Model 70 explosion

I've seen this happen with a 308 in a 270 Win.
The rifle was a Savage 110. Whatever the pressure was, I don't think any readily available design or brand would contain it, Remington 700 included.
We only know what we are being told as far as the ammunition is concerned.
Just sayin'.
 
Buckmastr said:
Here’s what a double charge of blue dot does to a weatherby

https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=341348
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This is why a powder charged case gets a bullet without leaving my hand. And always a shake test. I never set down powder charged cases. And always wear safety glasses when shooting.
I have seen a guy locally missing fingers whose 4570 blew up. I’ve seen or heard of a few unexplainable gun explosions
 
snoopycda said:
I've seen this happen with a 308 in a 270 Win.
The rifle was a Savage 110. Whatever the pressure was, I don't think any readily available design or brand would contain it, Remington 700 included.
We only know what we are being told as far as the ammunition is concerned.
Just sayin'.
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That's a bet I would take... a factory 308 in a 270 Win factory chambered 700 ... and not blowing up... because the gases would be contained...
 
I've seen a 6.5x55 fired in a 98 mauser .308 Norma Magnum.No harm done to gun or shooter but bullet diameter is obviously smaller.Piece of brass had to be driven out of the throat with a cleaning rod.
 
To me it looks like it fired out of battery. But I wouldn't have expected it to have exploded like that for out of battery. I wonder if it is possible that it was a faulty bullet and the lead core was pushed out leaving the jacket behind but that should never happen with a nosler partition.
 
Bigbubba said:
A guy on 24hr cf seems think he can see a "35" on the case rim, speculating that the wrong round was chambered
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Enhancing the image leads me to believe we're seeing MAG (with the M fairly obliterated) on the right side of the remaining part of case rim, and the F C marking over towards the left/top. This would be consistent with how Federal stamps their cases for 7mm Remington Magnum (F C across the top, 7MM REM MAG around the bottom half of the rim).

Unfortunately the image is pretty bad and looks like it went through some serious dithering when uploaded somewhere, so I can't say for sure. A decent high resolution image of the remaining case rim would likely make it very easy to pull enough detail out to know.
 
fade2black said:
If the gasses are contained, where exactly would the bullet go?
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Down the barrel. The bullet is wedged in the chamber at the junction of the shoulder and the neck. It will size down as it goes forward.
Earlier I mentioned the .308 having been fired in a 7mmRM M70. the bullet went through the barrel. The case rupture did ruin the rifle, but the bullet did exit.
 
If there is any sort of barrel obstruction, there will almost invariably be a ring, bulge, crack or rupture of the barrel. Nothing is evident in the photos, and no mention is made of the bore condition.
The M70 crf action is a descendent of the M1903 Springfield. The coned breech design abandoned all aspects of the safety breeching incorporated in the M1898 Mauser, which the Americans sort of copied. Copied closely enough that they had to pay royalties to Mauser. As a result, M70s do not handle catastrophic case failures as well as either the M98 Mauser or the M700 Remington. As guntech has pointed out, the M700 is a superior design from the standpoint of protecting the shooter in the event of a case failure like this one.

An out of battery discharge would not cause this sort of damage. Because the breech is unlocked, gas pressure is not confined to the point that the receiver will rupture. In addition, the bolt would be far further back, or even ejected from the rifle.

Given how ammunition is manufactured, how could a case full of pistol powder get into one cartridge in a production line? That isn't going to happen accidentally.

The light load of a slow burning powder has been reported to have caused detonations. Problem is, it has never happened in a deliberate testing situation.

The damage to the locking abutment looks smaller than the width of the locking lug. Can't explain that. Can't explain how the bolt is partially rotated either.

Can't tell if the action is pre or post '64.

The stock certainly appears to be a custom. That raises questions about the entire rifle - was the barreled action original unaltered factory? Searched the 'net for photos of M70s. Every one I found shows the gas escape hole on the right side of the receiver ring. This rifle obviously had a hole on the left.
 
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Montana actions have a gas port on both sides of the action. Is it possible that this isn't actually a Winchester rifle but one of the clones?
 
Markus said:
Montana actions have a gas port on both sides of the action. Is it possible that this isn't actually a Winchester rifle but one of the clones?
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This is from the original thread on 24hourcampfire:

He inherited the rifle from his grandfather. It has been in the family for many years. I don't know if it had been customized in any way, but has had many years of normal use.
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Unlikely to be a Montana if it's been in the family a couple of generations.

Now that I'm afraid to touch my rifles...
 
Drilling an extra gas vent hole on the left side was not that uncommon if one read Frank DeHaas. I believe the receiver was damaged at some point, whether from the use of an inside wrench to remove a very tight barrel or from repeated use of excessive loads, and it finally failed. When the receiver ring split, the barrel tipped down, the head of the case blew out, and the bolt deflected upward. The pre-64 action (and I am a fan) is weak on the right side of the ring. The pics are not good enough to be able to see well enough.
I have told many people of the guy who fired a 308 Norma Magnum through a 7mm STW in a Remington 700. They broke the handle off trying to open the bolt but, when he brought the rifle in, I removed the barrel, removed the bolt, replaced the extractor, removed the stuck case, re-attached the handle, reassembled the rifle, checked headspace and testfired it. The headspace had not changed. The owner reported the shot, which was fired at a bear, killed the bear. The bullet was a 180 Swift A-Frame. I don't think a Winchester would have handled the same situation the same.
 
Possible that someone had switched a cartridge in the ammo box at the store. I have bought ammo that had 1 shell missing out of a box, and another box had 1 cartridge that was the right calibre, but was a different bullet.
 
I have seen something like that as well. A .375 in a .416 box, or vice versa.
But I don't know what combination would have caused that amount of damage. As I mentioned earlier, I saw the results with a .308 being fired in a 7mmRM. Nothing like the photos.
 
Leeper said:
Drilling an extra gas vent hole on the left side was not that uncommon if one read Frank DeHaas. I believe the receiver was damaged at some point, whether from the use of an inside wrench to remove a very tight barrel or from repeated use of excessive loads, and it finally failed. When the receiver ring split, the barrel tipped down, the head of the case blew out, and the bolt deflected upward. The pre-64 action (and I am a fan) is weak on the right side of the ring. The pics are not good enough to be able to see well enough.
I have told many people of the guy who fired a 308 Norma Magnum through a 7mm STW in a Remington 700. They broke the handle off trying to open the bolt but, when he brought the rifle in, I removed the barrel, removed the bolt, replaced the extractor, removed the stuck case, re-attached the handle, reassembled the rifle, checked headspace and testfired it. The headspace had not changed. The owner reported the shot, which was fired at a bear, killed the bear. The bullet was a 180 Swift A-Frame. I don't think a Winchester would have handled the same situation the same.
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There is no doubt an unaltered 700 action with the enclosed extractor system is the strongest, safest 2 locking lug action ever made. About 1968 I worked on a 7mm Rem Mag that had a fired .303 British round in it. I had to loosen the barrel to get the bolt out... and after prying the fire formed .303 case out of the bolt face I assembled it all and it was fine... no repairs needed.

It's the escaping gases that do all the blow up and damage to a rifle ... the better you can contain these gases, the better the action will fare.
 
Could have been bolt lug failure, wrong bolt- if it was over pressure from ammo the brass vase would have been welded to the barrel
You would not have gotten the case out in one piece , no barrel deformity, no barrel obstruction
 
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