Mossy MVP Vs. Remmy 700 (5.56/.223) which is better?

wayupnorth

wayupnorth

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was chatting with my dad last night.
we got on the topic of what the next gun/gun project we both had on the horizon.
he mentioned that he was looking at getting a .223 bolt rifle.
he wanted something a little more aggressive for gopher shooting and something with a little more 'umph' too it.
he has a smattering of 22's and 17HMR's and i guess he wants to go up another level.

couple years back he picked up a AR Varmint and loves that gun and would love to take it out gopher shooting but we all know that isnt going to happen. so he decided that he wants to pick up a bolt gun in 223/5.56 and use that.
i can see where the allure in what he is talking about.

so we discussed what he was looking for.
he had kind of settled on a Savage 223 that was very simular to his 17HMR by Savage.
bull barrel, Boyd stock with the thumb-hole - im sure you all know the kind.
i suggested that he maybe look at the Mossberg MVP just for the simple fact that it takes the AR mags and he has 20-30 of those laying around already for his AR.
he said he would have a look at them when he had some down time.
he sent me a couple texts today when he had some down time, he asked what i thought was better - i guess he has left the Savage and the race is now between the Mossberg MVP and the Remington 700.

not having either gun all i could tell him was that the Remington was probably a better built gun and that the aftermarket stuff for the Remington would probably be better then the Mossberg as the 700 has been around for a while and is a widely used platform.
the Mossberg again all i could say was that it uses the AR mags.

so the question is out - you guys probably have one of both of these guns - so which one is better?
if you where to recommend one to a 70yr old retired fella who wants to use it as a gopher/coyote gun and probably some paper punching which route would you recommend?

pricing on them is similar.
here are the 2 he sent me that he was looking at;
(both are supporting companies of CGN so ill direct link them below)

Mossberg MVP Varmint 5.56 NATO (.223) $669.95

Remington Model 700 SPS Varmint .223 $690.00
 
The Remington is a 1 in 12 twist so he'll only be shooting bullets up to 60 gr. I have a friend who has the Mossberg and he seems to be happy with it. He hasn't shot it very much though. The Mossberg has a 1 in 9 twist so he can shoot up to Hornady 75 gr HPBT/Sierra 77 gr HPBT's. I've never owned a Mossberg, but I've had both Remington and Savage rifles in .223. All my Savage rifles shot better groups, but one is pretty much as good as the other.

The mag isn't a selling point to me...I usually end up single loading my Savage, to the point where I've made a single shot follower and my mag is in a food container in my range box.

If I had to choose it would be the 1 in 9 twist...but if you can get an SPS TAC for the same price I'd take that one instead (just because I have no experience with the Mossberg). You can also get a Savage Hog Hunter for under $600, 1 in 9 with Med weight barrel and iron sights.
 
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I have no experience with the Rem or Savage in 223 but I have a Moss MPV. I favor the 75gr Hornady Steel match ammo for stuff like coyote shooting. The 50gr bullets give me very good groups but the 75gr has much less wind drift in an open field than does the 50gr. On a 3 point rest at 100 yards either will give me a .5 moa group. Using a Harris bipod I get 1 inch groups at the same distance.
 
fiddler said:
On a 3 point rest at 100 yards either will give me a .5 moa group. Using a Harris bipod I get 1 inch groups at the same distance.
Click to expand...

Man did you get lucky...shoots 75 gr HPBT and 50 gr factory ammo in 1/2" groups at 100 yds, I'd be hanging on to that rifle.

If he'd be willing to spend a bit more Tikka Varmints can be had with a 1 in 8 twist barrel. I wouldn't bother with the 1 in 12 as mentioned in my last, but a 1 in 8 can shoot everything up to 80 gr HPBT's.
 
I think it is odd. THe Remington UMC 50 gr jacket hollow points gave me nice groups, but POI was up and to the left of the Horandy Steel Match 75gr. I had to make a choice of what shoots better in an open field so went with the 75gr.


Even more odd, the 55gr didn't groups as nice, regardless of six or eight different brands and bullets. For a 1 in 9 twist, I'm not sure what to make of it yet but it shoots well with what I need for coyotes.
 
I would go rem or savage. That's just my opinion. Rem has huge aftermarket support. Savage has out of the box accuracy, a great trigger and a better selection of twist rates. I like a 1-8" myself, but I shoot 75-82 gr bullets.
 
he had kind of settled on a Savage 223 that was very simular to his 17HMR by Savage.
bull barrel, Boyd stock with the thumb-hole - im sure you all know the kind
Click to expand...
.

I know EXACTLY what you mean :dancingbanana:

Started out as a Savage Hog Hunter, .223 from SFRC
and replaced the factory stock with a Boyds.

dvmMbhK.jpg
 
I wanted a .223 bolt action as I found I was wasting too much ammo with my AR and wanted to reach out past 100 yards gopher shooting with cheaper .223 ammo as my .308 was too much for varmints.

So had a chance to look at the Mossberg Patrol, Tikka T3, Rem 700, Savage AXIS, and a Vanguard.

I short listed down to the Mossberg and Savage due to the heavier barrels, back up sights, and cost.

