My SLR is a piece of S#!T
- Thread starter jiffx2781
- Start date
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alberta tactical rifle
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- calgary alberta
How about you leave us out of this squabble? I don't post about your business and I would ask you refrain from posting about mine. Some professionalism would be nice.
That's ok, a little birdie just told me about certain affiliations and employment connections, I understand now.
Relax, you'll still make money off this venture.
Sorry that I expect a company to deliver what they promised, close to the time they estimated. I know, I'm an A-hole.
I'll do my best to stay out of these threads till after I help a buddy assemble his when it arrives. Just be warned, once I've got hands on experience with one I'll share my opinion, good or bad.
You know I can't shut up, something will make me post again
Oh ya, who's ripping who off? Well, even though I'm not ordering until it actually has a NR FRT (I have lots of NR toys so no rush) I know exactly what to expect from a product I buy from ATRS, people talk shart about Rick but regardless of any of that his shop puts out quality products and serves their customers to levels I normally reserve for places like Wolverine Supplies.
Last time I was in CSC I got some of the worst service I've ever had (rivalling WSS gun counter in the later years), it took getting shuffled off to a third guy before finding a parts kit from RWA for the AR180. Turns out it was not what I was looking to drop $200 on and insted was pretty much just a kit to complete a NoDak lower, which is fine just not what I was looking to buy.
Anyway, aren't there rules about business affiliations working together on here to promote stuff? Think NEA guys got banned for that way back?
Wow, your little bird must have better reading comprehension skills than you. We posted numerous times in the various SLR threads that our gunsmith was involved in the prototyping stages of SLR development. He has had nothing to do with the MDI for over 6 months now. If that big reveal was supposed to make us out to be super villains or something, it fell short. We have also stated several times why we are in this thread. The OP claimed we were lying when we posted (in another thread) that we assembled several guns without issue. Please go back and re read this thread to confirm.
This thread has become a CGN classic gong show because of the repeated tin foil hat posts being made by various anonymous posters.
We don't have any issues with ATRS nor to our knowledge do they have issues with us. We brought them up solely to compare the attitude of owners when a problem presents itself. Please re read our posts if you can't understand what we just posted.
AB blaster is not Wyatt. Nor is he affiliated in anyway with MDI, his participation is no more suspicious that your own ATRS love affair.
We are in no way affiliated with MDI other than they operate out of this city. Anyone who thinks we are, has not spent any time reading through our SLR info thread.
Anonymous posters here claim we have not provided updates on pre orders. Yet for some reason they ignore a thread we started on just that. Then they claim "many" people had issues getting refunds, based on a couple individuals that started rant threads, but who in fact were not using our email to send requests. In every case they were resolved once they actually spoke to us.
One poster in the thread actually thinks we are TSE!
Your own story above seems similarly funny. You come to our store looking for something we apparently didn't have, but three staff tried to help you anyway. Only to confirm we didn't have what you were looking for. (We are sure there is more to it, and you likely have a legitimate beef, but please read what you wrote).
To get back to the topic though, these are builds. It is impossible for any manufacturer to anticipate every part available now or in the future. Part tolerances vary, especially with cheap Chinese made knock off parts. We have built quite a few AR rifles here over the years and there is no magic receiver that will accept everything. Furthermore, many builders have no idea what they are doing. The tight roll pin issue is a perfect example. Yes one guy managed to break a receiver. I have seen a few AR receivers similarly destroyed by the application of too much hammer. Some people feel the pin is too tight, yet we have seen about a dozen rifle builds so far, and the builder manged to get the parts together without breaking anything. Also there appears to be about 200 receiver sets out there (based on serial numbers), and so far no epidemic of breaking receivers. So, the pin is tight, but is it really too tight? By the way, we squeeze the pin in with a vice to avoid hammering things.
We have sold quite a few receivers now, and have yet to see any with anodizing as bad as the OP described. Maybe they are out there, but to suggest that all are crap is a bit of a stretch. Furthermore the OP suggested that 9/10 people who posted about their receivers were having issues. Even in this thread, that is not true.
