Mountain Rifle with Grizzly capability..your thoughts?

[bcsteve]

Am I the only one who's noticed that one of sheephunter's sponsor's on his show sells..............


Bear spray!

Good thing the thread wasn't optic related, we'd be hearing how Zeiss is the end all to mountain scopes.

Sheephunter's show!?! I must be out of the loop? What's his show?

 

[Bigfoot 870]

These are more or less all in the same class at 100 yards, but shoot that same grizz at that range with a 9.3 X 62, a .375 H&H or Ruger, and better yet, a .45-70 with good bullets and you've got a dead bear at 100 yards. I hunt blacks every year and don't trust any of 'em... nor do I trust spray! My longtime partner is a retired CO, but while still a CO he was carrying bear spray on his belt. I had a can in the back pocket of my jeans. We were putting in bait for when the season opened. Bears were attending. He looked at my can (Canadian Tire Special!) and said he'd NEVER use it! I asked what was in his - he wouldn't tell me but said it was special issue for the CO's and was 10X more powerful than what I was putting some confidence in! I've never carried it since! But ALWAYS a medium to big-bore rifle or a 12-gauge with slugs.



As a mountain rifle, I'd choose what I mostly now carry... that being my T3 Lite in 9.3 X 62. Using a 250gr AccuBond or 286 Partition, it's plenty for anything in North America at any reasonable range. Weighing just 7.6 lbs fully loaded with scope and sling, it's a delight to tote all day long. The trajectory is like a 180gr load in a .30-06. WHY IS "EVERYONE" SO SENSITIVE OVER RECOIL THAT'S NO MORE, AND OFTEN LESS THAN, A 12-GAUGE SLUG LOAD? We accept it in our shotguns and groan, moan and sputter over recoil that's about the same in rifles!!!???

My advise? GET OVER IT! You won't die! But you might if unwilling to learn to shoot a rifle suited to bear country!


Bob

www.bigbores.ca

 

[Boomer]

Last 2 bear courses I took had the video of the hippies encountering a bear. " go away bear!" Sadly, no spray or shooting in those courses. All the hunters in the class were laughing.

Boomer- Squatting is often faster to acquire, more stable to shoot from as you can put your elbows on your knees, and it's quicker to rise to your feet. Although due to terrain, kneeling or done funny form of kneeling is often required.

Rice paddy prone will produce the desired effect, and seems to be at its best with a pistol grip equipped rifle or shotgun. But its not for me as I don't find it particularly stable compared to kneeling with the arm supported on the knee, and unsupported its wobbly and makes it impossible to handle significant recoil. While it might be faster to acquire and recover from than kneeling, its not by much. But in a situation where dropping the body to a low position in order to lower the trajectory of the bullet, rather than to gain stability, it might be prudent under some circumstances not to support the position. Think of it as an off hand shot from kneeling, or squatting if you prefer. Such a position provides the shooter with a greater range of motion should his shot need to be elevated or depressed due to terrain, and allows him to track left or right should the target veer off at close range.

 

[bigborefan]

I've PERSONALLY known 2 (TWO)!!!!! people who were mauled and KILLED by bears, so your stats mean diddly squat to me. I won't be a third. Just in case you were wondering who they were , A young boy (17) Kyle Harry , who I worked with his mom, and Mary Beth Miller, who I work with her sister. Totally unrelated to each other, but nonetheless, my story is one of BEING CAREFUL, and never be in the wilderness without a GUN.

Amen to that!

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

 

[joe.danay]

But the words "grizzly bear" were mentioned. This is CGN. Act accordingly .

OK, can I shoot .223 out of it?

