Modern Hunter jamming issue

patsow87 said:
I'm sorry but I'm not exaggerating anything. If I order the configuration I want from you today, when all is said and done my bank account will be close to 6k lighter. For close to 6k is it to much to ask as a potential buyer that the item performs the way it's supposed to ? And if a product is defective, That the company that sold it to me pays to ship it back to them and guarantees it will be a priority case and a matter of days till the item is returned in perfect functioning order or replaced by one that works? I wouldn't expect it from a crappy Chinese company, but you claim to be high end, and when I buy high end that's what I expect; a high end product, but especially high end service...It is funny you mention Mercedes. I don't know about Alberta, but here if there is a issue with my MB, while under warranty, they send a guy from the dealership to come pick up the car and bring a courtesy replacement for the duration of the repair/ service, free of charge. That is what I expect when I pay more for "high end". I was going to buy a MH until recently reading there where issues with some rifles, compounded by the fact that service was slow/ reluctant and at the buyers cost. Im saddened really because it soured my potential acquisition and put doubts in my mind.Also the fact that they choose to downplay and make light of issues or concerns some buyers or potential buyers may have and attemp to discredit them instead or addressing said concerns does nothing to reassure me... It's a shame, Maybe If I had the chance to put a few boxes through one before buying it alleviate my fears but as it stands I won't be jumping on one just yet...
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The part that some of us are #####ing about exaggerating is the price always being quoted as $5000.00, when in fact the basic rifle is $3650.00. True with all of the upgrades, hard case, optics and shipping to far off places and tax in some provinces the rifles have left here at $10000.00 or more. BUT the fact still remains just like any other rifle, the basic model is X amount of money, the upgrades and shipping and taxes are NOT part of the basic rifle. To be continually compared to an XCR or whatever basic rifle and in the same sentence our rifle is mentioned to be $5000.00 is B.S. and guys know it, it is just for the effect they wish to push, which commonly has little base in fact.

Apparently we ARE in different worlds when it comes to cars. I just dumped my 2015 BMW 5 series due to very poor customer support and a lack of service.

From your post I feel that in the unlikely event that you bought our rifle and had a problem we should fly someone out to your location within mere minutes of a being advised of a possible problem, replace the rifle, get you laid and apologize forever for the inconvenience.

We take all warranty issues very seriously and deal with them in the highest priority. Frankly I am very insulted by your posts innuendo. You have no basis to make the assumptions you have made, apart from possibly reading the rants from a few haters, most of which have never purchased a rifle from us, and who like most on the internet forums can post whatever B.S. they wish with complete anonymity.
 
Mister Donut said:
A DPMS BCG just seems a little out of place in a $5k Lamborgini rifle.

I suppose that's just my opinion.
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It's one if not the cheapest AR308 BCG you can get. With a known weak/short service life for the extracter spring. My $1500 DPMS LR308 has one. DPMS has even gone to the GII and used a new elaster polymer to insure there wasn't the same issue with spring.

It's fine for a build or consumer grade target rifle providing the user knows it's weakness. I just wouldn't expect to see one in anything considered high end. A good builder/hobbiest part but far from high end.
 
Patsow,

MH is not a rifle for you. I do not mean to be disrespectful, its just that you make it clear you cannot afford one based on cost and perceived risks of ownership. That is ok. No one is judging, so no need to justify yourself. Just move along to other rifle threads that tickles your fancy.

Personally I bought in the gunsmith passion of the project. I understand the economics of small batch production and have accepted the price tag e$calation ba$ed on my cu$tomization choice$. Evidently I knew of ATRS capabilities, I trusted their business ethics and flawless Customer service in case of product issue.

I admit the decision to get the rifle was much easier than funding it... It took a year long of whoring my ugly self. :p
Aside some loose ends (...), I'm now a proud and happy MH owner. :cool:
 
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UR2X3M4ME said:
Patsow,

MH is not a rifle for you. I do not mean to be disrespectful, its just that you make it clear you cannot afford one based on cost and perceived risks of ownership. That is ok. No one is judging, so no need to justify yourself. Just move along to other rifle threads that tickles your fancy.