Apologies. I guess I stand corrected.
The issue isn't starting the pin, it's that the hole size is small and/or the pin O.D is too big, which cracks the mount.
TNA seems to be handling the SLR situation a lot better than CSC . Providing customers answers and solutions and working with MDI to keep the customer happy . When the time comes I will purchase from them . Many people have read this thread and will probably come to the same conclusion. Good luck CSC . And Wyatt / Ab_blaster let people have there own opinions . No need to defend every little issue
I walked into the store, browsed through the bulk ammo on my way in and then asked the guy at the counter if you guys carried RWA products because I read on CGN that you were their retailer.
He had no clue and couldn't find anything in the computer. I was passed off to another guy who found something from RWA in the computer but didn't know where to look for it. Then the third guy was finally competent and went somewhere in the building and came back with a little box that was $200. It was the parts kit to assemble a 180 lower which is not what I was looking for.
It wasn't that they tried to help me anyway, your store did have the parts but the first two guys were not aware of them and didn't know where to start looking. The point wasn't that you didn't have what I was looking for, it's that your employees wasted close to an hour of my day just to finally find what I came looking for which unfortunately turned out to have a lot of parts I didn't need and I wasn't willing to pay $200 for.
I also spent close to 20 minutes at the pistol counter before someone finally came by and asked if I needed assistance then told me he'd have someone come over right away, I walked away after another 5 minute wait with no help.
The service that day was what I would consider terrible which is unfortunate because your shop is typically one of my pit-stops whenever I'm in Calgary.
The attitude of owners when problems present themselves on ATRS products is no different, they took a lot a heat when guys were having problems with the Modern Hunter, I also pointed out deficiencies I found after shooting three of them but instead of lashing back and trying to drag others down or name calling ATRS simply made changes to all rifles point forward and told people that if they contact the shop and explain the issues they would either walk them through a fix or if they sent the rifle back they would repair it and update it to the most modern revision for free.
They didn't hide or ignore their customers, they didn't blame the customers for the problems.
There is no love affair with ATRS, I just respect them for standing solidly behind their products and offering to repair any defects for free.
Rick even told me about one receiver that was brought back in that was ruined from the owner trying to remove the trigger (even though they told people not to) and Rick replaced it for free even though it was 100% owner error.
I love ATRS the same as I love Wolverine Supplies, it's respect not love, treat your customers well and they'll treat you well.
Well it is off topic, but I apologize for this and hope we can do better in the future. ( I knew there had to be more)
Also, it seems that a large number of people are taking my comments as lashing out and trying to drag others down. I also apologize to those that see them that way. I am ONLY trying to draw attention to the reactions of the customers being different and suggesting that those with problems should try to allow MDI to make things right. If MDI can't or won't help, then everyone should feel free to dump on them.
Like I said in my first post in this thread, I agree with you that anyone with issues should be contacting MDI and telling them about the problems they are having and ask for a solution. They can't fix it if they don't know about it. I like to consider it holding them accountable to deliver the product they told people they would be producing. I also don't think there is anything wrong with coming on the forum and venting a person's frustration over receiving their receivers and having parts not fit. If MDI or yourself don't like that then don't sell sub standard products that should have been tagged and removed before being boxed up and shipped to customers. You said it yourself earlier that it was a known issue and that it was supposedly fixed but that's obviously not the case if guys are still getting them in the mail with bad anodizing and tight holes. When assembling the rifle I wouldn't want to need to remove material, the surface is hard anodized, once you cut that to make parts fit it will wear faster than it should and eventually those tight holes will be loose holes.
The customer should not need to drill out holes to make standard AR parts fit. You can imply that they are using cheap Chinese parts but I think that those people are few and far between and I really doubt that is the case with the OP's rifle.
OkayShooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
Channel lock pliers with the teeth ground flat and some tape. Simple.