 

[pisces-guy]

I'd take your 7mm Rem Mag and put it into a nice light Bell & Carlson Medalist or equivalent synthetic stock. Light rings and scope, and maybe skeletonize your bolt, etc.. That caliber makes a nice flat shooting, but not nasty recoiling, mountain rifle in a light stock with some tweaks. If it has
a 24" barrel you might want to shorten it to about 21" to reduce weight as well. Now a gun for grizzly starts with the .338s, and a nice rifle is the Ruger in .375 Ruger. You don't want a light grizzly rifle, the recoil will make it unpleasant to shoot for most folks. Get a solid rifle with some heft, and if you find you're flinching, then have a gunsmith put a good muzzle brake on the rifle. Better to have a loud rifle than to flinch and miss a grizzly that's coming towards you. Two different missions...two different rifles...but your 7mm RM with heavier Barnes TTSX ammo will deal with a grizzly if you come across one when you're mainly after other game.

 

[norskie]

These are more or less all in the same class at 100 yards, but shoot that same grizz at that range with a 9.3 X 62, a .375 H&H or Ruger, and better yet, a .45-70 with good bullets and you've got a dead bear at 100 yards. I hunt blacks every year and don't trust any of 'em... nor do I trust spray! My longtime partner is a retired CO, but while still a CO he was carrying bear spray on his belt. I had a can in the back pocket of my jeans. We were putting in bait for when the season opened. Bears were attending. He looked at my can (Canadian Tire Special!) and said he'd NEVER use it! I asked what was in his - he wouldn't tell me but said it was special issue for the CO's and was 10X more powerful than what I was putting some confidence in! I've never carried it since! But ALWAYS a medium to big-bore rifle or a 12-gauge with slugs.

As a mountain rifle, I'd choose what I mostly now carry... that being my T3 Lite in 9.3 X 62. Using a 250gr AccuBond or 286 Partition, it's plenty for anything in North America at any reasonable range. Weighing just 7.6 lbs fully loaded with scope and sling, it's a delight to tote all day long. The trajectory is like a 180gr load in a .30-06. WHY IS "EVERYONE" SO SENSITIVE OVER RECOIL THAT'S NO MORE, AND OFTEN LESS THAN, A 12-GAUGE SLUG LOAD? We accept it in our shotguns and groan, moan and sputter over recoil that's about the same in rifles!!!???

My advise? GET OVER IT! You won't die! But you might if unwilling to learn to shoot a rifle suited to bear country!

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

The big bores work - but the original poster asked about a mountain rifle for sheep that would work.
I agree on the good bullets.

My dedicated sheep rifle is a original Rem Ti in 7-08. It weighs under 6lbs loaded, and I will likely shave a few more oz with a new ultralight scope. I carry a few 175 grain "heavy" loads to have in the tent/around camp - and load 120grain Barnes ttsx loaded to 3100 fps.
I shoot this rifle a lot - and it is easy to shoot. I have taken a Ram at a lasered 368 yards with this rig - it shoots plenty flat. I hunt sheep, but would not hesitate to dispatch a Grizz if I needed with it.

How many Grizzly have you shot? I have only killed the one - but my guess is any calibre that would penetrate the off side would have had the exact same results. And my guess is a 270 with a good 150 grain bullet would have done it.

As for Black bear - I have only shot 3 - including a couple over 6 ft. One was with a 7 mag at about 13 steps charging into camp, one at a couple hundred with a 25-06 and last year one at 100 yards with a 264. All were relatively easy to kill.
The largest was the one at 13 steps - as he was coming into our camp with his jaws popping. He had been in our camp while we were out hunting, but decided to claim a cooler he had scattered about when we returned. A 150 grain Partition flattened him. I am guessing he was around 400lbs.

So if you really need the large bore for your comfort level that is fine. I am pretty comfortable using what works for me.

 

[norskie]

Maybe time for a Jersey cow defense thread.

LOL

Likely need a proprietary new calibre. Something that will anchor them on the spot - have to watch those pointy horns, and they trick you with the big eyelashes.