Went back and forth between the 2 was leaning towards the Mossberg as I have spare pinned AR mags but at the end the Savage all metal sights, non sloppy bolt, and proven design won out.

I miss the mag option but have found that I just don't bang off the shots that require a mag change I take my time setting up shots to get the most out of the caliber and gun.

Anyways I used lead shot and expanding foam in the hollow stock and epoxied a rod in the fore end it is better balanced now and I paid 479.00 before the exchange rate hit.

Just waiting for my 50mm new scope as the 40mm is on my son's rifle now, I loved the trigger cranked it down to around 2.5 lbs the 1 in 9 twist works best with 75 grain Hornadys sure love showing off cloverleafs against more expensive rifles. :)

My budget build is less than 700.00 excluding glass, these bargain guns are tack drivers!


 
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The following is IMHO so take it with a grain of salt...

I had both a Savage Axis and MVP in .223. The Savage was just over MOA out the box, smooth action but I hated the plastic stock, non adjustable trigger and the plastic mag. Then went to the MVP Varmit . Again MOA out the gate. I found the wood stock decent and the adjustable trigger is a good thing. Downside was the action was very sloppy and I found that I perfer the blind mag for hunting. The giant AR mag digs into your shoulder while pushing bush, also the mag well is made of plastic.

Im now using a S1 Weatherby Vanguard .223 in Hogue Overmold stock now and I couldn't be happier. MOA out the gate, Smoooth action, and metal blind mag and trigger guard. I was so impressed with it I got a S2 in 7mm-08. Boyds makes stocks for them as well. I believe there in the same price range as both the Mossy and Savage. Go out and get some hands on time with all 3 and see what fits you the best.

Cheers,
J_K_S

The Bee's.
 
I agree on not caring much for the plastic mag well for the MPV. Its a bit sloppy and although it does take the 10 round pistol mags I really don't have a lot of use for large mags while coyote hunting. I would rather find one that fits almost flush so it doesn't dig into your back when slung. Large mags are ok for at the range but defeats the purpose when looking for cold shot accuracy.

When I say my groups are as good as .5 MOA, that would be my best groups, though I shoot consistently one inch or less on a 3 point rest. The 9 inch Harris bipod gives me good averages of about 1 inch or slightly larger at 100 yards. After a thousand rounds the bolt is still tight and smooth. The stock is very comfortable for prone and table shots but feels less natural for shoulder shots and weighs about 11 pounds with the bipod unloaded. I usually don't carry the rifle too far. Just quad or sled to my spot for set-up.

Quick note on the Hornady 75gr steel match ammo, its very effective on coyotes and the bullet drops them fast and rarely has anything come through the other side or damage fur. Even shots through a 3/8 inch plywood the bullets completely disintegrate and can find small lead and copper shrapnel on top of the fresh snow.

Sorry for the grainy shot.


 
They are both mediocre at best.
The Mossy almost has a fast enough barrel twist rate at least. That's almost but not really. The remmy twist rate is way too slow. It's just old school short range only.

As far as accuracy goes, the Mossy is not accurate for nuthin. Even if you get lucky with a good Remmy, there's no payoff at long range because the barrel cant handle long range bullets.

For a reasonably priced rifle look at the Savage FTR stuff. They are hands down more accurate and truly effective for long range shooting, and has the right twist rate. If you cant afford it, wait till you can.

If you want a great rifle, then take a real good look at Sako, not Tika - Sako 85 Varmint or Varmint Stainless. You will get the fast 8 inch twist and the rifles I have fired are 1/2 MOA. You will not find a better or more accurate rifle for the money. I have never heard of an unsatisfied Sako owner. Again, if you cant afford it, wait till you can.

http://www.sako.fi/rifles/sako-85/85-varmint-stainless
 
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BadAsMo said:
They are both mediocre at best.
The Mossy almost has a fast enough barrel twist rate at least. That's almost. The remmy is way too slow. It's just old school short range only.

As far as accuracy goes, the Mossy is not accurate for nuthin.

For a reasonably priced rifle look at the Savage FTR stuff. They are hands down more accurate and truly effective for long range shooting, and has the right twist rate. If you cant afford it, wait till you can.

If you want a great rifle, then take a real good look at Sako, not Tika - Sako. You will get the fast 8 inch twist and the rifles I have fired are 1/2 MOA.
Click to expand...

Funny my mvp does sub MOA. My best group with 75 gr hornady is .350"

Two friends that have the varmint model also claim great accuracy.
 
I would look at the rugger heavy barrel mod 77 ,to me it is just a way better built gun also looks much better then the others you are looking at and price point is not to far off ,rugger makes a heck of a rifle ,Dutch
 
Either you got waaaay waaaay lucky or you are claiming your best ever 3 shot group, certainly not your average or even worst.
Let's do the math for a sec...
$500 rifle and .75 moa... a 4 year old would know that's a long shot.

I've been side by side with the mossy more than once and none that I have seen could claim 2 MOA with a straight face.
 
All groups have been 5 shots, nice, tight 5 hole clusters. I've got approx. 200 to 250 rounds through it now. Paid 500 for it new, including shipping. Yes I'm very happy. Believe.
 
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