Lost hunters use moose hide to keep warm

lilsurfer said:
Well said...survival tip #1: drink your pee.
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#2, take some Kool-aid powder to mix in it.:p

Ardent said:
Going by your avatar I presume you have some familiarity with aviation, same issue there. Even pilots with thousands of hours and decades in the air have ignored indications from instruments because they didn't line up with what they perceived was happening, ultimately crashing. Always trust your instruments for sure, be it in the cockpit, or a simple handheld compass, even if they don't make sense.
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Just don't hold the compass too close to your rifle.;)
 
marcham said:
Search and rescue crews are NOT sent when you press the SOS button on the SPOT. The notification goes to a call centre (SPOT's emergency response centre). This centre has no SAR crews at their disposal nor any legal liability to act. They have to figure out who is the closest agency to call that can help you and then relay what they've received. Normally, SAR crews won't react immediately to a SPOT beacon, they'll try and use the contact phone numbers provided with your registration and attempt to determine if this is real emergency or accidental activation.
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A delay of 10 minutes won't cost you your life.

Want to show your family where you are? get a spot.

Want to get rescued when you are in a life and death emergency? get a PLB.
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Rather harsh. I've been a part of several SARs where the subjects were located because they had a SPOT. The SPOT continues to send updated location information when you use the SOS function, hence why we were able to depart Ulukhaktok by helicopter, fly to the last co-ordinates, land on the ice and pick up the stranded hunters with almost boring ease. There was no "Search", just fly to Point A, Land and Rescue. If only they were all so easy.

SPOT and EPIRB/PLB have different functionalities. To my knowledge there is no EPIRB available that allows you to "Check In" or send for non-urgent help. SPOT does this which comes in handy when you knock a moose down in a bad spot.

Now, the SPOT doesn't use the 406 MHz system rather it uses the Globalstar satellite network. Less reliable than the 406MHz system but in most places you won't notice the difference. I have had problems with a Globalstar sat phone while in the North (Tsiigehtchic, NT) but I've seen the SPOT work further North than that so for the average person I can't imagine there being a problem for most people in the outdoor areas that they frequent.

As to cost, I'm not sure what registration costs are for an EPIRB, but I can't imagine it's free. SPOT costs too and if you're only out occasionally it feels pretty pricey. That said, when you need help it's a good feeling to have the means to summon it and you won't care about the cost when you're in the poop.

I think we can all agree that you should have some means of contacting help when you're out in the bush. For a lot of people in the South a cell phone and GPS will suffice. For others a SPOT or PLB will be better. Some guys will even go so far as to get a sat phone and a GPS or combinations of any (or all) of the above. Whatever option you choose, make sure that you have it with you. They're useless when left at home!
 
BigUglyMan said:
As to cost, I'm not sure what registration costs are for an EPIRB, but I can't imagine it's cheap. SPOT costs too and if you're only out occasionally it feels pretty pricey. That said, when you need help it's a good feeling to have the means to summon it.
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There is NO COST to register a PLB / EPIRB / ELT. $225 at MEC and you're good for 5-6 years.

http://www.canadianbeaconregistry.forces.gc.ca/

You can even submit a comment when you register your PLB, which can be changed anytime for free. You can put in some info on your trip details, emergency next of kin contact, medical conditions, etc...

For a lot of people in the South a cell phone and GPS will suffice. For others a SPOT or PLB will be better.
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Absolutely. But consider where you are going to be. Most of BC doesn't have cell coverage.

Whatever option you choose, make sure that you have it with you. They're useless when left at home!
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Well said!


Especially in the North, PLB is preferred. Last I checked, SPOT uses Globalstar satellite system. Ever tried to place a call with globalstar in the fringe of their coverage area? You have to use a program to predict when you will have satellite coverage. I tried flying up North with a SPOT and was shocked at the low number of position reports that actually made it to the system.

Granted, there has been a great number of rescues using SPOT beacons, because there are a great number of them out there. Once they hit sub $200 they started selling like hot cakes. There are fewer PLBs because until 3 years ago, they cost in excess of $500. Now with sub $300 GPS position encoded PLB and no additional cost, they make more sense for most people. They are certified to perform at -20 deg C for at least 24 hours, can't say the same for a SPOT.
 
marcham said:
There is NO COST to register a PLB / EPIRB / ELT. $225 at MEC and you're good for 5-6 years.

http://www.canadianbeaconregistry.forces.gc.ca/

You can even submit a comment when you register your PLB, which can be changed anytime for free. You can put in some info on your trip details, emergency next of kin contact, medical conditions, etc...