 

[mrak]

It is just a bear what ever I can not belive all the fear around this bear maybe you guys should get some pampers so if you get poopy pants it is easy to clean up
ARE YOU KIDDING ME

 

[pisces-guy]

Well an aggressive big grizzly is a totally different animal compared to a black bear...think tank versus jeep. When I'm hunting moose in northern BC in grizz country, I bring my 30.06 with 168 grain TTSX ammo. It's great for a big moose and would penetrate well if I had to defend myself against a grizzly. In the south for deer where it's just blackies, I carry a .270 with 140 grain Accubonds, and I've never run into a bold one. I have had a couple of bold grizzlies wandering in my direction...one changed his mind and one I persuaded to leave me in peace with a bullet over his head. In Kitimat the year before we left, I was in Grade 2 and a grizzly came onto the grounds when I was in school. The RCMP officer shot it five times, beginning 100 yards away, and it charged up to only ten yards from him before it died...tough animals. Norskie, you have fun with your 7mm-08, which is a fine ungulate rifle, for sure...but if I was actually hunting grizzly on purpose I'd take a .375 Ruger at least.

 

[norskie]

Well an aggressive big grizzly is a totally different animal compared to a black bear...think tank versus jeep. When I'm hunting moose in northern BC in grizz country, I bring my 30.06 with 168 grain TTSX ammo. It's great for a big moose and would penetrate well if I had to defend myself against a grizzly. In the south for deer where it's just blackies, I carry a .270 with 140 grain Accubonds, and I've never run into a bold one. I have had a couple of bold grizzlies wandering in my direction...one changed his mind and one I persuaded to leave me in peace with a bullet over his head. In Kitimat the year before we left, I was in Grade 2 and a grizzly came onto the grounds when I was in school. The RCMP officer shot it five times, beginning 100 yards away, and it charged up to only ten yards from him before it died...tough animals. Norskie, you have fun with your 7mm-08, which is a fine ungulate rifle, for sure...but if I was actually hunting grizzly on purpose I'd take a .375 Ruger at least.

Never said I was hunting Grizz with it - but that if I ran into one while hunting sheep I am not scared.
Especially don't see the difference between a 175 grain tsx (camp load) out of the 7-08 and a 168ttsx out of your 30-06...

 

[Boomer]

It is just a bear what ever I can not belive all the fear around this bear maybe you guys should get some pampers so if you get poopy pants it is easy to clean up
ARE YOU KIDDING ME

Comments like this kinds of reminds me of a fellow who was up here a while back who wanted to see some bears up close and talked like he wasn't the least bit timid around them. I told him I knew where we could get close to one if he was interested, and he said he was game. So one evening we head out on this spit of land that extends a mile or so out into Hudson Bay. There's not one bear, there's two good sized males, and they're wrestling around in the water having a good time, so we had the opportunity get stay out of sight on the east side below their line of sight, and sneak up pretty close for some good pics without them taking much notice of us. We still weren't that close, perhaps 50 yards, and these guys come galloping out of the water and up onto the high ground, the photos were going to be fantastic. They were inside 25 yards now, and I was just going to stand up to let them see me, so they'd know we were there when, "Hey, where's Brian?" My wife and I look behind us, and he's long legging it back to the Jeep. He didn't think we needed to carry a gun either, but when I said close he had no idea that it would be so faro outside of his comfort level. The moral of the story is that the presence of a firearm provides us the confidence required to exploit those opportunities that would otherwise elude us.

 

[joe.danay]

It is just a bear what ever I can not belive all the fear around this bear maybe you guys should get some pampers so if you get poopy pants it is easy to clean up
ARE YOU KIDDING ME

A grizzly charging a hunter is like an asteroid flying at the Earth. What's all the fear? It's just a chunk of rock! Sorry, but grizzly bears in the wild don't act like they do in the Disney cartoons. I had a customer at Wholesale show me pictures on his cel phone of his friend, whom was mauled by a grizzly. Two weeks later the same pictures were in the Alberta Outdoorsman magazine. What was the customers purpose? Buying a 12 gauge.

