Model 70 pre '64 value??**Updated with lots of photo's**

DIGGER2

DIGGER2

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Hey fella's, a good friend of mine is wanting to sell his pre '64 model 70 in 270Win. As I can recall the gun is in pretty good shape, I believe it's all original with a peep site. Roughly what kind of value is this gun going to bring him? I will have pictures and serial number to check manufacture date tomorrow night. Any suggestions?? Thanks..........
 
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There are not four pre-64 M 70's in the CGN for sale section, at this time. The last one offerred, about 2 weeks back at 70%-75%, sold right off. Most don't stick around very long if they're any good. I just bought the two that were offerred a week or so ago (95% plus). One was a supergrade and the other a 243 F/W and I paid considerably more and was happy to find them.

To answer your question; without good pictures it's tough to give you an accurate price. But one thing to keep in mind, with a pre-64 Model 70 is, the action alone is worth from $500 to $700 if it's in good original condition. So lets go up from there. The stock is worth $275 plus if it's uncut and in original condition. The barrel is worth $150 plus, sights are worth $75 to $100, floorplate $75 plus, trigger guard $65 plus. Do you see where I'm going here? The sling swivels alone are selling for $30. Even if it's not pristine, it's at least worth the sum of it's parts.

Therefore; in unmessed with, very good original condition, in 270 win cal; it's worth at least $1000 to $1250 and more if it's pristine. Another thing to keep in mind is; from the 581,000 pre-64 Model 70's manufactured, how many are still in unmessed with, very good, original condition? These ones are worth quite a premium over the rest.

To further help you out, I copied and pasted an article that I wrote, for a American gun forum in a sticky about 4 years back, concerning the pre-64 Model 70. You'll need to make adjustments for the Canadian market as our econmy is in better shape, at the moment.

-- A gun is worth what it'll sell for, but to help determine it's value, check out Guns International, Guns America for what folks are asking and www.gunbroker.com to see what people have bid and paid. To position a gun within the parameters of it's potential value, three factors are usually considered:

1. Rarity
2. Originality
3. Condition (NRA Grading System)

With M70's the term "correct" means a lot. If the gun is not in original condition; eg. reblued, refinished, stock cut and pad added, or any non-factory alterations, the gun's rating goes to 'Fair Condition" no matter how fine a shape it's in. Most pre-64 M70's came with a checkered steel buttplate. Around 1959 to 1960 the plastic checkered buttplate began to filter in and by 1961 was pretty much standard. 375's mainly came standard with pads as did Westerners and Alaskans. The 264 Westerner came with a plastic buttplate and was the only caliber featherweight available with a factory recoil pad. No other featherweights were offerred with a pad. Winchester began using the vented pad around 1961 but some solid red Winchester pads were still used. Winchester was famous for "Running Changes". Also, solid red pads can be factory correct on a special order gun if backed up with paperwork.
Pre-war models are worth a premium over post war, and Super Grades are worth about a 100% premium over Standard Grades.

Winchester made around 581,400 M70's between 1936 and 1963. When Winchester geared up for WWII, they stamped the last receiver around 52,000, continuing after the War ended.

!. Rarity -- caliber and model
2. Originality -- has it been messed with or still original
3. Condition -- NRA website, condition from NIB to Poor.

Some examples of rarity:

30-06 / 208,000 --- 270 / 122,000 --- 243 / 43,600 --- 308 /41,100 --- 300 H&H / 37,100 --- 264 Win Mag / 24,000 - - - 22 Hornet / 20,000 - - - 257 Rbts / 14,600 --- 220 Swift / 20,000 - - - 375 H&H / 14,000 --- 338 / 9,500 --- 300 Win Mag / 5,000 - - - 250-3000 /2750 --- 458 Win Mag / 1550 - - - 7mm / 1,470 --- 300 Sav / 362 - - - etc.

Some of the different models are: Standard Grade - Super Grade - Standard Featherweight - Super Grade Featherweight - Carbine - National Match - Target Grade - Varmint - Westener - Alaskan - Gopher Special - Bull Gun - and Special Order Guns.

