BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
The early 2000s were a great time to be in the market for a gently used 300 Winchester. They were everywhere.
Merits of 7mm Rem Mag Vs 338 Win Mag for long range Elk/Moose/Bear cartridge?
- Thread starter Northern Shooter
- Start date
The early 2000s were a great time to be in the market for a gently used 300 Winchester. They were everywhere.
True. At one time I had 6. Down to 3, and selling one of those. - dan
canadaman30
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Far from the City
The 7mmRM is better on the operators end every time the triggers pulled..lol
I'm not recoil adverse, have recently been shooting lots of 375, 458 etc but that is a fair point, especially if shooting from a bench at the range.
Not everyone is susceptible or are recoil intolerant.
By the same token we as enthusiasts (both new and old) have been spoiled by the recent years of hunting rifles that come standard with recoil management of some sort ie; a brake. The young’ins or new shooters are now given the options we old timers didn’t have to be able to tame recoil.
That said… and for the life of me, I just don’t understand those that buy a caliber only to download it below it’s intended potential, because they’re recoil intolerant or just to say that they’re shooting X Cal.
For me (and jmo obviously) it becomes a “hey look at me I’m with the cool kids” mentality. When in they really shouldn’t go on to extoll the virtues of said Cal when they’re not using it’s potential as intended. Ie; a standard load.
Why not buy a lesser or smaller Cal that is not only proven but equally effective for the intended species they are chasing if they’re that recoil sensitive becomes my question to them (?)
True. - dan
westcoaster
CGN Regular
- Location
- Central BC
Heh, my first 3006 was a Winchester model 670A...with a steel butt plate.
I was just gifted a 670 in 3006. Nice accurate rifle with the open sights .
I am thinking of turning into a Vetnam era sniper replica , but am not sure if I can find a floor plate and target stock that will fit it properly
Cat
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The 338 will hit harder at both ends. The 338 barrel life will be much better. The 7mm will shoot flatter (relevant only if shots are under 350 yds. Beyond that, scope adjustment or holdover and a range finder are needed for both). I have a Model 70 for which I have barrels in 7mm, 308 Norma, and 338. My favorite is the Norma with the 338 a close second. Have been unable to warm up to the 7mm
I was shooting the 338 and 250gr partitions at 400 yards yesterday. It reminded me how “flat shooting” is misunderstood so often. I will be out this coming week with my 7MM getting things squared away at 600 yards with it. 600 yards is a long ways for hunting situations. 400 yard shooting at game is rare. 600 even more so. Speed, BC, is it as big of a deal as we all seem to want to think it is? I dunno?
It’s almost always the same thing. Fellers that do… know. Fellers that don’t… just don’t know. Shooting at any distance can be made to be as complicated as one wants, or as easy as one wants. Silly turrets serve a purpose for some, and obviously don’t for others.
Gravity is a constant. The sooner most realize that, the sooner that expressions like “flat shooting” get to be redundant. Anything can be flat shooting, when you put the zero where it needs to be. Some choices just perform better than others.
R.
Gravity is a constant. The sooner most realize that, the sooner that expressions like “flat shooting” get to be redundant. Anything can be flat shooting, when you put the zero where it needs to be. Some choices just perform better than others.
R.
I was shooting the 338 and 250gr partitions at 400 yards yesterday. It reminded me how “flat shooting” is misunderstood so often. I will be out this coming week with my 7MM getting things squared away at 600 yards with it. 600 yards is a long ways for hunting situations. 400 yard shooting at game is rare. 600 even more so. Speed, BC, is it as big of a deal as we all seem to want to think it is? I dunno?
Agree, speed is definitely not in perspective, most guys start out with 2700-3000 fps (10% difference and insignificant), drop is easy to figure out, but even slow stuff gives a 250 yard 6" mpbr and fast stuff maybe 300, adding 50 yards to a mpbr is all you can typically get by going from a standard to a magnum so to speak, not worth the recoil or the discussion imo.
BC however does add flexibility in the hardest part of the equation which is calling the wind, .4 bc standard bullet vs a modern .6 bc bullet is 37% difference and to wish to play 400-600...high bc on the calculators will show the increased flexibility(hit probability) will be higher, the bonus of high bc bullets is you generally get high sd with it...so added penetration advantages also, and that means you can use less 'tough' bullets if you like the formula for opening up rapidly while retaining adequate penetrations...it's win win as the bc/sd's jump in the .6 to .28 or higher ranges, or in simpler terms 'heavy for cal' ranges.
.4 bc at 2700 fps launch at our elevations is 21.2" of 10 kmh wind drift at 600 yards
.6 bc at 2700 fps launch at our elevations is 12.9" of 10 kmh wind drift at 600 yards
guy should be able to read the wind within 5 kmh of things if he's been at it awhile, pays attention to weather reports of expected winds for the day, maybe has a wind meter and checks it all the time to get better at reading wind without taking all the gizmos hunting, I digress
not sure what that does for hit probability but that 37% difference in bc turned into 39% less wind drift at 600...high bc is our wind buddy, with really high bc you can almost just lean the reticle into the wind a bit, up to the edge of the kill zone and send it in most reasonable breezes to 500 yards and still land in the pie plate, have to pay exponentially better attention to wind as you approach 500 and move beyond it
so that 12.9" at 600 with the .6 bc bullet would equate to 12.9" at 480 yards for the .4 bc bullet as shown on calculator, 20% distance advantage for same drift with the higher bc bullet and the gain grows as the distance carries on, or is it 20% higher hit probability?, inside 400 your argument for bc as not a big a factor is valid, hit probability will be exponentially higher as you move from 400 to 600 as we start drifting outside of kill zones past 400 yards and moving further and further away the .6 bc bullet keeps losing less drift per same distance as the .4 bc bullet does so there's a point of diminishing returns on and hit probability gap just grows and grows as you keep going
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lol, for most up to 400...you did bring up 400-600 though, through there bc is a significant factor, speed still is not, bc over speed all day for those who set up for 0-600 actual long range and want as reasonably high hit probability within upper levels of available modern ballistics choices/cartridges/ammo etc.
your 7rm with those 168's will probably get you there ok, you got speed and bc with that combo...turning 600 into the new 400
Tin cups come in different sizes... so maybe for some, that is where the issue is? The feller with several tin cups of different sizes that uses them often and well, really doesn't seem to have any issues, with waves or otherwise.
R.
lol, for most up to 400...you did bring up 400-600 though, through there bc is a significant factor, speed still is not, bc over speed all day for those who set up for 0-600 actual long range and want as reasonably high hit probability within upper levels of available modern ballistics choices/cartridges/ammo etc.
your 7rm with those 168's will probably get you there ok, you got speed and bc with that combo...turning 600 into the new 400
Considering the OP asked this question because of hunting what he considers beyonf 30-06 range in the first place? Would say those are all good points lol
lol, for most up to 400...you did bring up 400-600 though, through there bc is a significant factor, speed still is not, bc over speed all day for those who set up for 0-600 actual long range and want as reasonably high hit probability within upper levels of available modern ballistics choices/cartridges/ammo etc.
your 7rm with those 168's will probably get you there ok, you got speed and bc with that combo...turning 600 into the new 400
The amount of game taken between 400-600 yards, outside of YouTube, would be less than your 20% BC advantage. I shoot LR for fun plenty. I have my own 1000 yard range. But its application in the hunting realm is limited. Especially when the bullets used to take advantage of this wind bucking ability aren’t exactly the best choice at the range 90% of game is taken at.