There are a few grizzlies in the Wildhorse Recreational Area, one of which took a swipe at a CO's truck and mangled the steel box. If you want to brawl with something that can take down a horse with one swipe, be my guest. Saying people need pampers because they fear grizzlies? There's a fine line between brave and stupid. People who "fear grizzlies" have an inherent respect for the fact that we are NOT the top of the food chain when we leave city limits.

 

[track]

Me and my trusty steed, Jack. The ridge behind us and the one's beyond is 100% grizzly country. Eight years straight of professional guiding(many other years solo) we ran into grizzlies, SANS firearm and never had a problem. If your afraid of the wilderness in any shape or form, stay home!

 

[MiG25]

It is just a bear what ever I can not belive all the fear around this bear maybe you guys should get some pampers so if you get poopy pants it is easy to clean up
ARE YOU KIDDING ME

No "Dinner Bell Bears" on Vancouver Island.

 

[Gatehouse]

Some places in BC I felt a but undergunned with my 375 H&H. Not all. " grizzly country" is the same.

 

[elker]

Me and my trusty steed, Jack. The ridge behind us and the one's beyond is 100% grizzly country. Eight years straight of professional guiding(many other years solo) we ran into grizzlies, SANS firearm and never had a problem. If your afraid of the wilderness in any shape or form, stay home!

So neither you or the guided hunter did have a firearm?
Were you bow hunting?
Your story is ridiculous

 

[Sun_and_Steel_77]

Me and my trusty steed, Jack. The ridge behind us and the one's beyond is 100% grizzly country. Eight years straight of professional guiding(many other years solo) we ran into grizzlies, SANS firearm and never had a problem. If your afraid of the wilderness in any shape or form, stay home!

The OP asked for info about a "mountain rifle".
I don't see a mountain or a gun in your pic, but hey thanks for the sage advice. I've had my good share of "scares" in the wilderness, guess I'll stay home and live vicariosly through the fearless men amongst men here on CGN!

 

[bigborefan]

Some places in BC I felt a but undergunned with my 375 H&H. Not all. " grizzly country" is the same.

And, evidently, not all "black bear" country is the same either!

It appears that several comments on this thread where made by those who didn't read all of it! It's been pointed out by a few that blacks are more treacherous than grizzly! I've never faced a grizzly, but where I've been hunting blacks for the past four seasons there's a 400+ lb black bear that's "around" most of the time. He's been sighted a few times but we know he's there because of his "signature" -- he lifts 40 lbs of bait from a barrel without tipping it, claw marks and scat. I can smell him by times without sighting him. It's thick bush and 3-ft tall grass. He also killed a horse on that property three years ago. The property owner want's him gone!

In late spring/early summer, I'll be scouting that property for signs and best locations for an ambush. AND I'LL BE TOTING MY 9.3 x 62 OR A .45-70!!!!

And, I'll not be afraid! But I wouldn't go there in harms way without a "stopping rifle"!

Not far from here, where I do a lot of hunting, a few years ago a hunter was putting in a food plot, in a wooded area, for deer. He was attacked by an estimated 350 lb bl. bear. He climbed a tree and the bear pulled him down and started to eat him starting with his legs. He passed out. Sometime later he regained consciousness and the bear was gone! He doesn't know why, but was rescued and spent months in rehab. He will never walk the same again.

People who make stupid statements about bear behavior haven't a clue what they may have to face if they venture where bears live with the attitude that they are smarter than the bears!

Edited to add that the above mentioned private property that I've hunted, and will hunt again, borders on a vast wilderness.

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

 

[Ltbull01]

Mountain griz don't usually get too big. A 7RM or a 300mag is a good way to go. A Tikka T3 Lite is light and accurate. You could look at a 160 grain premium bullet for a 7mag and go with a 175/180 grain premium for a 300 mag. If you want an in-their-tracks-'stopper', then look at a 338 mag (maybe even too light) and bigger, which means gun weight. But, then you need to think about primary use as a deer, sheep, goat gun. I think a 7mag or 300mag is a good compromise and is adequate for mountain griz. I'd probably lean toward something like a 300 WSM...