Knipex makes a channnel lock type plier called the plier-wrench I think, they are flat and the jaws move similar to an adjustable wrench. They have incredible leverage, and are lifetime warranty. If you don’t have a set check them out. Saw them at Home Depot the other day for around $60. I have had them for years, I think the one set has been warrantied 3 or 4 times, and not due to the tools fault, oh yeah lifetime warranty too. Anyways for pushing in pins, crushing, flattening cotter pins, or as a wrench they are great, can’t live without them. For this application they would be ideal... well I think so, someday I’m supposed to get a set to put together. Just remember if you get a set think pipe wrench, they work if you pull the other way but pulling towards the jaw side they have busted loose bolts that were spreading my snap on wrenches. Now back to your regularly scheduled programming View attachment 200538
If your bolt catch Roll pin is over or under 0.103-0.099in it is out of spec
If your Bolt catch pin hole is over or under 0.097-0.094in it is out of spec.
Machinist Hand book
Yeah, they need to adjust tolerance to suit the Anodizing process, 0.0005 to 0.002in surface growth for Type3, holes can shrink a lot. Until they find that sweet spot, some fine reworking may be necessary at the factory.
WHy the hell would they have to STRIP and re anodize the whole part and risk messing up everthing else just to bring a pin hole back to size? Often its not removing anodize back to bare metal. If done right, not even noticeable. Your comment is ridiculous and tells me you have no expericence doing this.
If your Bolt catch pin hole is over or under 0.097-0.094in it is out of spec.
Machinist Hand book
Yeah, they need to adjust tolerance to suit the Anodizing process, 0.0005 to 0.002in surface growth for Type3, holes can shrink a lot. Until they find that sweet spot, some fine reworking may be necessary at the factory.
WHy the hell would they have to STRIP and re anodize the whole part and risk messing up everthing else just to bring a pin hole back to size? Often its not removing anodize back to bare metal. If done right, not even noticeable. Your comment is ridiculous and tells me you have no expericence doing this.
- Location
- Red Deer, Alberta
My bolt catch hole was undersize as well. A #42 drill bit wouldn't fit (0.0935"), so I tried a #43 (0.089"), it didn't fit either. A #44 drill bit (0.086") finally fit. So to say it was under way undersize is correct. For reference my Colt Canada & Aero precsion lowers that have not been assembled are #42 & #41 (0.096") fit and # 40 (0.098") doesn't.
If I was making parts that needed to be anodized and have a hole a certain diameter, I'd get a piece of the material I was using for the part, drill different size test holes (5 of each size), then get the part anodized to see where the diameters came out after anodizing. Then try installing 'in spec' roll pins and maybe try reaming the undersized holes.
If I was making parts that needed to be anodized and have a hole a certain diameter, I'd get a piece of the material I was using for the part, drill different size test holes (5 of each size), then get the part anodized to see where the diameters came out after anodizing. Then try installing 'in spec' roll pins and maybe try reaming the undersized holes.
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Those methods are only known by experienced machinists, these guys seem to be figuring it out as they go.
When are you in my neighborhood again? Let's do some more shooting, I've got a few more plates on my range now
- Location
- Red Deer, Alberta
Those methods are only known by experienced machinists, these guys seem to be figuring it out as they go.
When are you in my neighborhood again? Let's do some more shooting, I've got a few more plates on my range now
I'm only a first year Machinist apprentice. But I still know enough from other life experiences that no body cares what size the hole was prior to finishing, only after the finish / surface treatment is applied is what matters.
You realize that the SLR will accept most aftermarket triggers. Namely Geissele which are the best aftermarket triggers bar none. The use of trigger packs is a no go and was mentioned almost a year ago so it's no surprise. The mag issue is a tight mag well, some honest wear or some emery cloth should free up the mags to drop.
But the anti's are pu55ies and hide, I don't know who to fight with them.
This is just fun, I love all my gunnutz brothers. I hold no hard feelings toward anyone on here regardless of their comments, ok, almost no one, but I'd still stand side by side any man or woman on here to fight for our rights when it gets to that. We're like siblings, we argue but we're still family.
Yes, I'm having fun
Cheers to the bold!