Personally I bought in the gunsmith passion of the project. I understand the economics of small batch production and have accepted the price tag e$calation ba$ed on my cu$tomization choice$. Evidently I knew of ATRS capabilities, I trusted their business ethics and flawless Customer service in case of product issue.

I admit the decision to get the rifle was much easier than funding it... It took a year long of whoring my ugly self. :p
Aside some loose ends (...), I'm now a proud and happy MH owner. :cool:
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Have you had Any issues ? Ive had trouble finding any unbiased reviews on the rifles released so far. I was not out to disrespect anyone and had no other agenda than getting some truthful information and feedback to take a decision , but when Mr ATRS decided to call me out instead of reassuring me it just put a negative spin on everything. Thanks for all the answers and info everyone, much appreciated.
 
My Modern Hunter has been nothing short of flawless and the customer service I've received from the guys at ATRS has been professional, friendly and helpful every time. Their advice on load development as well as useful hunting accessories has made this my go-to hunting rifle.

The fit, finish and functioning of my MH is something I can brag about. Plus, I know these guys have my back should anything go wrong. This is the feeling I get every time I see these guys in person. This is an unbiased opinion as I've bought rifles from other companies who wouldn't give me the time of day afterwards.

I'm now saving towards a Modern Varminter.
 
K sometimes I'm a d!ck, I know, Im working on it.
But I'm also in business, and I do know a thing or two about how not to run a business successfully.
Sh!tting on the customer that bought a Gucci rifle, really bad idea.
Why not just say, ok, we will do everything we can possibly do to make it right by our customers.
Why not?
Core15 does it:"A warranty. What else about a product says as much about how highly a maker values their own work? It’s a mark of integrity, an assurance that the person who built it believes in it enough to stand behind it. Lawyers, legalese and fine print have no place in it. And we feel ours both stands on its own and speaks for itself. “The rifle you have just purchased has the simplest, most plainly written warranty you will ever read. This is no fine print. There are no exceptions. This CORE15 rifle has been manufactured and assembled with painstaking care and precision by proud US Veterans, trained by the best there is. If anything is not up to your standard, accuracy included, if anything goes wrong, gets bent, broken, cracked, misaligned, tweaked, snapped or otherwise, simply contact one of our professionals and we will work to make it right. If you are the 5th owner and the rifle has seen 40k+ rounds, it simply….doesn’t….matter. We stand behind our products and we take care of our customers. That is our promise and your assurance.”

Just makes sense... If you say this officially, in writing and you actually do this, including shipping, both ways, then no one will b!tch about anything, well except if the rifle explodes in their faces, then no amount of warranty and service is gonna help you.

Anywho, back to being a d!ck.
 
So far I think we've learned that quite a few people here bought a MH thinking they were getting a non restricted AR-10 that would shoot any ammo they fed and because it cost a lot of money and has an expensive barrel they figured it should shoot any ammo well. Crap ammo makes crap groups then you throw in the shooters ability and things usually get worse. Even shooting middle of the road 168gr I was able to get close to 1moa from the rifle 1-20ish has which is a first run rifle, I was hoping for a little better but I was more concerned with a couple of the other issues I had with the rifle (that after an email I sent him Rick addressed in the next run).

Reality is that a lot of people don't really have a clue and should have just bought an XCR-M or Norinco M-14 if they are not handloaders or are not able to afford quality ammo. This is an expensive precision semi auto and it requires quality ammo if you expect it to perform. Running surplus through it is stupid and a total waste of barrel life. Cheap surplus ammo is for cheap surplus rifles.
Follow the manufacturers instructions and run it wet for the first few hundred rounds using quality ammo in the 165-178gr range and other than the first 40 rifles made which they are taking care of under warranty you should have no issues.

Suggesting ATRS build an econo model would be like asking Knights Armourment to build a $600 AR. They would laugh at you and tell you to go buy a Bushmaster.
Why would they waste their time building it when they have a linup of people waiting for the MH and MV the way it is now? I originally thought that they should have loosened up the tolerances a little to increase reliability but if as they claim all it actually needs is some rounds through it for breakin then that's even better as the end product will be that much better once breakin is complete.

