonesia sources/dealers of all places. Is there a factory there we don't know about? a smuggling ring?

Visit alibaba b2b web site. There are links to a ton of central and east asian companies that make just about everything we consume.

It really doesn't matter what the country of origin is anymore. The newest factories are being built in these developing countries and training will bring anyone on par. With proper QC, the product is no different except the price point offered.

If you get a chance to play with a new Nikon Buckmaster, it will impress you with the quality and optical clarity/low light performance/mechanicals. Feels like a high dollar product. Made in the Phillipines.

I expect to see new 'brands' being offered to compete in the NA market soon which will have equal quality at a much reduced price. Even the Bushnell Elite 4200 are getting up there in price. But are awesome scopes and valued well compared to scopes of similar optical quality.

The market is ripe for a new mid price/too quality player.

Jerry
 
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