Hope this helps you some.
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Remember you can buy a new Winchester Model 70 FWT in .270win in Canada for under $800.00. I looked for a long time to buy my Winchester Model 70 FWT, but i found that most gunowners figured a used rifle, no matter what condition were way overpriced because they were riding on the Winchester M70 reputation. I finally gave up on a used rifle and went out and bought a new one and for my use and $$$ value you can't go wrong with buying new. These are my words for the gun owner that thinks his old beat up guns is still a piece of gold. Winchester still makes good firearms no matter who wants to put them down for any reason at all.

Please take note of my signature and the fact that i really am a lever person but this bolt gun is a real nice shooter and i am glad i bought my Winchester Model 70 FWT in .270 win as it could be the nicest rifle i have ever owned.
 
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well there you go you can list it for what ever price you want and it will be another model 70 with 3000 views and still for sale. the ones I looked at did not have a sold beside them .
 
struff55 said:
well there you go you can list it for what ever price you want and it will be another model 70 with 3000 views and still for sale. the ones I looked at did not have a sold beside them .
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struff - I would like to know where these pre-64 M70's are that have had 3000 views and still for sale, I might get a bargain or two. Checked back 14 pages and only found the two ads and they all sold around 600 views. I'm always open for a deal on a pre 64 m70.

Polaris - Digger wasn't asking about the new models, he was asking the value of pre-64's. The new FN Model 70's have been receiving good reviews, for a new rifle. But the minute you walk out the door, they're worth less than what you just paid because they are no longer new.

Here's what's been listed on CGN and sold right quick...

- Sold 619 views . http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=548718


- Sold 668 views . http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=548186
 
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Hey Rod thanks for the info. As I can recall, I believe the gun is in pretty good shape. I will have pictures, and hopefully a mfg date tonight when I get home from work. Thanks again to all.....:cheers:
 
polaris rider said:
Remember you can buy a new Winchester Model 70 FWT in .270win in Canada for under $800.00. I looked for a long time to buy my Winchester Model 70 FWT, but i found that most gunowners figured a used rifle, no matter what condition were way overpriced because they were riding on the Winchester M70 reputation. I finally gave up on a used rifle and went out and bought a new one and for my use and $$$ value you can't go wrong with buying new. These are my words for the gun owner that thinks his old beat up guns is still a piece of gold. Winchester still makes good firearms no matter who wants to put them down for any reason at all.

Please take note of my signature and the fact that i really am a lever person but this bolt gun is a real nice shooter and i am glad i bought my Winchester Model 70 FWT in .270 win as it could be the nicest rifle i have ever owned.
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I'm a lefty so it doesn't always work this way but I bought a NEW Winchester 270WSM Left Hand (2006 manufacture) in 2009 and paid $700 delivered to my door. I have a tough time buying much used when you can find great deals on new stuff if you look around. I have seen this same gun but used listed here for $800-$850.
 
What Rod didn't mention is that there were also a myriad of options available from teh custom shop. Different sights, different checkering patterns, odd barrel lengths etc. Yet another reason they're so tough for peopel to authenticate and probably another reason they're so popular.
 
Sorry fellas no pictures yet. His work schedule and mine aren't working out. I will try and get some up asap. Thanks to all again for the info.......
 
