More M14 Smithing Advice - When to call a Spade a Fzcking Shovel!

I have both as well, can't do a fair comparison as the M1A loaded has a medium heavy barrel. The Norinco has over 2000 rounds with no issues, just not as accurate as the M1A. M1A has about 1000 rounds through it and have emailed Springfield about some issues with the gas piston and also the op rod hitting the reciever and damaging the oprod. The M1A accuracy is excellent to say the least!

Rodney
 
Let's not turn this fine Nork accuracy potential thread of Hungry's into a Springer versus Nork debate. It gets very old quickly and I'm one that can ride that horse as far as anyone.

Barney has condensed the out of box nork accuracy potential nicely. I've owned one for about 5 years now and have put a fair number of rounds down range.

I think the NorincoM14 should be viewed the same way the SKS is viewed. It's a great platform for us to learn to shoot a full powered semi-auto battle rifle with. Nothing more nothing less.

If people spent more time and money on ammo and range time than DIY or gumsmith upgrades, they'd be alot happier with themselves and their M14! When you can outshoot my Nork M-14(2.5MOAish surplus ball) in all positions unsupported, I'd say now it's time for accuracy upgrade grasshopper.
If you use your M-14 to compete, that's a totally different need and anything you can afford to do, do it so as not to fail because of your equipments capabilities.

Most of the Norinco's however, maybe 95%,... I'm guessing are fired casually at everything from pop cans on a 25 meter backstop to water jugs layed out 600 meters away in the snow:cool:(they are pretty safe there;);)......)

Buy your Nork, learn how to operate it properly. Then pound the guts out of it just like an SKS with cheap corrosive ammo would be fired, but remember attention to detail with your marksmanship.
What other two platforms (NorkM14&SKS)I ask anyone on this board,..were a match made in heaven for a man or woman or child to cheaply and enjoyably learn how to shoot a GD centerfire rifle properly?????

I see lot's of posers with their SKS or AR-15 or M14 blasting away huge quantities of ammo into the 50 or 100 meter backstops with nary a concern with marksmanship perfecting and I have to ask..... What's a rifle for Really????,..what's a rifle for??? To merely hit things I can throw a rock at with a similar probability of a hit minus the loud noise of course??

To make a short story long:p...... master the iron sights with cheapo ammo,...quantify the rifles inherent accuracy on a bench with well placed rounds to give yourself a baseline to match,..and then fire round after round after round till you come close to or match this accuracy baseline in at least prone unsupported and the others if you become really good.

Now,...you take this fun and cheap marksmanship lesson you've taught yourself with your cheap rifle and it's so-so trigger, and when it's applied to anywhere it matters in regards to a rifle's requirement, be it competition, big game hunting, plinking can's or varmitting,....you will be much impressed with your newly found skill. You may even ask yourself, "wow,... where did that come from", when you drop that lovely buck from the shoulder at 250 yds,...and then you'll remember all the hot sticky days at the range and the dust and powder residue over your sweaty face from your NorkM14 and the chineseNATO:cool:ammo,..and you'll just have to smile to yourself????
 
Barney is the voice of reason when it comes to this rifle.

Everything he says comes from a world of hands on experience.

Keep on rockin' (and talkin') fella! We're listening :rockOn:
 
RememberTheSomme said:
Let's not turn this fine Nork accuracy potential thread of Hungry's into a Springer versus Nork debate. It gets very old quickly and I'm one that can ride that horse as far as anyone.

Barney has condensed the out of box nork accuracy potential nicely. I've owned one for about 5 years now and have put a fair number of rounds down range.

I think the NorincoM14 should be viewed the same way the SKS is viewed. It's a great platform for us to learn to shoot a full powered semi-auto battle rifle with. Nothing more nothing less.

If people spent more time and money on ammo and range time than DIY or gumsmith upgrades, they'd be alot happier with themselves and their M14! When you can outshoot my Nork M-14(2.5MOAish surplus ball) in all positions unsupported, I'd say now it's time for accuracy upgrade grasshopper.
If you use your M-14 to compete, that's a totally different need and anything you can afford to do, do it so as not to fail because of your equipments capabilities.

Most of the Norinco's however, maybe 95%,... I'm guessing are fired casually at everything from pop cans on a 25 meter backstop to water jugs layed out 600 meters away in the snow:cool:(they are pretty safe there;);)......)

