Mccabee or WK180?
- Thread starter guess_kto
- Start date
Each to there own. If they are a quality product then they will be available for years to come. I don't mind waiting to make sure there are no QC issues with initial runs. Or parts failures with high round count guns.
Wrong again.
Lungorthin
Regular
- Location
- Calgary, AB
I'm ordering the SLR. Handled one at CSC shortly after preordering and I'm glad I made the decision to jump on the wagon
To compare these two rifles is a little, well let's just say it's
They are two totally different products that fill two totally different markets. To try and say that 1 will take away from the other is once again
I pre-ordered the WK180-C but would never even think about canceling my MacDef order because of it.
I see the WK180-C as filling the role of "cheap POS budget utility rifle" and serving no other purpose than to throw it in the truck or tractor cab and not give a crap how much it gets banged around. As long as it's reliable and goes bang when I need it too then it has served it's purpose. It's a low budget, no frills, no need to worry when you beat it up and bang it around rifle. Affordable= no worries and no worries= more fun. And I think that is why it will appeal to a lot of people.
The Maccabee SLR on the other hand, well, the sky's the limit as to what it can become for you. I think the reasons why it is in a totally different product category than the other rifle are pretty self explanatory. I would think it's safe to say that very few people are going to cancel this because of the new budget blaster.
I hope both turn out to be good products but I can't see either of them as being much competition for the other. Each of them fill a different gap in our market.
Exactly
I hope you two have actually looked into the ballistics of the 6.5 Grendel, with the velocities it gives I wouldn't be using it for bear hunting, I also wouldn't shoot at a deer beyond 200 yards with it either.
It's a fantastic target round with a very efficient bullet but the velocities are low meaning downrange energy will suffer and projectile selection and shot placement will be very important when transitioning to hunting from target shooting.
Just for comparison, my Modern Hunter in 6.5 Creedmoor with my handloads is only able to get to 2700fps with a 129gr projectile, I may be able to get that up a little more with a different powder but the Grendel has significantly less case capacity so you'll be down around 2500fps at the muzzle which will mean that you'll need a softer bullet to ensure proper expansion at distance once it's lost some velocity but then you lose out on the penetration needed for those tough bears. The 6.5G is only able to get decent velocities with lighter projectiles (according to load data) which doesn't make it a good choice as a bear rifle.
Other than that you're absolutely correct, the 180 is a fun entry level truck gun and the SLR is whatever you want it to be. I don't really understand the point of the poll, they are completely different and not at all in the same price range. Like comparing an SU-16 to a billet AR receiver set, I'm not even sure how they can be compared at all.
I'm personally more interested in the 180 than the SLR receiver set but I'm waiting for the ATRS receiver set over the SLR set. I don't care how much longer I have to wait since I have plenty of NR black rifles to play with while I wait for what I know will be a quality product.
Last edited:
100gr TTSX @ 2700 fps won't bounce off a black bear. Bullet selection and placement are always very important, regardless of cartridge. I've shot a couple dozen bears and the average distance is somewhere in the 60 yard range. For deer, the 123gr Hornady ELD @ 2450 fps is a 400 yard cartridge. 1850 fps / 925 ft lbs of energy, similar to what a 30-30 produces at 150 yards. The Grendel SLR machine gun will perform
You are 100% correct. I priced a Seekins precision upper and lower. From the States, with exchange, the pair come in at $600. They seem to be most expensive. An Aero set is probably $100 cheaper? So Maccabee is making roughly $400 extra profit. But as more and more manufacturers are now entering the NR market in Canada, the price has got to come down. Increased supply means lowered price, and manufacturers will have to compete for their slice of this market segment. This is far better for us as shooters, than when there was only one or two options (I will not count norinco.... lol).
I don’t mind being extorted for my NR receivers. Seekins receivers are worth diddly squat to me. I have waited most of my adult life for something like this. All the other manufacturers jumping on the bandwagon are priced similarly. Is an XCR worth $3000? Is a Swiss arms worth 4? Here in canada we gotta take what we can get, look what these “overpriced” receivers have started up here. We now (hopefully) have 3 options to build a NR black rifle from a stripped receiver. Before our options were a lot more than $1000, and none of them had the options these things have. Seekins has competition to fight, up here the competition is just starting. I’m sure the price will come down once the market is flooded but until then this it what we got. They aren’t having a hard time selling them from the looks of things.
Lots of mis-information being presented here, hopefully because of ignorance rather than malice, but let's address some of the comments.
SLR pricing is "extortion" - Really? If you don't like the price don't pay. Nobody is forcing you to purchase.
"An US made AR15 billet set is cheaper, therefore MDI is making the difference in profit" . Well, this opinion is not based on fact and relies heavily on conjecture.
Let's look at some facts.
MDI is doing relatively small scale production based solely on a Canadian niche product. Smaller production means higher per unit costs. Trying to compare US production prices to Canadian is facile, ATRS makes a billet AR receiver set that retails for about $950. The SLR, has a smaller potential market than any US made billet receiver set.