Yes it's an expensive rifle, yes there have been a few small issues with them. They are obviously not for everyone and if you can barely afford one then you're probably better off with a different rifle since you probably can't afford to feed one of these the ammo it needs to be able to show you what it's really capable of anyway.
I was on the fence before but now I'm looking at my collection trying to figure out what I can sell so I can order a MV without taking any cash out of my pocket (house renovations are killing my account).
 
cr5 said:
So far I think we've learned that quite a few people here bought a MH thinking they were getting a non restricted AR-10 that would shoot any ammo they fed and because it cost a lot of money and has an expensive barrel they figured it should shoot any ammo well. Crap ammo makes crap groups then you throw in the shooters ability and things usually get worse. Even shooting middle of the road 168gr I was able to get close to 1moa from the rifle 1-20ish has which is a first run rifle, I was hoping for a little better but I was more concerned with a couple of the other issues I had with the rifle (that after an email I sent him Rick addressed in the next run).

Reality is that a lot of people don't really have a clue and should have just bought an XCR-M or Norinco M-14 if they are not handloaders or are not able to afford quality ammo. This is an expensive precision semi auto and it requires quality ammo if you expect it to perform. Running surplus through it is stupid and a total waste of barrel life. Cheap surplus ammo is for cheap surplus rifles.
Follow the manufacturers instructions and run it wet for the first few hundred rounds using quality ammo in the 165-178gr range and other than the first 40 rifles made which they are taking care of under warranty you should have no issues.

Suggesting ATRS build an econo model would be like asking Knights Armourment to build a $600 AR. They would laugh at you and tell you to go buy a Bushmaster.
Why would they waste their time building it when they have a linup of people waiting for the MH and MV the way it is now? I originally thought that they should have loosened up the tolerances a little to increase reliability but if as they claim all it actually needs is some rounds through it for breakin then that's even better as the end product will be that much better once breakin is complete.

Yes it's an expensive rifle, yes there have been a few small issues with them. They are obviously not for everyone and if you can barely afford one then you're probably better off with a different rifle since you probably can't afford to feed one of these the ammo it needs to be able to show you what it's really capable of anyway.
I was on the fence before but now I'm looking at my collection trying to figure out what I can sell so I can order a MV without taking any cash out of my pocket (house renovations are killing my account).
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In all of the posts regarding this fine rifle this one in right to the point and hits it squarely on the head. If there are individuals who do not see this and do not agree should get into another hobby.
 
Sqr said:
In all of the posts regarding this fine rifle this one in right to the point and hits it squarely on the head. If there are individuals who do not see this and do not agree should get into another hobby.
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Thanks Sqr,
I didn't even get a chance to give a :slap: to the guys using automotive lubricants on their rifles. Come on people, these are rifles not cars, one oil is not the same as the next. Does that $12 bottle of gun oil really put you over the edge and force you to decide which child doesn't get dinner tonight? Would you run sewing machine oil in your new car? Does your rifle look like a transmission?

Drop $3500+ on a rifle then look for ways to save money on ammo and oil then complain about reliability or accuracy? Makes no sense to me.
 
Just curious- what qualifies as "crap ammo"? Surely this or any other rifle should be able to feed commercial ammo and give decent groups.

I have no horse in this race, but blaming commercial ammo for the issues discussed in this thread seems... lame.
 
Would you guys consider this Aguila .308 brass cased ammo to be "crap ammo" not fit for a modern hunter?

3597504_01_cheap_aguila_308_7_62x51_non_m_640.jpg


Or how about this PMC .308 brass cased.

308147fmjbtpmc-20-b_1.jpg
 
cr5 said:
So far I think we've learned that quite a few people here bought a MH thinking they were getting a non restricted AR-10 that would shoot any ammo they fed and because it cost a lot of money and has an expensive barrel they figured it should shoot any ammo well. Crap ammo makes crap groups then you throw in the shooters ability and things usually get worse. Even shooting middle of the road 168gr I was able to get close to 1moa from the rifle 1-20ish has which is a first run rifle, I was hoping for a little better but I was more concerned with a couple of the other issues I had with the rifle (that after an email I sent him Rick addressed in the next run).