Buy your Nork, learn how to operate it properly. Then pound the guts out of it just like an SKS with cheap corrosive ammo would be fired, but remember attention to detail with your marksmanship.
What other two platforms (NorkM14&SKS)I ask anyone on this board,..were a match made in heaven for a man or woman or child to cheaply and enjoyably learn how to shoot a GD centerfire rifle properly?????

I see lot's of posers with their SKS or AR-15 or M14 blasting away huge quantities of ammo into the 50 or 100 meter backstops with nary a concern with marksmanship perfecting and I have to ask..... What's a rifle for Really????,..what's a rifle for??? To merely hit things I can throw a rock at with a similar probability of a hit minus the loud noise of course??

To make a short story long:p...... master the iron sights with cheapo ammo,...quantify the rifles inherent accuracy on a bench with well placed rounds to give yourself a baseline to match,..and then fire round after round after round till you come close to or match this accuracy baseline in at least prone unsupported and the others if you become really good.

Now,...you take this fun and cheap marksmanship lesson you've taught yourself with your cheap rifle and it's so-so trigger, and when it's applied to anywhere it matters in regards to a rifle's requirement, be it competition, big game hunting, plinking can's or varmitting,....you will be much impressed with your newly found skill. You may even ask yourself, "wow,... where did that come from", when you drop that lovely buck from the shoulder at 250 yds,...and then you'll remember all the hot sticky days at the range and the dust and powder residue over your sweaty face from your NorkM14 and the chineseNATO:cool:ammo,..and you'll just have to smile to yourself????
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$250 for a Swiss K-31 or $300 for a M96 Swede gives you a high quality firearm to master your skills with. And the guys that shoot pop cans and water bottles are the ones that the club members end up cleaning up after.
 
Squinty said:
My eyes are wide open and that's why I would not spend $3500 on a rifle with a cast receiver.

I might spend $300 for such a thing, but unless I find myself with Alzheimer's or some other form of dementia, I will not pay for a Cadillac and get a Lada.

Having wide open eyes is why I usually spend about $1500 building a Garand using a forged Beretta or Breda receiver and a Krieger barrel.
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That's your call. My 1988 vintage Super has a GI bolt, op rod, unitized gas system, trigger group complete with McMillan glass stock and Hart barrel. It's a damn nice M1A. My standard has GI barrel, op rod and trigger parts. You can have neither for $300.

Being a forging/clone snob plunk down the money you claim not to be short of and get an LRB with chromed criterion barrel and forged receiver. Better still buy GI bolt, trigger group, gas system, op rod, flash hider, walnut stock and assemble it on an LRB. You'll be the toast of the town.
 
I bought my M14S Norinco from a buddy of mine over a year ago because it looked like a cool rifle.... and I didn't have a "Battle rifle" so I thought for the price I would buy it to see what it was all about. Figured my Enfields and AR were fun so why not?
Damn thing has been so much fun that the addiction became so bad I bought the M1A this spring so I could shoot twice as much with 2 guns to shoot!!!!
After shooting both rifles extensively over the last year I think the only way to get the desired accuracy (for me) from the Norinco is if I rebarrel it with a medium wieght barrel. I get that the factory rifle leaves (a little if youre lucky, or a lot if you aren't) to be desired in the QC department but for the cost it's not surprising.
Reading Barneys OP though I'm not sure that he would agree with my idea but being an old farm boy I just can't resist finding out what lipstick on a pig would look like:d:d

As Barney said "PS: I shoot an M1A" too!
Rodney
 
Didn't get to shoot mine but once to zero in a new scope. I bought a HiLux M1000 ART. Great scopes, around $500. I've tried a number of mounts. The best one on my rifle is a McCans Industries. Cant get them any more. Hopefully, next year will shoot her more.

Hey, Barney, how about an M14 day at Borden next year?
 
Seafury said:
$250 for a Swiss K-31 or $300 for a M96 Swede gives you a high quality firearm to master your skills with. And the guys that shoot pop cans and water bottles are the ones that the club members end up cleaning up after.
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One of the most accurate rifles I ever had was an M96 cavalry that, when degreased and cleaned up, was in pristine new condition. With handloads off the bench, it literally put three rounds into the same hole.
 