The SLR is a more expensive design to manufacture. Buying an MDI set gets you the upper, the lower and the trigger module (more pieces). The upper and lower are mated using an interrupted rail rather than take down pins. This requires more precise machining over more areas of the receivers to ensure fit is precise, and rattling/wobbling is not present. The more precision machining required, the higher the production costs.
MDI started with the premise that they were going to build more accurate products, using the best materials. Their receiver parts are 7075-T6 aluminum because it is stronger that 6061. It also costs more to purchase and machine. Their concern over accuracy is reflected in their machining tolerances too. Their production plan is to have machining tolerance of the critical components to greater precision that most other manufacturers consider economical. MDI was concerned about making their guns fit this precisely so that the components will not rattle, wobble of otherwise detract from the precision feel of the rifle.
All this to say, MDI is making a high quality product, and most owners will get exactly what they are hoping to get. MDI could certainly have built to looser tolerances, used cheaper materials, and built a cheaper product, but they chose not to. These were marketing decisions, and while they may not appeal to everyone, they certainly do not represent extortion or price gouging. Nor are you going to see price drops to stay competitive. Their product is unique, but fills a specific niche and is going to be built to quite different standards.
SLR pricing is "extortion" - Really? If you don't like the price don't pay. Nobody is forcing you to purchase.
"An US made AR15 billet set is cheaper, therefore MDI is making the difference in profit" . Well, this opinion is not based on fact and relies heavily on conjecture.
Let's look at some facts.
MDI is doing relatively small scale production based solely on a Canadian niche product. Smaller production means higher per unit costs. Trying to compare US production prices to Canadian is facile, ATRS makes a billet AR receiver set that retails for about $950. The SLR, has a smaller potential market than any US made billet receiver set.
The SLR is a more expensive design to manufacture. Buying an MDI set gets you the upper, the lower and the trigger module (more pieces). The upper and lower are mated using an interrupted rail rather than take down pins. This requires more precise machining over more areas of the receivers to ensure fit is precise, and rattling/wobbling is not present. The more precision machining required, the higher the production costs.
MDI started with the premise that they were going to build more accurate products, using the best materials. Their receiver parts are 7075-T6 aluminum because it is stronger that 6061. It also costs more to purchase and machine. Their concern over accuracy is reflected in their machining tolerances too. Their production plan is to have machining tolerance of the critical components to greater precision that most other manufacturers consider economical. MDI was concerned about making their guns fit this precisely so that the components will not rattle, wobble of otherwise detract from the precision feel of the rifle.
All this to say, MDI is making a high quality product, and most owners will get exactly what they are hoping to get. MDI could certainly have built to looser tolerances, used cheaper materials, and built a cheaper product, but they chose not to. These were marketing decisions, and while they may not appeal to everyone, they certainly do not represent extortion or price gouging. Nor are you going to see price drops to stay competitive. Their product is unique, but fills a specific niche and is going to be built to quite different standards.
SLR - Existing FRT
BCL future offering - No FRT
ATRS future offering - No FRT
and even the new uber inexpensive WK-180 - No FRT
A lot of claims that FRT should be approved in XX weeks/months.
Big hopes about a government department that sits often for years on issuing an FRT.
I would bet on what has an FRT.
The SLR.
Moe
BCL future offering - No FRT
ATRS future offering - No FRT
and even the new uber inexpensive WK-180 - No FRT
A lot of claims that FRT should be approved in XX weeks/months.
Big hopes about a government department that sits often for years on issuing an FRT.
I would bet on what has an FRT.
The SLR.
Moe
The only people I can see opting out of the SLR pre-order in favor of the WK180-C are a few people who just wanted a cheaper NR blaster. Most likely people who were going to gut a Norinco and end up with a $1500 bullet hose. And even some of those may not cancel for the simple reason that they still prefer the end look of the Norinco parts on the SLR receiver. So my guess is that the few that do bail out of the SLR will be few and far between.
Anyone who actually ordered the SLR because of what it is and what you can do with it won't cancel their pre-order and settle for the budget blaster because that isn't what most were looking for in the first place. People who actually have a build in mind like my A2 type build or people who want a high quality build with high quality components are still going to follow through and get the SLR.
The WK180-C has it's place but the SLR has infinite potential. I don't think MacDef has anything to worry about.
Anyone who actually ordered the SLR because of what it is and what you can do with it won't cancel their pre-order and settle for the budget blaster because that isn't what most were looking for in the first place. People who actually have a build in mind like my A2 type build or people who want a high quality build with high quality components are still going to follow through and get the SLR.
The WK180-C has it's place but the SLR has infinite potential. I don't think MacDef has anything to worry about.
ComradeVlad
Regular
- Location
- To the West
Answer.... NIETHER. Will be getting the ATR reciever 
OR the cheaper reciever alternative that just so happens to be out at the time I'm finally ready to purchase.
OR the cheaper reciever alternative that just so happens to be out at the time I'm finally ready to purchase.