Absolutely. But consider where you are going to be. Most of BC doesn't have cell coverage.




Well said!


Especially in the North, PLB is preferred. Last I checked, SPOT uses Globalstar satellite system. Ever tried to place a call with globalstar in the fringe of their coverage area? You have to use a program to predict when you will have satellite coverage. I tried flying up North with a SPOT and was shocked at the low number of position reports that actually made it to the system.

Granted, there has been a great number of rescues using SPOT beacons, because there are a great number of them out there. Once they hit sub $200 they started selling like hot cakes. There are fewer PLBs because until 3 years ago, they cost in excess of $500. Now with sub $300 GPS position encoded PLB and no additional cost, they make more sense for most people. They are certified to perform at -20 deg C for at least 24 hours, can't say the same for a SPOT.
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Anywhere I have used my SPOT it was worked....it is also cheap insurance when travelling down a highway with no cell coverage....

IN a PURE emergency the PLB may be the better choice but SPOT has never failed me....

As someone here said..."...it works good when you knock a Moose down and need help from friends....."....

Your NOT going to activate a PLB and get search&rescue to come help you haul a Moose out of the bush are you???


Coincidentally I have USED the SPOT for that VERY purpose....my buddy showed up an hour later right an the exact spot I called from...TYVM!!!!


GET FRIGGIN REAL!!!!
 
Gatehouse nailed it. That's my kind of planning. I remember an old tale of two Indian( I use the term with all respect, I can't stand 1st nation, native or aboriginal labels) hunters rolling up in a moose hide and it freezing. Wolves circled them all night. Never heard the outcome so it was probably an combo of Hudson's Bay Rum and my old man's bull s----. Do any oldtimer's remember HBC Rum in the solid white glass bottle? I do... dad used to mix it with Carnation milk for me in the old camp.

regards, Darryl
 
marcham said:
Except that a SPOT / PLB uses satellites for communication.

What the folks at SPOT don't tell you is that satellite coverage can be, well, spotty. If you are in a canyon, or on the side of a tall mountain, your distress signal may never get out. With PLBs on the other hand, the SARSAT system uses a combination of geostationary and low earth orbitting satellites to pick-up distress signals. And since you only use PLBs in distress, you know the batteries will last at least 24 hrs when you activate it. GSAR (ground search and rescue) / coast guard and SAR aircraft crews can also follow a homing beacon right to your PLB, no such device exists for the SPOT.

The cost of ownership of a PLB is much less than the SPOT beacon, once you factor in the monthly subscription. They are now $225 at MEC.

Search and rescue crews are NOT sent when you press the SOS button on the SPOT. The notification goes to a call centre (SPOT's emergency response centre). This centre has no SAR crews at their disposal nor any legal liability to act. They have to figure out who is the closest agency to call that can help you and then relay what they've received. Normally, SAR crews won't react immediately to a SPOT beacon, they'll try and use the contact phone numbers provided with your registration and attempt to determine if this is real emergency or accidental activation.

PLB / ELT / EPIRB signals on the other hand are received by RCC (rescue coordination centres) manned by Air Force / Coast Guard personnel who have SAR ressources at their disposal 24/7. Even if you activate a PLB outside of the US/Canada, the local country agency will be the lead, but your country of registration for the PLB will be involved and ensure an adequate level of oversight to ensure a rescue is launched.

Want to show your family where you are? get a spot.

Want to get rescued when you are in a life and death emergency? get a PLB.
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5 seconds of research easily disproves what you say. The coverage is excellent, and to date, SPOT has saved dozens of lives, worldwide. The added bonuses are that you can use it to mark GPS locations, inform your family you are okay, and if need be, call in a rescue. SPOT dispatches emergency messages via a processing centre directly to emergency services. Not much better than a beacon...

For the cost, it can't be beat.
 
BigUglyMan said:
Yup. Their crappy covereage probably saved my career!:D
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The SPOT service is a simplex data application. It does not rely on duplex service which has been spotty, due to failing S-band antenna's on the 1st generation satellites. There are no issues using the SPOT unit as there have been using duplex (2 way) applications. Globalstar is in the midst of launching a new constellation of birds, better hardened and improved. 2 more launches, and full coverage for duplex applications will be restored.

The L-Band (and C) antennas are fine on the first gen birds, which allow the carrying of simplex data via the SPOT units to the GWA systems located in the GSAT gateways around the world.
 
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