Reality is that a lot of people don't really have a clue and should have just bought an XCR-M or Norinco M-14 if they are not handloaders or are not able to afford quality ammo. This is an expensive precision semi auto and it requires quality ammo if you expect it to perform. Running surplus through it is stupid and a total waste of barrel life. Cheap surplus ammo is for cheap surplus rifles.
Follow the manufacturers instructions and run it wet for the first few hundred rounds using quality ammo in the 165-178gr range and other than the first 40 rifles made which they are taking care of under warranty you should have no issues.

Suggesting ATRS build an econo model would be like asking Knights Armourment to build a $600 AR. They would laugh at you and tell you to go buy a Bushmaster.
Why would they waste their time building it when they have a linup of people waiting for the MH and MV the way it is now? I originally thought that they should have loosened up the tolerances a little to increase reliability but if as they claim all it actually needs is some rounds through it for breakin then that's even better as the end product will be that much better once breakin is complete.

Yes it's an expensive rifle, yes there have been a few small issues with them. They are obviously not for everyone and if you can barely afford one then you're probably better off with a different rifle since you probably can't afford to feed one of these the ammo it needs to be able to show you what it's really capable of anyway.
I was on the fence before but now I'm looking at my collection trying to figure out what I can sell so I can order a MV without taking any cash out of my pocket (house renovations are killing my account).
Click to expand...

I agree with all of this
 
Hornady Steel Match ammo has consistently produced moa groups out of my JP Enterprises rifles, and the rifles have been flawless since day one (despite my use of Mobil 1 synthetic oil as lube)
I've been very pleased with this "crap" ammo.
 
cr5 said:
Thanks Sqr,
I didn't even get a chance to give a :slap: to the guys using automotive lubricants on their rifles. Come on people, these are rifles not cars, one oil is not the same as the next. Does that $12 bottle of gun oil really put you over the edge and force you to decide which child doesn't get dinner tonight? Would you run sewing machine oil in your new car? Does your rifle look like a transmission?

Drop $3500+ on a rifle then look for ways to save money on ammo and oil then complain about reliability or accuracy? Makes no sense to me.
Click to expand...

I would argue the automotive lubricants view. A lot of us use combinations. For me it's a base of G96 and then Shell Roteilla 0W40 pure synthetic on the high wear parts. Works great. Worked in sub -50 and in very high temperatures. Mobile 1 is also a well known true and tried superior firearm lubricant. Also, it's not any cheaper than gun oil. Due to the volume I guess it is, but your initial outlay is more. But it is a better product. I use this combination on all my firearms. I don't have jamming, fail to eject issues etc. Even after putting a lot of rounds through a firearm and or shooting rapidly. Clean up is a breeze. Takes me half the time it would with regular gun oil. The carbon in 99 percent of the parts just wipes off.

Yup with regards to good ammo. Also you have to try a bunch of different types. While 168 Federal gold is the benchmark, not all barrels like it. Some barrels have their accuracy node at higher or lower velocity and favour heavier or lighter rounds. 155-175 range is generally the easiest to get shooting really well.

Personally I think the most likely cause of a jamming issue with the Modern Hunter is a geometry problem. We know that mags are the first thing you check with AR rifles if there is a feeding/ejecting problem and move on from there. So... Can't use gen3 pmags along with iffy with some others. Yet, my KAC SR25, LMT MWS, and AR10T DND rifles also all have match grade barrels on them and have no issues feeding a large assortment of ammo or using gen3 pmags (my AR10 rifles are the older style so M14 style mags). To me the fact that it's in all of them and that they are finicky smacks of some type of geometry issue with the mag angle to the feed ramps which is causing a problem. In some cases it could be the weak extractor spring. Others gas issues. But with the constants it tells me it's not a minor variable, but something more common. If it's just slightly out this could account for the ammo sensitivity for reliability along with the mag restrictions. This would also make sense if designing a specific mag for this rifle was to suddenly "fix" the issue. Some minor manipulation with the feed angle in the follower etc could make it reliable if this is the case. The fact that gen2 pmags work well, and not gen3 tells me there is something off with the ammo feeding angle or feed ramp/mag geometry. compared to the standard AR308 rifles. Which I suspect may be why gen3 pmags aren't an issue with them but are with the Modern hunter.
 
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