Winston1984 said:
Thanks for the tip on the bolt source. I had looked at their website in the past but didn't notice that part. Seems like you got it in to Canada just fine. Did you lap it in yourself or did you send it to someone to do it? I'm also in Ontario and have been looking for a bolt swap...

Cheers
WS
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I bought the bolt 2 years ago. Don't think they will ship complete bolts anymore. I got lucky and didn't have to do any lapping. Everything just went together well and both lugs contacted properly. Had the rifle out today for the first time in months. After the usual first shot flyer 2" left, the next 7 went into 1.3" at 100 yds. Stock is an unbedded USGI fiberglass, so that may account for the cold bore flyer. Doesn't bother me enough to throw any more time or money at it.
 
Seafury said:
That's your call. My 1988 vintage Super has a GI bolt, op rod, unitized gas system, trigger group complete with McMillan glass stock and Hart barrel. It's a damn nice M1A. My standard has GI barrel, op rod and trigger parts. You can have neither for $300.

Being a forging/clone snob plunk down the money you claim not to be short of and get an LRB with chromed criterion barrel and forged receiver. Better still buy GI bolt, trigger group, gas system, op rod, flash hider, walnut stock and assemble it on an LRB. You'll be the toast of the town.
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Your two rifles have some nice parts. If you replace those crappy cast receivers you might have some nice rifles.
 
snowman48 said:
And you worn out how many m1a receivers
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It is about getting a quality part for one's hard earned money. I saw a Springfield Armory rifle at P&D Enterprises. It had a cheap stock made of recycled toothbrush handles. It also had a cast receiver. These may be admirable qualities, at least to you.

But such cheapjack shortcuts are not worth $2000. It's an outrage. And people like you are to blame. You are willing to hand over large sums of money for dreck.

For $2000, you should expect a proper forged receiver and a quality firearm.

I said it before and I will say it again. I can build a forged steel Garand with new parts for $1500. Why would I want to spend $500 more and get less?
 
I have an m1 garand nice rifle, I like both my m305 and m1a, if you don't own both than you can't compare, if you don't like the m1a than don't buy one but don't condemn people who do own them.
 
snowman48 said:
I have an m1 garand nice rifle, I like both my m305 and m1a, if you don't own both than you can't compare, if you don't like the m1a than don't buy one but don't condemn people who do own them.
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I don't need to buy a Springfield in order to compare it with a Norinco. I have six real Garands, and I know what a quality Garand-type rifle is all about. Anyway, the Springfield is not a bad rifle, but it is not worth the price.

It just angers me when gun manufacturers charge a premium price for a cheapened product. And the reason why this takes place is because the shooting public allows it.

For the price you paid, you deserved to get a forged receiver.
 
Squinty said:
I don't need to buy a Springfield in order to compare it with a Norinco. I have six real Garands, and I know what a quality Garand-type rifle is all about. Anyway, the Springfield is not a bad rifle, but it is not worth the price.

It just angers me when gun manufacturers charge a premium price for a cheapened product. And the reason why this takes place is because the shooting public allows it.

For the price you paid, you deserved to get a forged receiver.
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While the M14 was still dominating NM service rifle matches in the US I'd wager a bet the majority of those rifles were built on dreck receivers (like that word). Anyway you can order up a nice LRB and get closest to milspec there is. And there isn't one M1A owner here that will say that you were a fool for paying almost double. In fact I'd applaud you and envy you at the same time while softly saying to myself "that guy don't screw around".
 
Seafury said:
While the M14 was still dominating NM service rifle matches in the US I'd wager a bet the majority of those rifles were built on dreck receivers (like that word). Anyway you can order up a nice LRB and get closest to milspec there is. And there isn't one M1A owner here that will say that you were a fool for paying almost double. In fact I'd applaud you and envy you at the same time while softly saying to myself "that guy don't screw around".
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Is anyone importing LRBs into Canada?
 
Dreck is the new black. Dreck rifles, I like it.
I'm happy to have paid a good amount of money for my NM and SM M1a's. Then I can blame poor shots on the guy in the mirror, or selfie if you prefer. Please don't be grumpy, we didn't just tell SA to charge whatever they like. But in this market, you either pay the piper or the next guy will, and then you're stuck with whatever is left. That's not going to be me when i have no time for this tinkering. Respectfully.
 
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