I don't buy that excuse. You plainly attempted to out me with some so called information he received. Care to mention that or discuss in private?
Is that the same issue that I told the guy not to worry about? The guy was being paranoid over a perceived deficiency in the design, turns out it's not really worth worrying about after all.
How do I know it's out of spec? Because multiple people have reported them being very tight and CSC already said that MDI already replaced one receiver because the hole was so tight that the owner broke the receiver trying to assemble it. Fak dude, I've assembled NEA AR lowers that went together smoother it sounds like these do. I thought the advertising was for this to be a top quality receiver set. Bad anodizing and overly tight tolerances doesn't sound top quality to me.
Ya ya, they don't do the anodizing, I don't give a chit who did it. They paid someone to do it who happened to do a bad job and they sent them out to customers anyway.
My prediction, MDI will not be building any firearms parts within a year.
You say you have no investment in this project but there is no way that is possible considering how hard you argue to defend the product and the company. You and your pal that says you have nothing to do with the project have only been a member since January and March so how convenient is that? Who were you before you jumped onboard with these guys. Maybe an old banned member or a new MDI/CSC employee doing a little promotional work? Maybe you're just buddies with them, doesn't matter, you've got some sort of affiliation.
Again, sorry for expecting a company to deliver what they promised, I know, I'm a d!ck
CSC never said the broken receiver was out of spec, they said the guy broke it trying to install the pin. I saw that receiver first hand and it looked a lot like someone ham fisted it and split an ear. As CSC has pointed out as well as several others, there is no epidemic of broken receivers and many of us have had no issue assembling them. Again, if you're too imcompetent or inexperienced to assemble it then have a gunsmith do it.
The anodizing is NOT DONE by MDI. They absolutely should be inspecting the work before shipment but the poor finish is not their handy work. Stop associating the anodizing with a company that didn't do it.
You seem to know a lot but can't back any of it up with fact. I am not Wyatt, I do not work for nor have I ever worked for MDI. My buddy? You mean another forum member? Clearly there is some conspiracy here as two forum members appear to agree on something or have similar experiences.
Here's my connection to it all. I've known James from the CSC for a number of years. CSC is my "home" shop for gun stuff... That's it..Why? It doesn't seem to matter what they say or do it won't please anyone. And they seem to have a real fear of providing customer service as well.
Weird, it's like you've done it a few times and knew what to expect.
How does CSC address people online? Like adults asking childish ignorant questions? Here's a pro tip for all here, the customer is NOT always right. Kissing the a$$ of ignorant self entitled customers only leads to more of the same expecting even more in the future. Just my opinion from past experience.
They are the most difficult part to install. Not so bad when you apply your brain and plan it out but it is a stark contrast from the rest of the parts install.
Learn to read. I am not Wyatt and I am not affiliated with MDI. I'm not sure how CSC hasn't answered questions from customers. They inform us of what they know and have clearly stated that they are often without information as well. You're free to have an opinion but don't spout it like it's fact when it's not.
Drilling holes was a suggestion. Did you or anyone else ever think there might be other solutions to the problem, or perhaps take it to a gunsmith to solve. The SLR was not marketed as a DIY project for the novice/beginner. It is simply a receiver set to be completed.
That's my method of install. Works quite well but you have to be patient.
Are those specs for/from the AR15 TDP or just general rules for roll pin sizes? you're right I don't do anodizing or machining for a living. Should the holes need to be reamed enough to remove the finish you would need to re anodize. Perhaps someone(on their own) would ream them too large resulting in the same requirement.
Learn to read. I never said you SHOULD fire a round behind a squib. I said that it likely wouldn't cause a catastrophic failure. Big difference.
- Location
- Red Deer, Alberta
Yes those are the specs I have on my 'Department of Army US weapons command' M16a1 lower reciever drawing set. It is listed as 0.094" +0.003. It is supposed to be 0.094 with a + 0.003" tolerance. I'm sure Eugene Stoner just looked up the roll pin sizing in whatever version of the Machinist Handbook he had on hand.
Interesting and good to know! Thanks.
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