I look at a pre 64 model 70 at all angles. The full size ones are indeed, heavy. I once hunted with one in 270 calibre with a Weaver K2.5 scope. I wasn't in the mountains and wouldn't want to use that rifle on tough mountain trips, either.
I thought the light weight models were much better, but even Jack O'Connor thought they had cut down too much on them.
I happen to think the old model 70s were over rated. If it hadn't been for Jack O'Connor would they still be called a rifleman's rifle?
If Jack had made a deal with Remington, instead of Winchester, would we all be seeking a high priced Model 725 Remington now?
Having said all that, if I had my choice now, between a good pre 64 model 70 and a new model 70, I would take the old one in a heart beat.
I would say an old Belgian Browning with the FN action is superior to a pre 64 model 70, but the Browning is also pretty heavy.
Same goes for the very similar FN sporting rifle.
I have stated on these threads how I bought myself a Christmas present in 1949 of a Husqvarna 30-06, the original with the FN action. After I properly bedded it and replaced the trigger with a custom DT, I prefer this rifle, over a pre 64 model 70 Winchester, as a hunting rifle. The Husqvarna is light in weight, probably on a par, or even lighter than the old light weight model 70s. In spite of all the tough trips this rifle has been on, including many hard mountain trips on some of the finest mountains in BC, sometimes in the worst of weather, it is still in great shape. A month or so ago I blew the cobwebs from it at the range. I posted a five shot group from this rifle, fired at 100 metres, that actually measured less than one inch.
If the old model 70s had anything on this rifle, I don't know what it would be.
 
H4831 said:
I look at a pre 64 model 70 at all angles. The full size ones are indeed, heavy. I once hunted with one in 270 calibre with a Weaver K2.5 scope. I wasn't in the mountains and wouldn't want to use that rifle on tough mountain trips, either.
I thought the light weight models were much better, but even Jack O'Connor thought they had cut down too much on them.
I happen to think the old model 70s were over rated. If it hadn't been for Jack O'Connor would they still be called a rifleman's rifle?
If Jack had made a deal with Remington, instead of Winchester, would we all be seeking a high priced Model 725 Remington now?
Having said all that, if I had my choice now, between a good pre 64 model 70 and a new model 70, I would take the old one in a heart beat.
I would say an old Belgian Browning with the FN action is superior to a pre 64 model 70, but the Browning is also pretty heavy.
Same goes for the very similar FN sporting rifle.
I have stated on these threads how I bought myself a Christmas present in 1949 of a Husqvarna 30-06, the original with the FN action. After I properly bedded it and replaced the trigger with a custom DT, I prefer this rifle, over a pre 64 model 70 Winchester, as a hunting rifle. The Husqvarna is light in weight, probably on a par, or even lighter than the old light weight model 70s. In spite of all the tough trips this rifle has been on, including many hard mountain trips on some of the finest mountains in BC, sometimes in the worst of weather, it is still in great shape. A month or so ago I blew the cobwebs from it at the range. I posted a five shot group from this rifle, fired at 100 metres, that actually measured less than one inch.
If the old model 70s had anything on this rifle, I don't know what it would be.
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Lots of 60 year old rifles will shoot one inch groups. In fact, most of them will if they were maintained.

Lots of them are much more valuable than the equivalent Model 70, lots of them (including Husqvarna FN's) are worth much less. What is your point?

A pre-64 featherweight, available in 1952 weighs 6-1/2 pounds, on average, bare. What does your Husqvarna weigh?
 
rgv said:
Lots of 60 year old rifles will shoot one inch groups. In fact, most of them will if they were maintained.

Lots of them are much more valuable than the equivalent Model 70, lots of them (including Husqvarna FN's) are worth much less. What is your point?

A pre-64 featherweight, available in 1952 weighs 6-1/2 pounds, on average, bare. What does your Husqvarna weigh?
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My point is, as I stated, that I prefer my rifle to a pre 64 Winchester Model 70.
Do you have a problem with this?
 
H4831 said:
My point is, as I stated, that I prefer my rifle to a pre 64 Winchester Model 70.
Do you have a problem with this?
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Not at all. I own and like a variety of rifles, including Husqvarna FN's.

Just wondering what your preference in rifles, the occasion of your rifle shooting a one inch group, or the relative weights of contemporary rifles has to do with the original posters inquiry regarding the value of his friends rifle.
 
Ok guys here are some photos of the gun. According to the serial number it was built in 1950. Tell what you think it's worth.

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~5-600$ if lucky. It is in fair cosmetic condition, plenty of bluing and stock wear. How is the bore? It is clearly well used (as any rifle should be).
 
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